Pro Plumbing Discussion

[plumbdog10]

What happened to the: Pro Plumbing Discussion Forum?

[Bob D.]

What do you mean Dog, isn't your Q 9this thread) posted in the Pro Plumbing Discussion forum? Was/Is there something else in the works?

[Josh]

Plumbdog... how do you envision the pro plumbing forum to be secured? I want to keep this as easy as possible for people to figure out. Right now I would say the vast majority of topics are pro plumbing in this forum. There are a few home owners every once in a while though.

If you can think of something that wouldn't exclude actual pro plumbers than I may try something for ya.

Josh

[plumbdog10]

The weird thing is that you guys will respond to joe home owner, the one that doesn't want to hire you. You will lead his butt through any plumbing problem for free, because your ego tells you to respond. "Look at me, I have the answer". It's unbelievable to me.

I don't work on that side of the industry, but I know a sheep when I see it. Get rid of your egos and preserve you trade. I don't respond to thos posts anymore, but when I did I used to ask the poster: "What expert advice do you give on the internet?" Not one poster ever indicated they gave free expert advice.

[plumbdog10]

What do you mean Dog, isn't your Q 9this thread) posted in the Pro Plumbing Discussion forum? Was/Is there something else in the works?

Bob,

I don't understand you post, please dumb it down.

[Josh]

Dog... theres always going to be someone that responds. What I may start doing is start moving homeowner posts out of this forum into the "Ask the plumbing experts" Would this help to at least keep this forum clear for serious plumbing discussion?

The weird thing is that you guys will respond to joe home owner, the one that doesn't want to hire you. You will lead his butt through any plumbing problem for free, because your ego tells you to respond. "Look at me, I have the answer". It's unbelievable to me.

I don't work on that side of the industry, but I know a sheep when I see it. Get rid of your egos and preserve you trade. I don't respond to thos posts anymore, but when I did I used to ask the poster: "What expert advice do you give on the internet?" Not one poster ever indicated they gave free expert advice.

[plumbdog10]

Plumbdog... how do you envision the pro plumbing forum to be secured? I want to keep this as easy as possible for people to figure out. Right now I would say the vast majority of topics are pro plumbing in this forum. There are a few home owners every once in a while though.

If you can think of something that wouldn't exclude actual pro plumbers than I may try something for ya.

Josh

No I don't view this forum as secure, I voted against it. I also lobbied against removing members. So don't put some NAZI trip on me.

My post was directed towards plumbers who can choose to respond or not respond to any post.

[bigPipe09]

Sorry to be curt, but dog you really aren't one to be attacking other peoples egos.

[drtyhands]

Dog,I can assure you Josh has your interests,as well as others,in mind when contemplating what to do with getting something together that may provide some privacy without alienating cherished members who are obviously qualified to join us yet have not the pedigree to do so.

I understand wholeheartedly your concerns.Over on another board I posted a thread that may seem unorthodox as far as this board is concerned and I am wondering if it will fly as it stands.There are issues that are on the edge of being too much info for an open forum where things are kept on the lighter side.I was testing the water.

I feel this is one heck of a coincidence,or you already know this and are looking out for the interests of others by bringing this to our attention.

I don't understand your gnarly NAZI statement.I hope it can be past off as a bad state of current affairs.I have some pretty heavy respect for you because I work with so many of the same variables in the industry,but I have felt this bond strained,nothing broke.May I also say I don't think my current tensil strength could handle much more than that.

Adam

[yasudaplumbing]

Dog,

My next venture after I retire:

Dial-a-Plumber.

Call me at 1-900-Fix-Leak at $2.99 a minute I'll give you all the Pro advice.

Tracy

[DuckButter]

LOL, Dog, you'll always be you.
I don't respond to the frequent requests for info, here's why...
I got a call last week for a leaky shower valve, over 30 years old and I had to call the MFG to narrow down the model, then call suppliers to find the parts..all of 45 minutes later I get the info I need.
I call the home owner back and he starts asking me what model it is, where I get the parts, and how I get them in.
I ask him bluntly when he wants me to do the repair, he then beats around the question by asking what model it is.
I ask him if he really wants a plumber, he then comes clean and says he already has the parts for a more recent model and wanted to know if he had the right one.
I deal directly with frugal homeowners constantly, and as we all know, plumbers are overpaid so it's not unethical to try to glean all the free info you can.
On the other side of the spectrum, there are those who are less fortunate and can't afford a plumber.
I won't judge anyone elses way of doing things, I personally don't respond.

[oldslowchevy]

i am simple for the most part, if a fawcet is leaking i replace it, now it a shower devierter is leaking i tend to call a plumber, at one time i would have replaced one but now there is so much plastice in most of the i am not sure of my sodering enough to atemp putting one in with out causing damage.

i do not repair plumbing fixures i just replace them when they go bad, i have found in the long run it is just cheaper to do this versus repairing something 2,3,4 or more times. i understand that sometimes the samething can have different problems like a 3 stem deverter, 1 stem can go bad you call the plumber out to fixit then a few days later another stem goes bad, by the end of the second call it would have cost the same or less to have put new in. i hope that is understandable since it is 4:00am and my eyes are not quite awake yet.

[Wild Weasel]

The weird thing is that you guys will respond to joe home owner, the one that doesn't want to hire you. You will lead his butt through any plumbing problem for free, because your ego tells you to respond. "Look at me, I have the answer". It's unbelievable to me.

I don't work on that side of the industry, but I know a sheep when I see it. Get rid of your egos and preserve you trade. I don't respond to thos posts anymore, but when I did I used to ask the poster: "What expert advice do you give on the internet?" Not one poster ever indicated they gave free expert advice.

FWIW, I give out advice on the Internet all the time. Much of it has to do with cars. Heck, I got sick of answering the same questions over and over so I even went about setting up a website with lots of info on it. http://www.wildweasel.ca/j-body/HowTo/ For much of what's there, I consider myself an expert and save people lots of money.

So yes... I'm one of those homeowners you're talking about, but I try to give as well as I get.

[Josh]

Ok dog... sorry to respond to your post and try to help out. I never said the forum is secure. If I were to ever build a "secure forum" I would need to know the information I asked you before ("how do you envision the pro plumbing forum to be secured? I want to keep this as easy as possible for people to figure out. ") Whats to keep joe home owner from gaining access to the pro section? I wanted to state that I would try to keep the Pro Plumbing Forum clean from some of the home owner posts as a simple first step. So somehow along the way I have turned into a NAZI

Once again sorry for responding to your thread.

:cool: Josh

No I don't view this forum as secure, I voted against it. I also lobbied against removing members. So don't put some NAZI trip on me.

My post was directed towards plumbers who can choose to respond or not respond to any post.

[ToUtahNow]

To the newer guys what you may be missing is the idea of this forum was for pros to talk to each other about the trade. There is another forum where DIY and others can ask their questions. Perhaps the problem is where the two are located on the board. It is not unusual for new people to post in the top forum on a new site.

Mark

[Josh]

To the newer guys what you may be missing is the idea of this forum was for pros to talk to each other about the trade. There is another forum where DIY and others can ask their questions. Perhaps the problem is where the two are located on the board. It is not unusual for new people to post in the top forum on a new site.

Mark

Good point Mark. I can move the true pro forums to the bottom of the list if you guys would all be ok with that. Any objections?

[stxrus]

well, let's beat another dead horse.

could someone please explain to me how not helping JQ Public with some diection is going to "preserve the plumbing trade" or by giving a bit of advice/help is going to comdemn the trade to doom and destruction? this seems to be dog's dogma and battle cry.

if i EVER get that crotchety & mean i hope someone puts a bullet in my head, or takes my computer away.

just my $.02 before taxes

steve

[Wild Weasel]

That's definitely a good idea. If "Ask the Plumbing Experts" is at the top of the list, and people see it first, then that's where they'll make their posts.

Once they see "Professional Plumbing Discussion", and their question is about plumbing, they'll look no further for something more appropriate.

[Wild Weasel]

could someone please explain to me how not helping JQ Public with some diection is going to "preserve the plumbing trade" or by giving a bit of advice/help is going to comdemn the trade to doom and destruction? this seems to be dog's dogma and battle cry.


Well... I'm sure we've all heard the story about the highly paid whatever hitting whatever he's looking at with a hammer and then charging his high fees for the solution. Asked to itemize the bill... the expensive bit is the "knowing where to hit".

That's the idea here, and I respect that for the most part. People are well paid for knowing what they do and appying that knowledge with skill.

I think though, that the people looking on the Net for a way to do something themselves are going to find that info whether they find it here or elsewhere. Making it difficult for them here won't stop them and certainly won't get them on the phone to hire a plumber rather than continuing to look.

I've seen plenty of issues here where the solution is to try x, y, and z... and if that doesn't work then to call a plumber. I think that's appropriate.

There's plenty of things people can do themselves and really, if they're willing to look into it then let them give it a shot. There's always going to be more complicated things that require a pro, but helping people with the simple stuff will only help them better appreciate what the pros are capable of when things get to that point.

[Josh]

I feel that as a web community there is value in people knowing at least something about the situation they run into. I agree with Dog in that home owners shouldn't be DIYing it and trying to solve their problems by themselves. There is always value in understanding the situation you are in and what a plumber will be doing for you money. Now trying to do something you are not qualified to handle usually screws things up worse than they were before.

[stxrus]

but how it going to save or destroy thee plumbing trade?

i agree that people are looking to save some $$ and there are a lot of things a non pro can do.

i get at least 2 calls a week from tire kickers that want to know how much it's gonna cost to open their blockage. i give a ball park and they say they'll call back. some do, most don't. some call back after retining a drum machine (minimum 4 hours here), drag it home, go back to the store for gloves, eye protection, etc and attempt to fix "it" themselves. some call back and i go out and knock the job out (quickly AND professionally, i hope) and they are happy campers. sometimes they break or damage something and that has to be repaired.

you said, "I've seen plenty of issues here where the solution is to try x, y, and z... and if that doesn't work then to call a plumber. I think that's appropriate.

There's plenty of things people can do themselves and really, if they're willing to look into it then let them give it a shot. There's always going to be more complicated things that require a pro, but helping people with the simple stuff will only help them better appreciate what the pros are capable of when things get to that point." and that is MY point exactly.

sorry for the rant, but this is really a bore and i shouldn't let it get under my skin. maybe i'll just learn to sidestep the poop lying on the forum floor.

steve

[toolaholic]

I'm My Father's Son. Back in The 50s, Dad always stopped The Car to lend a hand. To this day I do,as the rest of My Family does. I give what I feel is good advice here and elsewhere. On a welding forum ,I'll be looking at some Kids welds,telling Him to crank up the amps and slow down. There are times I won't help ,when I see a do a DIY over Their head,about to create a health problem for their neighborhood, and family. Just My take,not out to ruffle any feathers
or fur.

[ToUtahNow]

well, let's beat another dead horse.

could someone please explain to me how not helping JQ Public with some diection is going to "preserve the plumbing trade" or by giving a bit of advice/help is going to comdemn the trade to doom and destruction? this seems to be dog's dogma and battle cry.

if i EVER get that crotchety & mean i hope someone puts a bullet in my head, or takes my computer away.

just my $.02 before taxes

steve

I believe you have missed the point. The Pro Plumbing Discussion Forum was added at the request of some of the members so they would have a forum where they could discuss business and trade issues without DIY and others asking plumbing questions. Some did not want to sort through the DIY threads to find threads related to trade and business questions. I believe dogs post has more to do with the fact those who wanted a seperate forum (dog did not) have now created two Ask the Expert Forum as they are responding to DIY questions in the from they requested be for the pros only.

Mark

[PLUMBER RICK]

i give advise all the time to both new customers and established ones.

just over the weekend i walked a recently divorced lady through cleaning her air gap.

the last thing i want to do is go there for a 5 minute repair and have to charge her. even if it's only a 1/2 hour charge.

she fixed it and now the next time there is something more serious, she will call me back, just like she has for the last 7 years.

same goes for a simple toilet stoppage. it never fails that a simple plunger will fix 95% of basic toilet stoppages. i give them the opportunity to plunge it themselves. they try, they fail and i show up. typically within a few seconds, it's fixed. they are always surprised i was able to do it. they never complain, because i always gave them the opportunity to fix it themselves.

to me helping out an established customer or a stranger has always been good business. never a loss of business because of it.

now over the internet, i don't expect to get business from it. but just as i might give advise, so do others. we all learn from this exchange of info, even if it wasn't directed towards us.

if it wasn't for the exchange of info and trying new ideas, there would be no k-60 impressionator:D thanks mark;)

rick.

[Herk]

Dog has a good point. I have a very hard time not posting help to people who ask. At the same time, I encourage them to stay away from things that are a bit over their heads. Chances are these people are never going to hire a plumber no matter how deep they get into a problem.

I seek out plumbing forums and often post responses to problems. Yesterday, for example, I was in a thread where a senior member of a forum suggested that the HO get rid of that "gray thing" on their well system. I told them not to. The backflow preventer is on the system for a reason.

I tried to talk another member of a forum out of pouring their own lead joint on a closet flange, to no avail. They were determined and enlisted the help of a RL plumber. I may help on a forum, but I don't help HOs do their own work in real life. This guy was crowing about how good the job he did was.

The single thing that stands out the most in plumbing forums is the obvious fact that most of the people trying to do their own work are totally clueless about what they're doing. They really shouldn't be attempting it themselves.

In real life, I have had several customers lately who attempted to do their own work, and I had to bail them out. On one, I had bid a $58 minimum technical service to tighten a leak under a pedestal basin. That one took two hours because everything imaginable had been done wrong - from setting the pedestal in a big puddle of caulk to leaving the nipple a couple of inches back inside the wall to no pipe dope on the threaded tailpiece, to using cardboard with lag screws to anchor into sheet rock. Truly unbelievable.

On another, it was a more simple repair - the connections on the pull-out faucet were not even finger tight. The cabinet shelf was completely destroyed, the new furnace in the basement had been flooded, and there was water coming out of the basement walls. All this in a house only a few years old - but look at the money they saved!

I offered to clear the drain on their tub that was slow, but the lady didn't like the price, and elected to put up with it. Also, the flex connections on the cheap kitchen faucet had been badly twisted. Cheap, cheap, cheap. Welcome to the wonderful new world of plumbing.

At the house where I had the basin problems, they turned down the job of installing the kitchen faucet, electing to not spend that much money and let the same moron install it who messed up the basin so badly. Cheap, cheap, cheap. At the same time, they were installing tile on all their floors and using a pro installer because they didn't want to mess that up - and I do mean all their floors. They wanted to get the house all fixed up before moving into it, and according to the lady had gone through a lot to get that far - going to the only supply house in town to get a toilet and sink and finding the pedestal cracked and a tank and bowl that didn't go together. So they trucked up to Homey in Idaho Falls and got another set. But look at all the money they saved!

I learned my lesson: from now on, it's bid it as an owner-supplied basin and tear it down to itty bits and re-assemble it. It would have taken half as long. Never assume the HO knows what they're doing.

I agree that the DIY threads should be at the top because otherwise there's no way for a new amateur poster to realize they aren't in the right thread. On some forums, there's a section that's hidden to new posters until they've made a few posts and it might be a good idea to do that here and only allow pros in.

[Herk]

they try, they fail and i show up. typically within a few seconds, it's fixed

Isn't it funny how that works? I often think that what I do is relatively easy and most anyone could do it if they tried, but then it's brought home to me that, even with hand-holding instructions, they still can't accomplish what I can. Plumbing really is an acquired skill. Once, when I was very young and very helpful, I worked with an HO to do some of his work. I taught him how to solder - something I would never consider today - and when I went back to look at his work I was appalled at how pitifully he had routed the pipes - around in circles.

That was a lesson well-learned. Today, I am far more careful about giving advice to people in things that might be dangerous. Our local plumbing shop - Standard Plumbing - had at one time been telling their employees that they should not give advice to amateurs because if it went badly they could be sued. But once Homey and Lowe's moved into the area, they got back into doing it full-time.

The real joke is that they hire people off the street with an IQ of about 40 and the fools go there and ask their advice as if they were some kind of pro. Some of the advice they give is pretty funny.

but just as i might give advise, so do others. we all learn from this exchange of info, even if it wasn't directed towards us.That's why I'm checking out the forums in the first place - I constantly learn a lot. One of the things I learn is how many hacks are out there giving bad advice. But there are constantly things I've never heard of or seen in this little one-horse town and I'd like to learn the ins and outs of things before I run into them for the first time, such as defective parts or poorly-designed equipment.

[Josh]

Ok Guys... hows that. I labeled all the forums except the Ask the Experts forum as Pros Only. Any tweaks? Should this help without scaring people away?

[PLUMBER RICK]

josh, personally, i think it will not work.

i think the open forum will get all the attention and the others will die off.

it's also going to more difficult to research old post as they are now going to be in at least 2 different forum windows.

time will tell:rolleyes:

rick.

[Josh]

I backed it off to just trying Mark's Suggestion. we can always switch the order later if we want to.

[Pipestone Kid]

I feel that as a web community there is value in people knowing at least something about the situation they run into. I agree with Dog in that home owners shouldn't be DIYing it and trying to solve their problems by themselves. There is always value in understanding the situation you are in and what a plumber will be doing for you money. Now trying to do something you are not qualified to handle usually screws things up worse than they were before.
Josh, correct me if I am wrong, but didn't you recently do a DIY project and post a question or two here? Seems a bit contradictory to your above message. Personally, if some want their own forum, let them start one of their own. I think there might be quite a howl at Ridgid if this forum starts getting split up. Besides, how are you going to determine who is a real PRO? In my area, if you own a pipewrench, a saw, and a can of glue you can paint a sign on your truck and you are a plumber. I will venture a guess that I am not alone.

Jim

[Josh]

Pipestone... all is well again. Made the change and it was reacted to negatively. We are back to square one except for Ask the Plumbing Experts being at the top of the list.

Sorry for the scare.

Josh

Josh, correct me if I am wrong, but didn't you recently do a DIY project and post a question or two here? Seems a bit contradictory to your above message. Personally, if some want their own forum, let them start one of their own. I think there might be quite a howl at Ridgid if this forum starts getting split up. Besides, how are you going to determine who is a real PRO? In my area, if you own a pipewrench, a saw, and a can of glue you can paint a sign on your truck and you are a plumber. I will venture a guess that I am not alone.

Jim

[All Clear Sewer]

i give advise all the time to both new customers and established ones.


to me helping out an established customer or a stranger has always been good business. never a loss of business because of it.


rick.

Rick I`m with ya ;) I hate to charge for a 5 minute repair or a simple toilet stoppage.
I tell em how I do it and call me back if it dont work.

When I show up, I push the plunger 1,2,3 times and I`m done. They never ***** about paying me $70.00 to do it because I tried to help em save money before I showed up. Seem`s to make em happy knowing that I tried to save em a buck or 2 before I charged em ;)

[Frankiarmz]

Rick I`m with ya ;) I hate to charge for a 5 minute repair or a simple toilet stoppage.
I tell em how I do it and call me back if it dont work.

When I show up, I push the plunger 1,2,3 times and I`m done. They never ***** about paying me $70.00 to do it because I tried to help em save money before I showed up. Seem`s to make em happy knowing that I tried to save em a buck or 2 before I charged em ;)

That's some great attitude you got. You almost sound like a Doctor! Maybe it's hard for some of the Pro's to remember when they didn't know what they were doing and how desperate that clogged toilet can make you feel? I hope there's always enough business to allow you to give folks a break like you described before you charge them for a job well done. God Bless You.

[yasudaplumbing]

Originally Posted by PLUMBER RICK http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=107327#post107327)
i give advise all the time to both new customers and established ones.

to me helping out an established customer or a stranger has always been good business. never a loss of business because of it.

rick.



Rick I`m with ya ;) I hate to charge for a 5 minute repair or a simple toilet stoppage.
I tell em how I do it and call me back if it dont work.

When I show up, I push the plunger 1,2,3 times and I`m done. They never ***** about paying me $70.00 to do it because I tried to help em save money before I showed up. Seem`s to make em happy knowing that I tried to save em a buck or 2 before I charged em ;)

I run my business the same way as you guys, let the home owner do the easy stuff by coaching them a bit.
They will eventually call me for the hard stuff, along with their extended family, friends, and co-workers.
Heck, I even gained a few great General Contractors this way.
The way I look at it is: 5-10 minutes of my time = to thousands in profits.

Tracy

[ToUtahNow]

I've always enjoyed helping the ones who want to try it on their own. As a matter of fact I had a radio show named "Home Improvement" before Tim Allen was even around. People would call to ask questions regarding repairs and I did my best to talk them through it. Many of them called me later to do the tougher project they did not want to handle on their own. The show got me a lot more work than it ever lost me.

Mark

[mrs. westcoast]

Tim Allen is hot:)

[ToUtahNow]

Tim Allen is hot:)

What are the rest of us chopped liver?

Mark :mad:

[mrs. westcoast]

What are the rest of us chopped liver?

Mark :mad:


awwww....i didn't mean it tha way Mark:)

I had a crush on tim allen ever since i was 7 y old..then recently saw a movie with him and Robert agrees with me:)

[biscuit]

awwww....i didn't mean it tha way Mark:)

I had a crush on tim allen ever since i was 7 y old..then recently saw a movie with him and Robert agrees with me:)

So are you saying that Robert now has a crush on Tim Allen??:D

[mrs. westcoast]

So are you saying that Robert now has a crush on Tim Allen??:D


:ok:

[All Clear Sewer]

Now that`s TMI :speechless:

[biscuit]

I think I better leave this one alone before it hits the fan around here :duck:

[mrs. westcoast]

Now that`s TMI :speechless:

what does tmi stands for?

[biscuit]

what does tmi stands for?

"Too Much Information"

Regards,

[toolaholic]

Mrs. WC ,Do You also call Tim Boy, Muffin Butt ?

[gear junkie]

http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12177

Nobody get mad at Josh or Dog about this matter, as far as I know I started this whole discussion. My intent is to create a place where we can talk about things like pricing, business methods, etc. We wouldn't talk about this in front of customers so why talk openly about it on the forum?

http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14159

Res057 suggested much the same thing at a later date and the overall response was good. Maybe he said what I was thinking in a better way, who knows, for whatever reason there was a better reception towards his thread which is great. I tried to create a poll to find the interest and couldn't figure it out so Dog helped me by creating a new one.

[res057]

When I started the thread mentioned above, it was never my intent to make it a "pro only". The world doesn't need to know what your mark up is or how much you make a year. The ONLY way to keep something secret is to not tell ANYBODY, anywhere, any time.
It's intent was more along the lines of;
"What accounting software do you use, or do you use a CPA?"
"I have an employee with chronic "back problems" that I know are bogus. Have any of you had to deal with this? What was your solution and how'd it turn out?"
"What kind of advertising do you do? What gives you the best response?"
"Do you use a payroll company or do you write your own checks?"

Basically the business end of the business. The stuff most people don't want to do, but have to to keep the lights turned on.
I hope I clarified that a little. Sorry if anyone was mislead as to the intent.

Jack

[Wild Weasel]

"What kind of advertising do you do? What gives you the best response?"


Pfft! I'm not even a plumber and I know the answer to this one!

Don't advertise. Any plumber worth his salt will get enough word of mouth referrals to earn a healthy living. If you advertise in the yellow pages, you're an amateur hack who will charge double what you should and probably do more damage than you fix.

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/rollin.gif

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/theyareontome.gif

[oldslowchevy]

Pfft! I'm not even a plumber and I know the answer to this one!

Don't advertise. Any plumber worth his salt will get enough word of mouth referrals to earn a healthy living. If you advertise in the yellow pages, you're an amateur hack who will charge double what you should and probably do more damage than you fix.

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/rollin.gif

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/theyareontome.gif


here we go again lol, this is almost as much fun as flat rate vs t&m....... almost:D

[DuckButter]

Rick and others make a good point about helping customers with simple less dangerous tasks.
Thats fine, I do it with regulars when it's a job thats too small to justify charging for my time.
What drives me insane are things like landlords attempting to sneak info from us to save money, the ole stubborn husband that defies his wife and decides to save money by installing his own boiler.
Last year I did a boiler job, the wife came down mid-day and asked if I could give her my word not to repeat something if she showed it to me.
On the top floor of the house, her husband had taken it upon himself to demo/remodel two back to back bathrooms.
Joists and studs were severely scorched, no long sweeps on drainage, The depths on shower valves were too shallow, oversized holes were drilled in the joists...the list goes on.
She confided that he was obsessed with saving money, to the extent that he'd come home for the last six months just to go right back to work on the bathrooms...she had one foot out the door at that point.
The guy made a good living, high income.
She told me that he had been getting his "how to" from both Home Depot & the internet.
It had taken her an act of congress to convince him to hire out for the boiler.

[Josh]

Weasel, how do the new guys start getting word of mouth if they never get an initial job. The way I view it the first 5-10 years guys new to the trade need to do some advertising. After they have done enough jobs for enough people word of mouth starts kicking in if they built a good name for themselves.

Josh

Pfft! I'm not even a plumber and I know the answer to this one!

Don't advertise. Any plumber worth his salt will get enough word of mouth referrals to earn a healthy living. If you advertise in the yellow pages, you're an amateur hack who will charge double what you should and probably do more damage than you fix.

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/rollin.gif

http://www.michelleandkevin.ca/forum/images/smiles/theyareontome.gif

[Wild Weasel]

heh. If you replace "back to back bathrooms" with "ensuite shower" that could be my wife you're talking about... :D

[Wild Weasel]

Weasel, how do the new guys start getting word of mouth if they never get an initial job. The way I view it the first 5-10 years guys new to the trade need to do some advertising. After they have done enough jobs for enough people word of mouth starts kicking in if they built a good name for themselves.

Josh

Come now, Josh! Did that joke go right by you? :D

[Josh]

Yes.. yes it did. :nyaa-nyaa4: I should have thought more about who the comment was coming from

Come now, Josh! Did that joke go right by you? :D

[plumbdog10]

Ok dog... sorry to respond to your post and try to help out. I never said the forum is secure. If I were to ever build a "secure forum" I would need to know the information I asked you before ("how do you envision the pro plumbing forum to be secured? I want to keep this as easy as possible for people to figure out. ") Whats to keep joe home owner from gaining access to the pro section? I wanted to state that I would try to keep the Pro Plumbing Forum clean from some of the home owner posts as a simple first step. So somehow along the way I have turned into a NAZI

Once again sorry for responding to your thread.

:cool: Josh

Josh,

A clarification: I was not accusing you of being a NAZI, I was accusing you of accusing me of being a forum NAZI (ie. wanting a secured forum).

As an American of German decent I should not have used that word lightly. It's a terrible philosophy that I obviously reject.

Not an excuse, but I'm suffering from major tendinitises in my shoulder and the flu. I haven't had a full night of sleep in a week. I'm a little touchy.

Sorry for any ill feelings.

[MrsSeatDown]

Dog, sorry you don't feel well. Need anything? Homemade soup? Gatorade? Toilet paper?

[Frankiarmz]

Josh,

A clarification: I was not accusing you of being a NAZI, I was accusing you of accusing me of being a forum NAZI (ie. wanting a secured forum).

As an American of German decent I should not have used that word lightly. It's a terrible philosophy that I obviously reject.

Not an excuse, but I'm suffering from major tendinitises in my shoulder and the flu. I haven't had a full night of sleep in a week. I'm a little touchy.

Sorry for any ill feelings.

Joe homeowner here, or should I say Frank? Know I don't belong here, but just wanted to see if there were anymore negative comments towards us common folk being helped by the Pros? I'll say this much for the "Dog", if he's a big enough man to apologize he ain't all bad. I'll stay off this section but in leaving, I hope you get better, man to man all the other stuff aside.

[yasudaplumbing]

Dog, sorry you don't feel well. Need anything? Homemade soup? Gatorade? Toilet paper?
You mean to say Rick already installed your Toto Washlet? :DLOL

Tracy

[Josh]

Thanks for the clarification Dog. I'm still glad your around as always.

I'm sorry you're not feeling well.

Josh,

A clarification: I was not accusing you of being a NAZI, I was accusing you of accusing me of being a forum NAZI (ie. wanting a secured forum).

As an American of German decent I should not have used that word lightly. It's a terrible philosophy that I obviously reject.

Not an excuse, but I'm suffering from major tendinitises in my shoulder and the flu. I haven't had a full night of sleep in a week. I'm a little touchy.

Sorry for any ill feelings.

[DuckButter]

As an American of German decent .....

AHA!
That explains everything.
In my early 20's I did 3 years under a German machinist right from the old country, there was no good or bad, only perfect and not perfect.
He owned the shop, we made mostly high tolerance military parts.
He was a major pain in the keyster when it was time to work.
When it was time to play it was 3 weeks paid vaca every year, several paid trips to the ball game each year, and the 2 annual company parties.
I never in my life have worked for anyone that took such painstaking pride in their work.

[PLUMBER RICK]

Dog, sorry you don't feel well. Need anything? Homemade soup? Gatorade? Toilet paper?

not so guick jojo. that's my gatorade you're offering up.

and the toilet paper, i get 1 roll per case of 24.
you give him your stash of 23:D

You mean to say Rick already installed your Toto Washlet? :DLOL



Tracy



joey's going to wish i've installed the toto seat, once she gives her toilet paper away. my roll is stashed high above her reach;)

now dog, is there anything i can bring you to make you feel better? tools not included:eek:

rick.

[mrs. westcoast]

[quote=plumbdog10;107682]Josh,

A clarification: I was not accusing you of being a NAZI, I was accusing you of accusing me of being a forum NAZI (ie. wanting a secured forum).

As an American of German decent I should not have used that word lightly. It's a terrible philosophy that I obviously reject.

Not an excuse, but I'm suffering from major tendinitises in my shoulder and the flu. I haven't had a full night of sleep in a week. I'm a little touchy.

Sorry for any ill feelings.[/quote



Ich werde hoffen, das Sie besser heute fuhlen.;)

[plumbdog10]

[quote=plumbdog10;107682]Josh,

A clarification: I was not accusing you of being a NAZI, I was accusing you of accusing me of being a forum NAZI (ie. wanting a secured forum).

As an American of German decent I should not have used that word lightly. It's a terrible philosophy that I obviously reject.

Not an excuse, but I'm suffering from major tendinitises in my shoulder and the flu. I haven't had a full night of sleep in a week. I'm a little touchy.

Sorry for any ill feelings.[/quote



Ich werde hoffen, das Sie besser heute fuhlen.;)

Danke, frau westcoast.