Hadron Collider

[JCsPlumbing]

Are we all dead when they throw the switch? Is it something else I have to learn to work on? Where do I get parts? Are they on the Kohler website?

J.C.

[drtyhands]

I thought we already built one.
Isn't it supposed to fling atoms around and around then smashem' together.
Some kind of big firecracker?

[plumberscrack]

Already knowing how paranoid I am about everything you go and post this? :smack-head:

Now I won't be able to sleep tonight thinking about 2 atoms smashing into each other and opening a wormhole into another universe :bash:

Oh well, there was a couple things I didn't want to do on Monday anyways :itsover:

[Frankiarmz]

We do have one but it is tiny by comparison. Some experts say it will cause the earth to be destroyed. Bright side is that it will be quick. How many times have science experiments gone bad? Killer bees? Don't worry.:eek:

[myakka]

Yes its true. Not only the Hardon collider blue prints but most Western countries are now using the Kohler web site to store thier most trusted secrets. Plumbers have proven time and time again that Kohler's web site will securely keep you from finding the part numbers you need for almost any repair. Unless you know the secret handshake, you'll get re-directed to discontinued lift rods.:D
Mike

[garager]

So you have all enjoyed watching the movie, The Mist.... :D

[NHMaster3015]

If it was going to open a worm hole they should have fired it up in the middle of the Democratic convention.:D

[Frankiarmz]

If it was going to open a worm hole they should have fired it up in the middle of the Democratic convention.:D

If there is a worm hole it better swallow up both the democrats and republicans. They play off eachother taking turns screwing up our country. You can't seriously believe McCain will accomplish any of his campaign promises can you? He stood in front of the cameras and said he knew how things worked! What does that mean? What does that matter if after all the years he served our country in washington we find ourselves in this condition. You really think if he becomes President he will be able to use that knowledge he's been keeping to himself? Obama might be too inexperienced to honestly realize he can't do a dam thing, but for McCain to make such claims is inexcusable. McCain knows how things work and how washington works and it has not and does not work for the American people. That is why we have lost thousands of jobs to the third world.That is why we do not have secure borders and ten of millions of illegals. Pay close attention now. That is why this has gone on from one administration to the next, democrat to republican. I hope McCain gets in because I think if one thing is true it is that he has the presence of a President not so much in our eyes but in the eyes of the world including scum like putin! All those promises McCain made will be nothing but that years from now in my opinion. I'm no political expert but I have observed the past and it does not make either party look good.

[Masterplumb]

If there is a worm hole it better swallow up both the democrats and republicans. They play off eachother taking turns screwing up our country. You can't seriously believe McCain will accomplish any of his campaign promises can you? He stood in front of the cameras and said he knew how things worked! What does that mean? What does that matter if after all the years he served our country in washington we find ourselves in this condition. You really think if he becomes President he will be able to use that knowledge he's been keeping to himself? Obama might be too inexperienced to honestly realize he can't do a dam thing, but for McCain to make such claims is inexcusable. McCain knows how things work and how washington works and it has not and does not work for the American people. That is why we have lost thousands of jobs to the third world.That is why we do not have secure borders and ten of millions of illegals. Pay close attention now. That is why this has gone on from one administration to the next, democrat to republican. I hope McCain gets in because I think if one thing is true it is that he has the presence of a President not so much in our eyes but in the eyes of the world including scum like putin! All those promises McCain made will be nothing but that years from now in my opinion. I'm no political expert but I have observed the past and it does not make either party look good.

I am asking a serious question here. What has McCain ever done to think he is a liar and not keep to his promises. I truely believe that he is a different politician. Now, I dont agree with many of the issues and bills he has been involved in, and he would not have been my first choice in all the candidates but where has he not kept to his word? So called flip flops on drilling or bush tax cuts? I mean where he said he would do something and not do it.

[Frankiarmz]

I am asking a serious question here. What has McCain ever done to think he is a liar and not keep to his promises. I truely believe that he is a different politician. Now, I dont agree with many of the issues and bills he has been involved in, and he would not have been my first choice in all the candidates but where has he not kept to his word? So called flip flops on drilling or bush tax cuts? I mean where he said he would do something and not do it.

My serious answer is that he admits to knowing how things work including washington and yet in all his years we are no better off, and him becoming President will not in my mind elevate him to a position of any greater opportunity or power to accomplish anything more than he has in his past. I'm not suggesting McCain has lied about his record but why are we in such bad shape if all these seasoned legislators who know so very much have not stepped in and taken action? I also find the use of the term "flip flopping" as it is applied to politicians plain stupid. I want my leaders to be strong in their convictions, but at the same time if they either give greater thought to an issue or become aware of certain things that would warrant a change in position I expect them to be smart enough to change their position. I find Obama annoying in this respect. If a politician was prolife and after learning other aspects of the issue decided to change his or her mind I would expect an explanation, but I would not expect that politician to support a position he or she did not believe in whoe heartedly. I am not attacking McCain as a liar, I am accusing him of making campaign claims he will not be able to deliver on. Instead of him saying he believes in open markets and slurring Unions, I would have liked to hear him say I am going to secure our borders and resolve this situation with illegals! Give us something to hold onto, not the same pack of false hopes no one else has made good on!

[Masterplumb]

My serious answer is that he admits to knowing how things work including washington and yet in all his years we are no better off, and him becoming President will not in my mind elevate him to a position of any greater opportunity or power to accomplish anything more than he has in his past. I'm not suggesting McCain has lied about his record but why are we in such bad shape if all these seasoned legislators who know so very much have not stepped in and taken action? I also find the use of the term "flip flopping" as it is applied to politicians plain stupid. I want my leaders to be strong in their convictions, but at the same time if they either give greater thought to an issue or become aware of certain things that would warrant a change in position I expect them to be smart enough to change their position. I find Obama annoying in this respect. If a politician was prolife and after learning other aspects of the issue decided to change his or her mind I would expect an explanation, but I would not expect that politician to support a position he or she did not believe in whoe heartedly. I am not attacking McCain as a liar, I am accusing him of making campaign claims he will not be able to deliver on. Instead of him saying he believes in open markets and slurring Unions, I would have liked to hear him say I am going to secure our borders and resolve this situation with illegals! Give us something to hold onto, not the same pack of false hopes no one else has made good on!

He was/is a senator from Arizona, what could he have done to affect you in Ct in either a positive or negative way? They man seems genuine and if he says he will veto pork barrell bills then I tend to believe him for many reasons, especially that he has gone against his party many times, and until someone shows me where he didn't keep to his word, I will have to take him at his word.

What would you call "I voted for the 87 million dollars before I voted against it? I call that flip flopping. I call being against drilling when gas is $2/gal. compared to $4.50/gal smart.

You don't want McCain solving the illegal alien problem because you and I are not going to be happy with the way he "solves" THAT problem. Thats the main reason I dont think he is the best REPUBLICAN for the job. He has dedicated his life to serving the country.

[NHMaster3015]

I should get the vote here for best thread drift post EVER :D It was brilliant, a veritable 180% turn in one single sentence.

Fella's we done been over, through, around and under all this presidential crap a thousand times. I personally think they both suck. See my new avitar? Let's just sit back and see where the wind blows us. If nothing else the next 4 years should be a veritable harvest of scorching threads and insults :D

[Frankiarmz]

I don't want to keep quoting here, but I am upset with what McCain said because I do feel that in all those years more good should have been done but instead we are in this mess. I only single him out because he is running and he has this vast knowledge, but the rest of them republican and democrat who have served for years end up with the same report card and it does not look good from where I sit. I'm thinking collectively they refused to work for the "betterment" of our country and people. I get the same song and dance from congressman chris shays from CT, he has a great record and introduced all sorts of bills over his long and respectful career, but here we are millions of jobs gone, four dollar a gallon gas, economy in the toilet, unemployment up, a trillion spent in iraq and thousands of Americans dead, our borders still wide open and border agents who did their job in prison. Don't tell me you've done a great job and understand the workings if the results are poor. Right now I've flip flopped on things such as drilling here, to hell with our environment, I need affordable gas and heating oil now! I flip flopped on nuclear energy, I believed it was not safe but the French proved that wrong. Maybe in the future I will change my mind on other issues, but if someone who workd for me and is in charge of something does not deliver I am not happy or confident with them. I want my legislators to produce results and they have not done so. The democratic congress has not produced for us so what makes me think Obama will? Nothing! I'm sorry if you think I'm not a good patriot but I can't stand how poorly our governent has handled our country. Decisions should have been made with the people and country in mind, had that been done we would not be having these discussions.

[NHMaster3015]

Frankie, did you see the end of Indiana Jones and the last crusade? .... Let it go Frankie, Let it go.......:D

[Masterplumb]

I don't want to keep quoting here, but I am upset with what McCain said because I do feel that in all those years more good should have been done but instead we are in this mess. I only single him out because he is running and he has this vast knowledge, but the rest of them republican and democrat who have served for years end up with the same report card and it does not look good from where I sit. I'm thinking collectively they refused to work for the "betterment" of our country and people. I get the same song and dance from congressman chris shays from CT, he has a great record and introduced all sorts of bills over his long and respectful career, but here we are millions of jobs gone, four dollar a gallon gas, economy in the toilet, unemployment up, a trillion spent in iraq and thousands of Americans dead, our borders still wide open and border agents who did their job in prison. Don't tell me you've done a great job and understand the workings if the results are poor. Right now I've flip flopped on things such as drilling here, to hell with our environment, I need affordable gas and heating oil now! I flip flopped on nuclear energy, I believed it was not safe but the French proved that wrong. Maybe in the future I will change my mind on other issues, but if someone who workd for me and is in charge of something does not deliver I am not happy or confident with them. I want my legislators to produce results and they have not done so. The democratic congress has not produced for us so what makes me think Obama will? Nothing! I'm sorry if you think I'm not a good patriot but I can't stand how poorly our governent has handled our country. Decisions should have been made with the people and country in mind, had that been done we would not be having these discussions.

How can you blame McCain for todays problems? Or even Obama for that matter? You are the most negative person I have ever never met!

[Frankiarmz]

Simple, I blame the people in charge who can make a difference but choose not to. If you don't think McCain and the rest of his well seasoned, well paid, "Know How Things Work" colleagues could have made a difference in where we are now, that's your prerogative. If I'm negative it's because I feel bad for the millions of jobs lost while these legislators were busy doing a fine job elsewhere. Same goes for the great way in which they were right on top of our borders and the illegals, our economy, trade deficit, energy crisis and everything else I mentioned. I want killers executed, I don't want to pay for someone elses baby, I don't want to pay my fair share of taxes while others get tax breaks. I have plenty to be upset about after years of working hard and paying my taxes and supporting others. I want legislators who work for my best interests, not the vote of the illegals or the vote of the wealthy and powerful. Take that however you want. Time for me to rest. Good night.

[JCsPlumbing]

Monster thread drift. Where should we go from here? Wanna' talk about Nerf footballs? :p

The first I heard of this Hadron Collider was in reading the DaVinci Code. Seemed so fictional. But they've been working on it for over 10 years. Now they are going to throw the switch on it next week with only theoretical evidence as to what might happen. So, in short, they're not exactly sure what will happen. Maybe nothing. :rolleyes:

Or it might blow out all the PEX joints at once.

J.C.

[Masterplumb]

Simple, I blame the people in charge who can make a difference but choose not to. If you don't think McCain and the rest of his well seasoned, well paid, "Know How Things Work" colleagues could have made a difference in where we are now, that's your prerogative. If I'm negative it's because I feel bad for the millions of jobs lost while these legislators were busy doing a fine job elsewhere. Same goes for the great way in which they were right on top of our borders and the illegals, our economy, trade deficit, energy crisis and everything else I mentioned. I want killers executed, I don't want to pay for someone elses baby, I don't want to pay my fair share of taxes while others get tax breaks. I have plenty to be upset about after years of working hard and paying my taxes and supporting others. I want legislators who work for my best interests, not the vote of the illegals or the vote of the wealthy and powerful. Take that however you want. Time for me to rest. Good night.

The economy is not as bad as some would like you to believe. Unemployment is at 6.1 % but if you look at the numbers historically during the recessions in the 80's and 90's you will see that number higher, look nobody is happy with the price of gas and oil but the economy is not horrible, yes it could be better. Real change is coming Franki boy, REAL CHANGE!

[cpw]

I used to have an automatic Nerf dart gun that was pretty cool.

[VASandy]

The new collider is incredibly huge in comparison to anything else. There's been a lot of discussion about safety and theoretical particulate matter fallout from the device. The boffins (scientists) in charge have published several safety related papers discussing the theoretical results that might be attained with the thing. The idea behind it is to get a look at some of the more esoteric particles that may be flying around (and through) our planet. The Higgs Bosun being one of the more well-known theoretical particles.

The problems occur when you start looking at what types of energetic particles can theoretically be made in such high speed particle collisions. One theory states that tiny black holes could be made. In their safety documents, the scientists say these black holes would be destroyed soon after creation since they would be too small to sustain themselves, and the magnetic properties of the containment vessel will destabilize the black hole. It gets very technical and complicated. I'm no theoretical scientist, but it is an experiment worth watching. This could answer many questions about the universe. Something other than 42. ;)

[DuckButter]

By definition, a black hole is a densely packed grouping of VERY large amounts of matter.
Though two sub-atomic particles colliding at near light speed might emulate some of the properties of a black hole, it's physically impossible to trigger one.

[Gene Bickford]

42:smilewinkgrin:. Nice one Sandy!

I think dumping millions if not billions on attempting to understand the universe should only be done after we have found a cure for cancer, AIDS etc..
How are we going to benefit from this?

[NHMaster3015]

Dunno, maybe sub atomic particles can be used to cure cancer or attack the aids virus. They said the same thing about the space program, but you can't even begin to count all the inventions and advancments that came out of that. I'm for all scientific experiments.

[Frankiarmz]

By definition, a black hole is a densely packed grouping of VERY large amounts of matter.
Though two sub-atomic particles colliding at near light speed might emulate some of the properties of a black hole, it's physically impossible to trigger one.

I keep saying the same thing! I wonder if this bigger, stronger? collider can trigger a release of energy or some other unexpected reaction? Guess we will find out soon.:eek:

[Gene Bickford]

Good point NHmaster.

Gotta love the tang and Velcro. :D

[Gene Bickford]

Not trying to be a smart a$$ NH, you did make a good point,it's just that we have so many problems that i feel are much more inportant to investagate and could actually help us.

On the flip side: We once thought the earth was flat, and if you traveled too far you would fall off. If this were never investigated where would we be now?

[JCsPlumbing]

Part of me sees this as just madness. The thing is 17 miles long! A 17 mile supercooled magnetic vacuum underground no less!

J.C.

[NHMaster3015]

I think our patience will be rewarded. it has, time after time, since the first man used a rock for a tool. Exploration and invention is what we are. It is our driving ambition and lifes purpose. To evolve, to learn to grow. One seemingly small step can open a thousand doors.

[VASandy]

By definition, a black hole is a densely packed grouping of VERY large amounts of matter.
Though two sub-atomic particles colliding at near light speed might emulate some of the properties of a black hole, it's physically impossible to trigger one.

I agree with this point, DuckButter. However, physicists have theorized that tiny black holes are created and dissolved regularly. Typically, apparently, these things occur all the time around planets' (including ours) magnetosphere. That's the main reason they say that even if a tiny black hole is created (I think the technical term is miniature black hole), it will dissolve before it can cause harm.

[JCsPlumbing]

They crank it tomorrow. Watch your PEX fittings. :eek:

J.C.

[cpw]

One of the guys who is filing the lawsuit also filed a lawsuit against the RHIC (Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider) at Brookhaven National Labs. My physics teacher was working on one of the collectors on that one, so we got to have a tour; which was pretty cool. BNL is a great thing for the LI economy.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,419404,00.html

[Frankiarmz]

I hope we benefit from these experiments, probably nothing will happen tomorrow. I just wanted to say goodbye in case the world ends.:angel2:

[JCsPlumbing]

I wanted to say bye too. And that I'm right and the rest of you are wrong.:rolleyes:

J.C.

[JimDon]

Same thing happened when they did the first bomb from the Manhatten Project. Scientists did not know what would happen and surmised that one nuclear explosion could touch off a chain reaction that would end the world. Of course, they should have had kind of an idea of what would happen since their first experiments out in the open were under the bleachers at the University of Illinois and their graphite reactor ran a little wild on them there.
Jim Don

[JimDon]

I wonder if they did FSW when they put all that piping together for the super collider?
Jim

[The Wood Meister]

Professor Otto Rössler, a German chemist at the Eberhard Karls University of Tübingen has filed suit with the European Court of Human Rights, hoping to gain an injunction that will prevent the switching on of the Large Hadron Reactor on Wednesday.

The lawsuit argues that the Large Hadron Collider violates the right to life and right to private family life under the European Convention of Human Rights. It sets out a series of arguments that suggest the collider could produce mini black holes that would permanently come into existence and grow uncontrollably.

Large particle colliders have been used by scientists to smash atoms and pieces of atoms together for more than thirty years.The Large Hadron Collider is the most powerful particle collider, or atom-smasher, ever built.

On Wednesday, it will fire atomic particles around its 17 mile circumference, 11,245 times every second before smashing them headlong into each other.

The result will, for a split second, replicate the conditions that some scientists believe existed in the moments immediately after the birth of the universe, known as the Big Bang.

In a space a billion times smaller than a speck of dust, the collisions will create temperatures 100,000 times hotter than the center of the sun. The purpose of the experiment is to isolate the Higgs bosun, or "God particle" that gives every other particle its mass and weight. But the experiment carries risks.

The first risk is that the internet will be particularly slow on Wednesday -- and here's why. The main site at CERN is also a large computer center containing powerful supercomputers designed primarily for analyzing experimental data.

To analyze it all required linking some 300 similar data systems in over fifty countries, creating a major wide area networking hub. It was a similar, but smaller particle experiment that led to the creation of the world wide web in 1990 by CERN project engineer Sir Tim Berners-Lee.

So firing up the new atom smasher could slow down the internet temporarily while all that new data is being analyzed.

Or, it could result in an expected breakthrough in information technology that could speed up the internet exponentially.

Or, it could reverse the Big Bang process and create a black hole that could destroy the universe.

That's the second risk.

[Gene Bickford]

:wave3:See ya guys!:eek:

[Frankiarmz]

I hope it's quick.

[DuckButter]

Potential implications for something like this...

As we look at the Hubble pics, we see objects that are billions of light years away, nothing known to us could ever transport us those kinds of distances in a time frame that could ever make it practical to even consider.

FTL (faster than light) movement is a physical impossibility, matter converts to complete energy at light speed, and it takes infinite energy to move matter at that speed.
In other words, just to get across the other side of the Milky way galaxy's 100 light year span it would take 100 years even IF we could figure out how to move that fast without self destructing.

Quantum mechanics is some very weird stuff, particles have been known to disappear and reappear somewhere else under certain conditions.

Imagine discovering something from these experiments that leads us to learn how to fold space/time, or teleport.

Imagine if we discovered how to harness the energy of matter at subatomic levels (the same stuff matter converts to at light speed).

Imagine if there were a breakthrough the leads to a way to create stable nuclear fusion.

[drtyhands]

Potential implications for something like this...

As we look at the Hubble pics, we see objects that are billions of light years away, nothing known to us could ever transport us those kinds of distances in a time frame that could ever make it practical to even consider.

FTL (faster than light) movement is a physical impossibility, matter converts to complete energy at light speed, and it takes infinite energy to move matter at that speed.
In other words, just to get across the other side of the Milky way galaxy's 100 light year span it would take 100 years even IF we could figure out how to move that fast without self destructing.

Quantum mechanics is some very weird stuff, particles have been known to disappear and reappear somewhere else under certain conditions.

Imagine discovering something from these experiments that leads us to learn how to fold space/time, or teleport.

Imagine if we discovered how to harness the energy of matter at subatomic levels (the same stuff matter converts to at light speed).

Imagine if there were a breakthrough the leads to a way to create stable nuclear fusion.




Imagine if there were a way to keep Rick quiet and peacefull yet still breathing.

[drtyhands]

O/K,
It's wednesday,so far I 'm still here.

[Dairylander]

"The Large Hadron Collider was switched on today at CERN.
And the result: The Earth didn't move, or even twitch. And it certainly didn't end - as you can tell by the fact you are reading this."
- Neil Tweedie at CERN

Decent 3 minute video on what the heck the thing is:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=&xml=/earth/2008/09/10/scicern610.xml

[Gene Bickford]

"The Large Hadron Collider was switched on today at CERN.
And the result: The Earth didn't move, or even twitch. And it certainly didn't end - as you can tell by the fact you are reading this."
- Neil Tweedie at CERN

Decent 3 minute video on what the heck the thing is:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=&xml=/earth/2008/09/10/scicern610.xml

Yeah but how do you know we didn't get sucked into a black hole and are now in some kind of mirror dimension?:D

[VASandy]

MY CAT JUST GREW A DUCK BILL!!!!



wait....that was just a 60's flashback...all's well. :D