Popcorn ceiling

[VASandy]

I have a home improvement customer that has a popcorn ceiling that has to come out so the electrician can get into some wiring. What kinds of issues am I up against on this? The electrical is *probably* off at the box...we're pretty sure...although I'm going to use care when opening up the area. I'll use a hammer to open up most of it.

Basically, what I'm asking is are there any more dust issues with this kind of ceiling? Should I be using a better mask? All I have is the paper kind, but I could get a respirator type if it's necessary. Are there any tricks to this or is it a typical tear-out kind of project? The customer has agreed to redo the ceiling without the popcorn (thank you kindly customer!!), so I'll be removing all of this ceiling.

[garager]

Sandy are you saying all the popcorn is coming off, or all the drywall. If just the popcorn, use a 6" taper blade and scrape it off, then you'll have to sand it down, but do that after you taped up your hole that you made in the ceiling and your ready to sand down your mudding. Paper mask works for me, but the better the mask, you'll know that your lungs will be cleaner. I've tried wetting down the popcorn with a mist bottle to keep the dust down, but that just swirls the popcorn mud. Or if you can rent the Drywall vacuum sanding system your better off. I don't think theres really a trick to it, its elbow grease and the right tools for the job. You could try your osculating sander at slow speed and wet vac. attached and a drywall bag in your vac., I have burned up sanders doing this though, still gets into the sander pretty good. Link will show you what you need.

http://www.kingdrywall.com/?gclid=CPTsnLr_qYwCFT3gIgod6E6JJQ

[VASandy]

Thanks, Garager! Yeah, I've seen those drywall sander/vacs. Pretty nifty for the sanding part of the job!! I think what we're gonna do is take down all the drywall in this section. When I replace it, I'm not doing any popcorn finish! I'll probably have to figure out a transition between this part of the celing (entryway) and the living room celing that'll be popcorn still. It may work out that we take the popcorn finish off the living room, hard to say at this point.

[garager]

Fake beam possibly, if you can throw in a pic., might be able to give you good advice to bring the two rooms together.

[Dick L]

Popcorn ceilings made in the early/mid 70's sometimes contained asbestos. That is what we've got in our house. Living with it is easy, don't mess with it, add to the encapsulation by spray painting. Removal could be more (a lot?) difficult.

Suggest you get a small sample checked for asbestos before tearing it up.

An approved respirator and disposable suit would probably keep you safe, but the dust will be in the house and become a possible health problem for your customer.

Hopefully your popcorn is clean.

[wbrooks]

If the ceiling is coming down never mind taking off the popcorn. Just slit the tape at the ceiling/wall transition with a knife and use a drywall saw at the transition to the living room. You can use the saw to slice up the entry way into manageable pieces and pull them down. I would never do popcorn again, love the clean look of a flat finished ceiling

[VASandy]

Oh no....asbestos!!! Well, I should probably test for that. If it is...waaaaaaaaaaay beyond my skillset to deal with. I'll recommend to the customer to get it tested. I believe the ceiling was done in the 70's...hard to be sure. House was built in the '50's I think. If I can get in there and get some pics, I will.

[wwsmith]

I would definately test for the asbestos. We had the same problem in my last house. I wanted to remove it and we had a bit tested and came back positive. Ended up painting over it and calling it a day. Downside was we had to then give that info when we sold the house and it hurt us a lot and lost many potential buyers.... :(

[res057]

WW,
Just out of general curiosity, where would you send it to be tested?

[jbergstrom]

WW,
Just out of general curiosity, where would you send it to be tested?

Res, Sandy you can buy kits such as this one from Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Pro-Lab-Inc-Asbestos-Test/dp/B000DZDSII)

[garager]

Sorry Sandy, I didn't know about the asbestos. I guess my lungs will be shot:eek:.

[DavidRamey]

I grew up around asbestos, used asbestos in science and chemistry class, brakes on cars and trucks used to have asbestos linings, I spent 30 years blowing the asbestos dust from the brake drums. Asbestos is bad and damaging, but not to the extent that people believe now days. People seem to think that if you breathe a little asbestos dust you will die immeidately. I would not hesitate to buy a house that had asbestos in it and I would not be afraid to remove it myself.

[VASandy]

One way or the other, the ceiling has to come out. There's wires buried in there, and the electrician has to have access. I'll get the kit JBergstrom recommended and test the ceiling. If it is asbestos...well, we'll cross that bridge next. I'll have to pull in a sub to handle the removal I suppose.

[wwsmith]

WW,
Just out of general curiosity, where would you send it to be tested?

Sorry to say I have since lost the information I had. I got the info from a friend who is an electrician. It was done by Maricopa County there in Phoenix where we used to live. Also because we went with that method I noticed it was actually stamped on the documentation included with our deed when we sold it (or I assume?).

Either way my understanding is that the levels in a popcorn ceiling are normally low, I still wouldn't mess with it myself.

[RiR]

Hej Sandy! Like the guy's are saying, test for asbestos before you touch the thing. If it's asbestos, then its a big job regardless, with underpressure "Air-Care " equipment, and it doesn't matter what the local regs are, your lungs can't take it, but you'll know first in 10 years. Mesotheliom is a very nasty death, Please don't mess with it Sandy!
However, on a lighter note, if its plaster, and a lot of dust, then a respirator is better, - rule of thumb, - I can see a lot of dust coming off, = Respirator.
This can be helped considerably, by letting your industrial vac run continuously while working, but you still need the respirator.

[ToUtahNow]

I agree with the others to test for Asbestos before you touch the ceiling. I also agree it is not as bad as some may think. I started out in HVAC when we would wrap our ducts with Asbestos then use Asbestos tape and wheat paste to seal them. I cannot tell you how much of this stuff I coughed up but that was 35-years ago and no problems to date. Still I was involved in a case where a plumber repiped a home and cut the ceiling open with a Sawzall. When Asbestos was found after the job was done the plumber’s insurance got hit with a $20,000 clean up.

Mark

[Willyvictor]

I grew up around asbestos, used asbestos in science and chemistry class, brakes on cars and trucks used to have asbestos linings, I spent 30 years blowing the asbestos dust from the brake drums. Asbestos is bad and damaging, but not to the extent that people believe now days. People seem to think that if you breathe a little asbestos dust you will die immeidately. I would not hesitate to buy a house that had asbestos in it and I would not be afraid to remove it myself.

David I know several guys who died from asbestos exposure in their early forties, and they never smoked. It's nothing to fool aroud with.

Willy

[grumpynik]

I grew up around asbestos, used asbestos in science and chemistry class, brakes on cars and trucks used to have asbestos linings, I spent 30 years blowing the asbestos dust from the brake drums. Asbestos is bad and damaging, but not to the extent that people believe now days. People seem to think that if you breathe a little asbestos dust you will die immeidately. I would not hesitate to buy a house that had asbestos in it and I would not be afraid to remove it myself.

Not sure about other States, but in Maryland, only a licensed contractor for Asbestos removal can remove or do anything with Asbestos if found in a home. I went through this a number of times over the years.

No, you do not die right away, it takes anywhere from 15-20 years or more to develop sympstoms of Mesophelioma.

The area has to be sealed off, hosed down, ventilated with filters designed for Asbestos and then, only then can removal begin.
I used to do change outs of old furnaces and oil rigs, back in those days, Asbestos was commonly in use for insulation on the old girls and we always had to call in a specialist to remove the Asbestos first.

Worth all that hassle? I won't say yes, I won't say no. No one knows exactly how much exposure you need nor exactly what type, before the process of an incurable cancer starts.