Build My Own Computer

[plumberscrack]

I'm building from the ground up so where do I start?

Should I start with the motherboards or pick a processer first?

Looking to be a gaming system so maybe the graphics card is a beginning? It's going to be a several month build so no hurry on parts but I don't want to buy into something that's outdated next year.

Any advice would be helpful and places to look on the internet for good prices

This Pentium II is starting to make crunching noises...is that bad?

Cases?
Power supplys?
Fan systems?
Hard drives?
Memory? what type is best?

I used to keep up with this stuff but there is so much on the market I got lost in all the jargon

[JCsPlumbing]

Try the CDW catalog. Or maybe http://www.cdw.com (http://www.cdw.com/)

One of the guys I used to work with was a real computer nut. He had the CDW catalog and PCGamer mags all the time.

I looked at some of them. What was interesting in the PCGamer reviews they would always be testing the top of the line systems-manufactured and built. They would consider something like 5 second faster load times just spectacular and go crazy for slightly faster frames per second.

Seems like alienware was a top performer then. Probably get some comparable specs from them and then build from the CDW catalog.

J.C.

[JCsPlumbing]

http://www.alienware.com (http://www.alienware.com/)

Good luck.

J.C.

[DUNBAR PLUMBING]

www.TigerDirect.com (http://www.TigerDirect.com)



Figured I'd spam this thread up too! :clapping:

[cpw]

PC,

I would look for components on either Newegg or TigerDirect; that is where I got the bits and pieces for the computer I just put together. It is the first one I've done in 8 years or so, and my first NewEgg transactions; but I've used TD before that.

How I did it, is I knew I wanted AMD (because I have a bit of brand loyalty), then just picked a reasonably priced CPU and Motherboard that matched. For Graphics, I like NVidia.

What are you looking for out of the system, that might help in what you get for cases etc. If you aren't too concerned about noise, then just pick a case that will fit in your space. Bigger is better in general. I've got no good advice on a power supply. Right now for a hard drive, SATA seems to be what you want. I got a 500GB. If you aren't using it for videos; I don't see the need to go bigger. My laptop only has 100GB, and that isn't constraining. Memory basically boils down to more is better; and faster bus speeds can matter. Size will matter more than bus speeds. I built my system with 2GB, I wouldn't go any less; and more may not help. More than 4GB probably won't help.

Charles

[woodenstickers]

Here's another tip when shopping the sites mentioned. livesearch is running promotions all the time to try to take some of googles and yahoos business as search engines so they are giving cash back for purchases a lot of the time. If you set up an account with them and search through them you can get anywhere from 5% to 40% off purchases at different times. Ebay and the hp site too. On black friday it was 40% off anything on the hp site for about 12 hours. the site was super bogged down but lots of people got huge bargains that day. I didn't.:(

I DID get 30% off my new hp laptop on ebay through them though, and newegg and tiger are both on there a lot too. Check it out, it is real money back--not a scam.

I love my new laptop but I upsold myself to a model that has WAY more than I'll ever use. I wanted blu-ray and a 17" screen and got it for $875 delivered though....and now that my tool habit is on ice I needed something to....need.:D

I also saved a bundle on my present shopping. I'm sure it will work for a lot of tool sites as well;)


Eli

[woodenstickers]

Even the new computer doesn't do nothing for my run on sentence problem though.

[garager]

More power to you my friend. That should be quite the task your gonna take on. Maybe, some woodworker around here can build you a case made out of Tiger Wood or something. Me personally, I'd just rather buy the machine made to my specs, this way I'm good for a year incase it breaks down. By the way, how are your warranty????? :D :D

Good luck with your build..... :cool: :cool:

[cpw]

With a laptop I would always purchase a service plan. You can't build them, and you can't fix them. However, with a desktop if you can build it you can probably fix it; and the individual components aren't too expensive.

[woodenstickers]

With a laptop I would always purchase a service plan. You can't build them, and you can't fix them. However, with a desktop if you can build it you can probably fix it; and the individual components aren't too expensive.

I was wondering about this. I have a one year warranty from hp. Is that not enough/ I had an opportunity to get one through square-trade...i think I still do. Would you recommend it? I kind of always thought it was a bad gamble...

Eli

[cpw]

It depends on how long you want it to last, and if it is big enough money to you. The last laptop I bought in 2000 was $3000. I got a 3 year service contract on that one, it paid off big time because that machine when through 4 keyboards, 3 mother boards, and an LCD. If I bought a laptop for $1000, depending on the cost of the contract I might do the same. For $500, I would just take a chance.

To me, it is no different than a range or dryer. I have no chance of fixing one of those either. My range was $1700, so the $150 for a 4 year service contract made sense. My dryer was $280, so the $150 made no sense; because if it breaks I can go to Lowes; spend $280 and get a brand new one without any undue hardship.

I generally expect to lose the money I put up, but for essential things in the $700 plus range, which I can't just go replace on a whim I am willing to make sure that I get at least several years of value out of them.

BTW: The reason laptops are so expensive to fix is that they have custom parts for everything. Your tower can usually be fixed with a part from most any vendor. Because of the lock-in, things like a laptop motherboard can be $1000. The one I bought for a desktop was around $75.

[Velosapien]

If you're building your own system www.newegg.com should be you're first buying resource. Great place with awesome service and prices. If you're building a gaming system you should stick to Intel for now. Usually AMD and Intel trade the performance crown back and forth but AMD has been lagging for the last round for some time now.

For a good motherboard brand I recommend Asus. They are a bit more expensive but top notch. There's also a lot of other good makers though. Don't skimp out on power supplies. Buy a top brand like Antec or BFG. Cheapo power supplies will eventually burn out and they usually take other components with them. It is the one part that has the capability of damaging other components in the system if it fails.

Check out www.anandtech.com and www.hardocp.com . They will have all the latest benchmarks and performance tests on just about everything out on the market as well as just about all the technical info you may need.

[Velosapien]

It depends on how long you want it to last, and if it is big enough money to you. The last laptop I bought in 2000 was $3000. I got a 3 year service contract on that one, it paid off big time because that machine when through 4 keyboards, 3 mother boards, and an LCD. If I bought a laptop for $1000, depending on the cost of the contract I might do the same. For $500, I would just take a chance.

To me, it is no different than a range or dryer. I have no chance of fixing one of those either. My range was $1700, so the $150 for a 4 year service contract made sense. My dryer was $280, so the $150 made no sense; because if it breaks I can go to Lowes; spend $280 and get a brand new one without any undue hardship.

I generally expect to lose the money I put up, but for essential things in the $700 plus range, which I can't just go replace on a whim I am willing to make sure that I get at least several years of value out of them.

BTW: The reason laptops are so expensive to fix is that they have custom parts for everything. Your tower can usually be fixed with a part from most any vendor. Because of the lock-in, things like a laptop motherboard can be $1000. The one I bought for a desktop was around $75.

It's possible to fix laptops but it certainly is a lot more difficult. Lots of micro screws and delicate plastic trim. I usually buy IBM/Lenovo thinkpads and don't bother with the extended service plans. These models are so popular that just about any proprietary part that goes wrong can be had on ebay for much cheaper than any service plan. I've gone though keyboards which cost $25 to replace, a screen for $65 and a motherboard for about $90 (not on the same one though!). The service plans are at least like $300 for 3 years and most of the parts died after that. All of the generic stuff like like hard drives, ram, cpu's are not worth paying more for extended service since by the time you might need the service there are newer ones out in the market for much cheaper.

[Josh]

If your building...buy 1 year old technology... so much cheaper for close to the same performance.

I have always built my own systems from the ground up. fun stuff but takes probably a day to build and install and tweak to get to the point where you have everything running the way you like it.

I have a lot of friends that want to build their own and I usually tell them its cheaper and easier to buy a low end Dell.

If you already have your monitor this machine should last you another 7 years. Better than the box I built for 800 less than a year ago.

http://www.techbargains.com/news_displayItem.cfm/146515

BTW... building your own takes longer too with a lot more to pay attention to... components from different stores... Shipping time, rebates, configuration...

If you are dead set on building your own you will need

Motherboard (I like ASUS)
Case with power supply (500w+)
Memory (4gigs)
Hard Drive (500 gig+)
DVD Burner
Video Card (if not built in to motherboard)
Sound Card ("")
CPU (I'd recommend a quad core pentium... they overclock nice)
SOFTWARE (Windows, office, etc.)
Peripherals (mouse, keyboard, etc.)

Just buy the Dell ;)

Josh

[cpw]

CPU (I'd recommend a quad core pentium... they overclock nice)
SOFTWARE (Windows, office, etc.)
Peripherals (mouse, keyboard, etc.)
You may be able to scavenge your software from the old machine; same with the mouse, keyboard, etc.

I'll disagree with Josh about quad core; most software doesn't take advantage of multi-core well. Also, I'll assume you don't want to overclock. But either way, you need to make sure to get a good fan/heatsink. My CPU fan costs as much as my CPU (it is 2lbs of copper).

[plumberscrack]

Wow, thanks guys

Lots of good info there. Those Alienware gaming systems are wicked cool :cool: but big $$$$. but if I was getting paid to kill zombies.....:smash:

I just need something to even the playing field when going against my 14 year old nephew on Call of Duty. Nothing too cutting edge.

That barebone Dell has a nice pricetag :)

I'll probably go with ASUS motherboard. I've had good luck with them in the past. SATA 7400 rpm hard drive seems to be the standard these days. I prefer the Intel processor Core Quad? or Core Duo? I'm not sure yet.

Where I need help is on the graphics. Lots there that I don't understand and terms I don't want to learn. It's all very confusing.

SLI, PCI, PCI Express <<<----clueless :o

Do I need one video card or two if I want to watch TV?

Will any video card fit my motherboard?

What if the Mobo has onboard graphics? Does that exclude me from adding a vid card?

I just don't want to get stuck with outdated technology that can't be upgraded. My current HP Pavilion has something called Rambus memory. How did I get fixed up with that crap?

Is liquid cooling something I want to look at? or is that just too far over the top?

[Velosapien]

For a cpu a middle of the road Core Duo should be sufficient for a capable gaming machine. You can get a board with built in video and disable it later with an add-on card but I recommend not wasting money on a board with built in video. Built in video is extremely slow and limited in capabalities. They are usually completely incapable of running any games. Go for something in the nvidia geforce 200 or 9800 series, or ATI/AMD 4850 series. These can be found for very resonable prices and will run pretty much anything very fast. You'll need PCI Express video cards for current generation motherboards. Hard drives are so dirt cheap now anything under about 500GB 7200 SATA is not worth it.

Don't worry about liquid cooling. Usually this is for people who are into extreme overclocking. It could be fun as a project if thats what you're into but stick to air cooling if you want to keep things simple.

[Velosapien]

Wow, thanks guys

My current HP Pavilion has something called Rambus memory. How did I get fixed up with that crap?



During the Pentium 4 era Rambus was supposed to be the future of memory. Intel made this their standard. Problem was it was ridiculously expensive and the Rambus company developed a very bad reputation which earned them universal loathing in the industry. They tried to patent what were supposed to be open standards and then sued just about everyone who made any type of ram into paying them royalties. They got dropped like a bad habit and no one wants anything to do with them now.

[cpw]

I just need something to even the playing field when going against my 14 year old nephew on Call of Duty. Nothing too cutting edge.

That barebone Dell has a nice pricetag :)

I'll probably go with ASUS motherboard. I've had good luck with them in the past. SATA 7400 rpm hard drive seems to be the standard these days. I prefer the Intel processor Core Quad? or Core Duo? I'm not sure yet.

Where I need help is on the graphics. Lots there that I don't understand and terms I don't want to learn. It's all very confusing.

SLI, PCI, PCI Express <<<----clueless :o
The PCI vs. PCIe (PCI Express) is the type of connector on the motherboard. Basically, you just need to make sure the # of connectors on the motherboard exceeds what you plan to plug into it.

According to Wikipedia SLI lets you put two cards together; sounds way to complex, error prone and expensive to me.

Do I need one video card or two if I want to watch TV?
Only one, but you need a video capture card; which is probably not integrated with the video card. So you need two total cards: a video card + a video capture card (or USB device).

Will any video card fit my motherboard?
No. You need to match PCI vs. PCIe and if it is PCIe, make sure that it the number of lanes match (e.g, a PCIe x16 card would not fit into a PCIe x1 slot).

What if the Mobo has onboard graphics? Does that exclude me from adding a vid card?
No. You can always turn it off. A lot of onboard graphics cards take RAM from the main system, but if you have enough that shouldn't matter. I don't know the requirements of your game; but the onboard cards do offer 3D acceleration now and can play games (in the past you had no chance). The integrated card might not cost you that much; so you can always put the system together, try it out and if you are unhappy go get a bad@ss graphics card later (just make sure you rmotherboard will have an appropriate slot to upgrade).

Is liquid cooling something I want to look at? or is that just too far over the top?
No. It is way over the top, expensive, and more error prone.

[plumberscrack]

Wouldn't you know it, Josh was right :rolleyes:

It it cheaper and easier to buy a barebone system than to assemble one myself

I should have jumped on that Dell system deal before it expired :smack-head: I came close to those Dell 530 specs but went just over 5 bills :sad:

This is what I ended up with:
Vista Business 64 bit
Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 processor :cool: on a MSI Motherboard mATX
2 gig DDR2-800 RAM
500 Gig SATA hard drive
8x DVD+RW Super drive
8 in 1 Media Card reader
Nvidia GeForce 8100 Vid card
400 Watt Power supply

I'll probably junk this case and get a better one before too long

This thing is wicked fast :outtahere: and I think it makes me look more handsome :groucho:

[PlumbingSkool]

You may be able to scavenge your software from the old machine; same with the mouse, keyboard, etc.

I'll disagree with Josh about quad core; most software doesn't take advantage of multi-core well. Also, I'll assume you don't want to overclock. But either way, you need to make sure to get a good fan/heatsink. My CPU fan costs as much as my CPU (it is 2lbs of copper).


wow - is that online?...I mean can you show me :)

[cpw]

Here is the CPU fan I am using. It runs at 1100 RPM so is very quiet:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118030
http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggImage/productimage/35-118-030-03.jpg

[PlumbingSkool]

Now, thats sweeet :)

TY !!


Here is the CPU fan I am using. It runs at 1100 RPM so is very quiet:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118030
http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggImage/productimage/35-118-030-03.jpg

[rockinrandy]

I have built over 50 computers.My computer is 5 years old,to lazy to build another.It still works great,3 power supplies later. I go to a computer form like this for computers. They know what combo's work the best.What cpu on what board.They will answer all questions and all the tricks to tweak the bios. They were writing their own bio's programs. So, search the mobo and read up on what it has and can do.Even store bought machines are set up very safe.Some basic setting in the bios can be changed and speed up the whole system.
I compare ram to a tansmission in a car,cpu is the engine,rearend is the hard drive.the more ram the better.With a lil bit of ram you can go anywhere you want.But the ac/radio/power windows slows you down.With a lot of ram everything works with out any slowdown.Even the new GPS lol.
Kind of hard to explane with a keyboard.Hope this helps

[bob@brick]

CPW knows his stuff but forgot to tell you that If you build your own computer you may have less problems than buying a dell or a brand name.

Some of the "brand names" are software specific. CPW could prob explain it better than me, as a computer crasher from the early 1980's some of the best running computers today are from do it yourself purchase from the net Newegg etc.

You can upgrade, replace and modify.

My buddies HP laptop was sent in for repair and had the same loose wire give him a problem. he spent $90. on the repair, had to buy a new computer and accidently found the problem himself.

Yup even a plumber can do it unless your name is Joe.

[darius]

If you build your own computer you may have less problems than buying a dell or a brand name.

Some of the "brand names" are software specific.

Software specific? Never heard that.

I used to build my own PCs when it made the cost go down. Right now it just doesn't give me the bang for the buck. I buy Dell for work and for myself. No issues, no problems with hardware upgrades. For basic office stuff I can get a PC for $300. If I want a little faster machine I'll probably double to triple that amount depending on the config.

Where I see there is a point in building your own is for pro gamers who want to squeeze every last bit and every last millisecond out of their machines.

[kacibrianna]

yes, tigerdirect or if you have a local FRYES close by!!

[BuckB]

If you're building your own system www.newegg.com (http://www.newegg.com) should be you're first buying resource. Great place with awesome service and prices. If you're building a gaming system you should stick to Intel for now. Usually AMD and Intel trade the performance crown back and forth but AMD has been lagging for the last round for some time now.

For a good motherboard brand I recommend Asus. They are a bit more expensive but top notch. There's also a lot of other good makers though. Don't skimp out on power supplies. Buy a top brand like Antec or BFG. Cheapo power supplies will eventually burn out and they usually take other components with them. It is the one part that has the capability of damaging other components in the system if it fails.

Check out www.anandtech.com (http://www.anandtech.com) and www.hardocp.com (http://www.hardocp.com) . They will have all the latest benchmarks and performance tests on just about everything out on the market as well as just about all the technical info you may need.

A few years ago I built an AMD based system with an ASUS motherboard. It's the first system I've built wher I bought a new case to match. Usually I upgrade and use the same case over again along with HD's, burners etc. Ive built a ton of servers and my clients used to tell me to take the old stuff away. So i had a lot of cases and other periferels to use.
I like to use FSX with PMDG's software and fly thier 747-400. My setup uses two AMD FX-57 dual core Procs running at 3.0 GHZ, 4 Gig's of corsair memory a 1000 watt PSU and 4 WD Raptors. It is FAST! It is also a little bit loud. But you don't notice it with FSX. No stutters, no problems. My buddy bought a machine and wanted to try FSX with PMDG's software. Could not instal PMDG's stuff. It would not run FSX without stuttering, the plane took off but wouls stop momentarily when doing so, very jerky. Planes don't stop in mid air. He took it back and I built him a good machine.

Buck

[VASandy]

For gaming, a Quad core is a good investment. The Intel i7 Extreme is currently the top-dog processor that will get you the best experience. It's expensive, so a Core 2 Quad would be a better choice. That's where budget comes in to play.

Get the best graphics card you can afford. Get two if you can. Most games now will take advantage of SLI/Crossover dual cards.

Make your decisions first on CPU and then on graphics cards. Once you've made those decisions, find a motherboard that's designed for those two items. Asus makes a very good quality motherboard. Read through the articles on tomshardware.com and other places to find out about chipsets. Some chipsets work better than others based on the CPU you choose.

Go with Vista, as you'll get DirectX10, which is the current gaming graphics standard. Games will run better on DX10. I don't want to get into the whole M$ trying to take over the gaming world discussion, but that's how it is.

Get as much power supply as you can. 1200Watt PS is becoming more and more available. The graphics cards are power-hungry, and you want to be able to spin a DVD player, a hard drive, and max the graphics all at the same time. More power is required for all these things, and maxing out the power supply trying to do all this stresses the system more than it needs.

Go with as much RAM as you can get once you figure everything else out. 4GB is what I'd consider good for a gaming rig. More would be better. Less will leave you with an unsatisfying system.

That Zalman heatsync is a good one. The one that comes with the CPU is .... well, they're OK but they're usually noisy and not as efficient. Zalman has always made quality coolers. Also, buy extra fans with whatever case you get. Bigger fans are always better, as you can spin them slower and get lots of air movement. Put the fans in so they suck air in at the front and exhaust from the rear. I like having a fan that pushes air in towards the graphics cards from the case, and they also make some cases that allow you to put a fan in that'll blow air towards the CPU cooler. Sometimes, though, these cause turbulent air around the CPU cooler fan and reduce the efficiency. I'll usually skip that unless I'm doing a heat pipe cooler. Use the Zalman CPU cooler, and forget the heat pipes. Get a case that lets you mount a fan near the graphics cards, as well as 2-4 extras in the front and rear. Remember, one 120mm fan in the front and one in the back can replace a couple of the smaller ones.

I could probably swing by and help you put things together if you'd like. I've built tons of gaming rigs and enjoy showing people how to build them.

[Woussko]

I would select the type of hard drive controller you want/need, but buy the hard drive(s) last thing. Anymore it seems every month I get blown away at how for the same $$$ I can get far more hard drive than last month.

Check the manufactures web sites, but when ready you may want to go to this site with brand and model numbers handy. Check them for other parts and accessories. I find their prices to be good and they get stuff to me quickly via FedEx..
WWW.PROVANTAGE.COM

Hint: Think about if you really need what's called a "Retail Kit" version of a hard drive or if just the bare drive would work for you. In many cases you can get by with a bare drive and download installation software (makes it go nicer) off their web site and make up a boot CD.

VASandy can really help you there for sure.

By the way for keyboards, rodents (little rat with a tail), monitors, software and the like, you can take your time, save $$$ and think about what you really want and need.

[JTROANOKE]

Agree with all that Newegg rocks. Have been building my own for 8 years. The only order they screwed up was my first and they next day aired the missing parts at their expense.
Even though intel has a slight edge in performance over AMD, AMD wins the performance per dollar spent crown IMHO. If cost is not an object, go Intel, if it is, go AMD. NVIDIA for graphics (discrete card) and most everything else can be on board. I used to insist on discrete cards for just about everything, but unless you want to set up surround sound, etc. not worth it. Plus your system runs cooler with less clutter in the case. Lots of RAM and make sure the brand/model is recommended by the motherboard maker. 4 gig for 64 bit, 2-3 for 32 bit. Yes most software doesn't take advantage of multi core processors but the future will, and also having multiple cores will take operating system overhead to a different core than games, or other intense programs you may also have running. I like ASUS and MSI for mainboards, and NVIDIA for graphics. My system is 5 years old and is running the latest version of a high end Cad package, etc. with no sweat because I spent a little extra on top shelf componenents when I built it. With current graphics cards meant for gaming a heavy duty Power supply (500 watts +) is recommended, and I prefer single rail so I don't have to worry about what is pulling too much current off of a given rail. Don't chintz on the fans, but get the ones that will regulate their speed with temperature so it will only be noisy when it needs to be.
The newegg reviews on components can be useful if you sift thru the ones written by 12 year olds in chatspeak. Toms Hardware guide is very useful as well. just google on it and you will find it.