Cleaning Drains Through Roof Vents

[JCsPlumbing]

New to forum. Question. Looking to get equipment for drain clearing. Does anyone often experience problems going through an accessible roof vent to clear a drain? On older homes, the vent often is a straight run through the roof. But on newer homes & businesses I ALWAYS have to run ALL vents to the back of the home or business which would cause drain cables to go through multiple turns before getting to any part of the drain system. So, is going through these vents a thing of the past or do the cable machines handle the multiple turns with no problems? Thanks for any help.

[Crappy days]

New propertys would have clean outs installed per code so either way you should not have a problem

[westcoastplumber]

I do vents when I really, really, really have too :mad:

I use my drum machine right now, but think I have found a use for the K-60.

I hate roof vents because the risk of getting stuck and the loss of cleaning ability.

Even pulling a toilet is horrible, going through the closet bend, the santee then the comby on most set ups greatly reduces the cleaning ability.

[gear junkie]

I go on a roof all the time. Be wary of going into a 2" vent into the main line. Catch into a big root ball and you'll rethink the pulling toilet.

[Service Guy]

I almost never go through vents. If there is no cleanout, I pull a toilet.
The K-60 is the best for roof vents if you have to do it.

[PLUMBER RICK]

I go on a roof all the time. Be wary of going into a 2" vent into the main line. Catch into a big root ball and you'll rethink the pulling toilet.

i too go on roofs all the time thanks to the k-60:grin-loving:

if all i have is a 2'' vent, then i might as well do it from a kitchen or laundry c/o. if the stoppage is in a 3''or 4'' main, you really want to access a 3''or larger vent or c/o or toilet.

most older installations around here were 4'' stacks/ vents through the roof. the newer is typically only 2''. also if plastic, they might use vent 90's that will not allow a real snake through.

size up the job and make an educated decision.

rick.

[Drain Medic]

I hate going on roofs, and usually only have to do it maybe 5 times a year.

Here 90% of the work i see have cleanouts, curb traps, or stacks. If non of those apply, then i simply pull a toilet.

I try to avoid roofs at all cost, to dangerous. I dont care what machine you use.

[brittyboy]

If there is no cleanout, I install one. Period! Whether 2", 3",4,irregardless. No fixture pulling, no roof work.

[Crappy days]

If there is no cleanout, I install one. Period! Whether 2", 3",4,irregardless. No fixture pulling, no roof work.

If I told every customer that they would just call another plumber,or drain cleaning outfit.

[ToUtahNow]

Our policy was we would only clean from the roof one time and then if they didn't add a ground level cleanout they would have to call someone else.

Mark

[All Clear Sewer]

I do vents when I really, really, really have too :mad:

I use my drum machine right now, but think I have found a use for the K-60.

I hate roof vents because the risk of getting stuck and the loss of cleaning ability.

Even pulling a toilet is horrible, going through the closet bend, the santee then the comby on most set ups greatly reduces the cleaning ability.

Yep what he said.

I`ll do em but I tell em they need a C/O on the ground as I cant get as good of a clean from the roof or a closet bend. I keep thinking some day everyone will have C/O`s but I get 5 or 6 a month that I have to go up on the roof or pull the W/C.

[Ace Sewer]

Good lord, someone (no, like 4 or 5) agrees with me about roof vents. They are about my last choice for access.

[PLUMBER RICK]

i did a 3'' roof vent yesterday / sunday in the rain.

the other guy wanted to run his camera from the roof.

a camera doesn't fix a house full of waste with 3 kids.

a k-60 on the roof makes a very good impression. that's why i call it the

impressionator

now they want me to camera the line and install a ground level cleanout.

common sence. clear the line, then worry about the future access.

rick.

[JCsPlumbing]

What's your percentage for the times that you take your equipment under the house/business crawlspace?

[Ace Sewer]

rough guess....5-10%.

[Ace Sewer]

rain..... that's when the snow comes down melted, right?

[All Clear Sewer]

I think thats what they call rain??? We call is wet snow this year ;)
you guy`s over next door need to keep your snow to yourself`s ;)

[All Clear Sewer]

What's your percentage for the times that you take your equipment under the house/business crawlspace?
2% at most

[PLUMBER RICK]

What's your percentage for the times that you take your equipment under the house/business crawlspace?

under 5% more like 2%.

i do go under decks that trying to drag a big drum would not be fun.

i never carried an extension ladder on my truck unless i needed to.

now i carry a "little giant" because i do a lot more roof work than i use to.
before the k-60 i had to pull a toilet or rig up an extension hose/pipe.

rick.

[MrsSeatDown]

i did a 3'' roof vent yesterday / sunday in the rain.

the other guy wanted to run his camera from the roof.

a camera doesn't fix a house full of waste with 3 kids.

a k-60 on the roof makes a very good impression. that's why i call it the

impressionator

now they want me to camera the line and install a ground level cleanout.

common sence. clear the line, then worry about the future access.

rick.

Working on a slanted roof in the rain. That is why I call it STUPID!

:slap:

[All Clear Sewer]

Try it in Ice or Snow ;)

[PLUMBER RICK]

Working on a slanted roof in the rain. That is why I call it STUPID!

:slap:

joey, i didn't fall off the roof.

i fell on my butt when i left their front door and stepped on the glazed bull nose brick steps:eek:

glad i know how to break my fall. homeowner says she falls when it's not raining. time to get some grip tape.

rick.

[buyfield]

The latest thing around here is to put the kitchen sink in the middle of the house--no outside cleanout. Which means the roof or pull a toilet a third of the time. Day in and day out, roof or pull a toilet. Then there was that time I installed the cleanout, but it was 4' deep and ground water made it an all out nightmare. I don't like not having very firm bed under pipe, especially at 4'. (Lotta weight on it.) I'm constantly wondering how else to handle the pathetic situation of no outside full size cleanout. Thinking now about charging about 30% more for snaking through toilet. That is, charge to pull and reset the toilet, of course, but also charge quite a bit more to snake from the bathroom, because of liability. I'm quickly reaching the point where price needs to match liability, not just time or trouble. Easier to get stuck, I think, in the bathroom. Worse if you get stuck in the bathroom. Protect floor. Protect vanity. Protect walls. Protect tub. Protect carpet. Protect thresholds. Can't clean cable coming back out if don't clear it. All in all, it's more trouble, but more importantly, it's more liability. It all hit me one day when I pulled a toilet in a commercial bathroom. Floor drain, plenty of room, tile. A lot less liability. And therefore, they should pay less. Liability insurance, of course, is cheaper for commercial than residential. So maybe my competitors are about to get more inside the bathroom business.

[Drain Medic]

The latest thing around here is to put the kitchen sink in the middle of the house--no outside cleanout. Which means the roof or pull a toilet a third of the time. Day in and day out, roof or pull a toilet. Then there was that time I installed the cleanout, but it was 4' deep and ground water made it an all out nightmare. I don't like not having very firm bed under pipe, especially at 4'. (Lotta weight on it.) I'm constantly wondering how else to handle the pathetic situation of no outside full size cleanout. Thinking now about charging about 30% more for snaking through toilet. That is, charge to pull and reset the toilet, of course, but also charge quite a bit more to snake from the bathroom, because of liability. I'm quickly reaching the point where price needs to match liability, not just time or trouble. Easier to get stuck, I think, in the bathroom. Worse if you get stuck in the bathroom. Protect floor. Protect vanity. Protect walls. Protect tub. Protect carpet. Protect thresholds. Can't clean cable coming back out if don't clear it. All in all, it's more trouble, but more importantly, it's more liability. It all hit me one day when I pulled a toilet in a commercial bathroom. Floor drain, plenty of room, tile. A lot less liability. And therefore, they should pay less. Liability insurance, of course, is cheaper for commercial than residential. So maybe my competitors are about to get more inside the bathroom business.

If your going to charge more for pulling toilets and working from bathrooms, i would find out what your competitors are doing. You might price yourself out of alot more jobs. I see your point about the liability issues, but you also dont want to price yourself out.

Invest in same carpeted mats to lay on the bathroom floor so you can place the toilet and the machine ont there. Reason i say carpeted, they are more heavy duty then the sheets of plastic, and will lay flat.

[buyfield]

Yeah, I may not be thinking straight, but compared with being set up at outside cleanout within five minutes, versus protecting door thresholds, floor to the bathroom, floor in the bathroom, vanity, tub, walls, door jamb, possibly damaging lead bend, plus having to head back out to drain the drum after it starts slinging, plus 10 or 15% of the time, have to remove the door--whew! if not charge more, then maybe give a discount for outside. Two or three times more work, and 10x (?) the liability.

I do cover the floor with drop cloth, then cardboard, then 6 mil plastic.

If I were ever to go flat rate, it would probably go something like this: how much time (now and cleanup back at the shop), how much liability, does it require highly specialized tools, and how bad do I not want to do it? And how hard is it going to be to convince them in a month that the whatever's going on now is not related to what I did? I don't know how others do it, but a flat rate schedule would not be based primarily on time.

I don't know, but it seems to me that a more equitable situation is one where the pay adjusts to make all jobs equally desirable. Time and materials alone doesn't accomplish this.

Feel free to bring me back down to reality. Won't be offended.

Tim

[Drain Medic]

Yeah, I may not be thinking straight, but compared with being set up at outside cleanout within five minutes, versus protecting door thresholds, floor to the bathroom, floor in the bathroom, vanity, tub, walls, door jamb, possibly damaging lead bend, plus having to head back out to drain the drum after it starts slinging, plus 10 or 15% of the time, have to remove the door--whew! if not charge more, then maybe give a discount for outside. Two or three times more work, and 10x (?) the liability.

I do cover the floor with drop cloth, then cardboard, then 6 mil plastic.

If I were ever to go flat rate, it would probably go something like this: how much time (now and cleanup back at the shop), how much liability, does it require highly specialized tools, and how bad do I not want to do it? And how hard is it going to be to convince them in a month that the whatever's going on now is not related to what I did? I don't know how others do it, but a flat rate schedule would not be based primarily on time.

I don't know, but it seems to me that a more equitable situation is one where the pay adjusts to make all jobs equally desirable. Time and materials alone doesn't accomplish this.

Feel free to bring me back down to reality. Won't be offended.

Tim

I totally agree on everything you said there. Its much more of a liability and a hassle to work inside vs. outside. And more is needed to be charged to work inside for pulling toilet, going up and down steps, etc.

I would find out what the going rate is though. It would be like me charging double time on holidays when every other drain cleaning company advertises to extra charge on holidays...Who would be getting the calls? Thats all i was suggesting...You dont want to lose business

[ToUtahNow]

Yeah, I may not be thinking straight, but compared with being set up at outside cleanout within five minutes, versus protecting door thresholds, floor to the bathroom, floor in the bathroom, vanity, tub, walls, door jamb, possibly damaging lead bend, plus having to head back out to drain the drum after it starts slinging, plus 10 or 15% of the time, have to remove the door--whew! if not charge more, then maybe give a discount for outside. Two or three times more work, and 10x (?) the liability.

I do cover the floor with drop cloth, then cardboard, then 6 mil plastic.

If I were ever to go flat rate, it would probably go something like this: how much time (now and cleanup back at the shop), how much liability, does it require highly specialized tools, and how bad do I not want to do it? And how hard is it going to be to convince them in a month that the whatever's going on now is not related to what I did? I don't know how others do it, but a flat rate schedule would not be based primarily on time.

I don't know, but it seems to me that a more equitable situation is one where the pay adjusts to make all jobs equally desirable. Time and materials alone doesn't accomplish this.

Feel free to bring me back down to reality. Won't be offended.

Tim

In the 20-years I had my shop I did not have to pay a single claim or pay a single HO for any damage done by my guys because of drain cleaning. It had a lot to do with the fact we carried enough equipment on the truck to have the correct machine for each job at hand.

Mark

[PLUMBER RICK]

all i need for an inside toilet snake job with carpeted bathroom is a 3' x 5' rubber carpet mat and a plastic cement mixing tray for the toilet.

the way you make it sound, it sounds like you're worried about the whole system exploding.

if the water level needs to be lowered, then pump it out. the bathroom that is carpeted is more risky than the tile or vinyl floor, but covering the walls, threshold and tub is extreme.

i would typically do it from the roof if i have a choice.

rick.

[buyfield]

I've never snaked inside without splatter. I may be doing something wrong, it sounds like. I'll reevaluate all the precautions, but I will probably never get to where I don't strongly prefer outside to inside.

[DUNBAR]

I've never snaked inside without splatter. I may be doing something wrong, it sounds like. I'll reevaluate all the precautions, but I will probably never get to where I don't strongly prefer outside to inside.



Are you using an open caged drum?


If you're getting that much water back in the drum, drill a hole in it and use aluminum tape for the cover; all those plugs won't hold because the cable pushes them out.


I go to Big Lots and buy up tons of those plastic drop cloths, you can usually hang one over the shower curtain, pop holes and hang the other over the light fixtures down, then one of the floor or where you need it most.


Drums in most cases you have at the most, 2-3' of cable out of the drum tops.

I'm at $235 on pulling toilets to clear a drain. If they want cheaper, call somebody else because those jobs SUCK and then you have the liability of a supply line, angle stop if it starts to leak through the packing and fill valve if it's served more than a few years. Otherwise you're setting yourself up for a leak, possibly the tank to bowl bolts if you aren't careful.

Last main I opened, I went through a floor drain. :duck:

Yes, I have sinned, but time was important, I rarely do it. 95% of my clogs never show any strain back to the motor.

[westcoastplumber]

If I told every customer that they would just call another plumber,or drain cleaning outfit.


That is very true out here in the south bay also craps

6 or 7 years ago, that would fly, I remember doing c/o's like mad, but now they just thank you for your time:mad:

Luckily,t here are some wise people still out there that understand the best cleaning your going to get will be from a c/o.

I was at an emergency call the other night, the neighbor happened to be stopped up also, well, her plumbers got the Spartan 100 stuck on the roof and left it over night:p:p

I cleared mine through the c/o in about 5 mins.

[Crappy days]

That is very true out here in the south bay also craps

6 or 7 years ago, that would fly, I remember doing c/o's like mad, but now they just thank you for your time:mad:

Luckily,t here are some wise people still out there that understand the best cleaning your going to get will be from a c/o.

I was at an emergency call the other night, the neighbor happened to be stopped up also, well, her plumbers got the Spartan 100 stuck on the roof and left it over night:p:p

I cleared mine through the c/o in about 5 mins.

Totally agree, A C/O is the best way to clean the line . I always urge the client to install one. If I feel the job is dangerous then I will not go on the roof. At the end of the day if the customer does not want a C/O its no sweat off my back, as I charge much more to pull a toilet or go on the roof.