TS3650 - Is it generally a solid saw

[imported_m00n]

Hey all...

I realize I am in the house of ridgid, but I will ask anyway. smile.gif

I am very interested in the TS3050. I just seen it at home depot, seems lke a great solid saw so my questions would be...

1) Can you purchase add-on' for the saw such as a new fence and rails?

2) If I decided to create a cabinet for this, would it work well as a cabinet saw?

3) Someone mentioned the miter guides on a different model being a different size than standard, is that the case with this saw too?

4) Someone mentioned that it may not have some things that other saws have... Not knowing much about table saws, what would those other things be and how important are they?


I am very new to this so please excuse me if I am asking what seems to be very dumb qestions. smile.gif


Thanks
Rick

[ 01-20-2004, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: m00n ]

[daveferg]

Rick----welcome.

Answers:

1) Yes, pretty much any of the aftermarket fences can be made to fit the saw----but, let me suggest it is more economical to purchase the quality and size of fence you want from the start. Some other brands offer Biesemeyer or Unifence fences starting about about $50 to $100 more than this saw (noting that the cheapest Biesemeyer aftermarket fence is $270.

2) No, it wouldn't make it a cabinet saw by any means, as you'd still have the motor coming out of the rear of the saw. I have seen some very nice cabinets built as a substitute for the stand, but that won't make any contractors' saw a cabinet saw. ;)

3) As far as I know, this new saw has continued with the same slots Ridgid always had, which are slightly smaller than Delta (which is the other standard size). It is not even an issue until you intend to replace the miter gauge or to add a tenoning jig---but it takes very little to get an aftermarket gauge to fit----Incras work very well.

4) As said earlier, nothing is more important than a good fence. Quality and acuracy are alse very important.

As to the 3650---the facts are---this is a new design---untested. On this board, you will find reports of flexing in the leg stand as well as some problems with the motor----a few reports of each---

At it's full price, I'd strongly suggest you take a look at the General International contractors' saw, which includes a Biesemeyer fence, for $50 to $100 more. If as some have been able to do---you can get the 3650 at a 20-30% discount, it might be worth it to you.

[Lorax]

Hi Rick, welcome to the "House of Ridgid". As you will find out, some of the guys on this forum are some of Ridgids toughest critics when they need to be.
Dave has given you the straight scoop. I agree with everything he has said. By the way, just saw on CNN that he77 has frozen over. :D
I have the 3650 and have not experienced leg flex problems or motor problems, but as Dave said, there have been some issues reported.
As to question 4 you might be thinking of the bandsaw which doesn't come with a fence or miter gage as some saws do.
If you want a cabinet type saw with a biese type fence then the 3650 is not for you. The 3650 is what it is - a good solid contractor style saw with a decent fence-rail system.
If you do a search for "table saws" you will find comments on just about every saw out there.

[imported_m00n]

Thanks for the great information. You have me wanting to ask, whats wrong with the fence that's on it now?

[Cranky]

Frankly there is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with the fence on there as bought. NADA - nuttin'

But it IS lighter than say a Bies or clone, and may be less strong, therein true, over a long period of time. This won't be known for a long time tho, will it.

Having stated this __and the above seems to be pretty fair observations I'd say_ the GI at about $80 more plus shipping if needed/required or maybe the new Grizzly at $600 to your door may be options better suited for some. The Grizz is facing same thing that 3650 is in being new model and yet to see/read actual users opinions.But based on Grizz's track record I'd wager is going to be a sweet saw.

I caught the discount - after hundreds and hundreds of hours of using here in shop we extremely with these saws and would do it again in a heartbeat. At $600 I'd look hard tho at above 2 options - but I can get the GI so I don't have extra baggage fee to pay.

[imported_m00n]

Thanks guys! I checked with home depot, they don't have the discount going any longer but they do have the lifetime warrante.

Just out of curiosity, why would you guys suggest the GI saw? What makes it better?

[ 01-20-2004, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: m00n ]

[woodworkerjake]

Another lacking accessory to the Ridgid is dado blades. Most dado's won't fit on the TS3650. I have read on another post that Freud can make some custom dado's but I dont' know anybody who has done it. a good DADO set is very good for making joints and grooves in boards.

I have not seen the grizzly but have read a million post about them. The biggest reason I can muster that people really like them is the cost and the fence is a BIES clone. Biesmeyers has been the standard benchmark on fences for many years. There are other options like Incra that is a little more precise for repeat cuts. But if you ever see a Biesmeyer fence. They lock down Accurate and SOLID every single time. Year after year.

I would suggest that if you could get a chance to visit a woodcraft or a local Jet / Powermatic / Delta dealer so you could see the differences in fences and saws you would have a much better understanding of what different companies have to offer. The biggest thing I have against Grizzly is they are a mail order only company and their saw draws higher amperage than most saws with similar power. And like others have mentioned it's an unproven track record. however most owners do like them. For what it's worth.

Jake

[daveferg]

m00n---at to the GI saw----main reason I mentioned it, is that it's in the ballpark of price to the Ridgid---Just gives you some alternatives in your shopping. It's also been around a while and have to admit I'm partial to the Biesemeyer fence. BTW----I also used to think the GI had a Biesemeyer clone, but it's an actual Biesemeyer, licensed to General Internation---a Canadian company.

Not to hijack the thread, but Jake----I'm curious about the problems fitting dados to the 3650. I've heard the new Freud adjustable has problems, but can't you fit a regular stacked set?

[imported_m00n]

Well, perhaps I can give a bit more input as to my needs... I am not a wood worker by trade, actually far from it. I am trying build a modest shop so that I can build some things for our house, perhaps some christmas gifts and what not. So I am looking for something good, but I am not as concerned as someone who was trying to run a full fledged shop might be. Sure I want accurate cuts, but I won't be beating this saw up nearly as much as a regular shop would.

As far as dado's go... That may be a concern as I know that I would eventually like to get into furniture making. However, can a router do the same job?

[Lorax]

I have a regular 8" stacked dado set for my 3650 and it works great. The part that people are having a problem finding is the dado insert which can easily be home-made.
The particular Freud dado blade mentioned in another post requires a longer arbor shaft.

[ 01-21-2004, 02:25 AM: Message edited by: Lorax ]

[daveferg]

Lorax----yea---didn't make sense to me. But, they really should come out with a dado insert.

m00n---you might find it helpful to do some reading on the subject. Kelly Mehler's Table Saw book has some great reading on different table saws, features, etc. Also, American Woodworker did a fine, two part article on buying a table saw---check their web site.

There are basic reasons/advantages to a number of saw features, that really have little or nothing to do with how often you'd be using the saw. For example---a good fence is a must for both accurate cuts as well as safety. A fence that doesn't say aligned, toed in towards the blade, will give you a poor cut and could kick the wood back.

But, in starting out---a good table saw is going to be the center of your shop for many years to come, so don't limit your thinking to just now. Besides, believe me---commercial shops generally don't use contractors' saws as much as you would find cabinet saws at more that a thousand buck more than the saws discussed. Good luck.

[hewood]

Hi m00n - When comparing tools, it's good to make a list of advantages and disadvantages, then decide why you should buy one or the other. At this price range most of the saws available are "good", and most will do what they're supposed to do. But since they all work I like knowing I bought the "best" I could afford.

The new Ridgid is $597 which puts it at even money with the new Grizzly and close to the GI. The Griz has what appears to be a better fence, stronger motor, and an adjustable cast iron miter. Neither the Griz or the 3650 have much track history yet. I'm concerned about the metallurgy and design of the trunnions on the 3650. They're die-cast zinc which is not a particularly strong metal...most are cast iron. The entire trunnion design deviates from a well proven standard design that is well proven. The design could turn out to be better, but at this time we don't know....the choice of metals gives me a hint of the importance they placed on the trunnions....(most people won't notice right?) They're still working out bugs in the 3650... motor vibration caused by bent fans and leg flex are the two most reported. The Ridgid warranty is good, but the customer service has had alot of mixed reviews lately. The Herculift mobile base is nice, but I'd rather see a Biese clone fence in it's place.... I can build a mobile base for $20 in under an hour...an aftermarket caliber fence is alot harder to duplicate. The 36" rip is a plus, but longer rails are not an option....again I'd rather see a better fence in it's place with the option of 52" rip and a long extension table. On the 3650 the fence tightens from both ends which holds nicely, but is more difficult to get squared and can be tightened in an out of square position....not so with the more repeatable t-fence design like the Biese. A good t-fence will only move about 1/64" at the end with about 20# lateral pressure...a good trade off for the repeatability and ruggedness of the steel rails and fence tube. Also, what's with the plastic handle of the Ridgid fence? One good bump on a cold day....makes me shudder.

Also as Dave pointed out the General Intl GI 50-185 is only $53 more than the Ridgid and I believe it's alot more saw - Biese fence, 2hp motor, solid cast iron wings, cast iron miter gauge with track adjustments to take up any slop, metal handwheels, cast throat plate, dado insert, dust pan, accessory racks, solid well proven saw. It's much more comparable to a PM64a, or top of the line Delta or Jet than the Ridgid is.

So to any that have the 3650 and like it....great. I don't want to start anything... It's a fine saw and should serve you well, and if you got it on sale you bought it right. But for those who are shopping, if the Ridgid's not on sale, there are a couple that IMHO are "better" choices....one of which is a proven "best" according to Finewoodworking's 2004 "Tools and Shops" issue.

The important thing is to get the one you like that'll suit your needs. Kick the tires, do as much research as you can, and you'll most likely make the best choice.

[SCWood]

Ridgid has changed the mitre slots on the 3650 they are standard v groove now. I agree the fence is a good fence, it is not top of the line. It is alum not steel. The saw vac system does not need to be a cabinet, Ridgid has enclosed the pick up system without enclosing the cabinet. No one on this site I know of who owns one complains about it. It is a good deal for what you get. I build mostly furniture and have had no problems with it.
SCWood

[woodworkerjake]

Don't shortsell yourself b/c you don't have a full fledged shop. My first TS was a hand me down craftsman lucky for me. B/c using it, I found out what I didn't want in a saw and what I really needed. I started in the 500 dollar price range below ridgid, was considering the ridgid but took about 4 - 5 months researching saws. Visiting stores, getting a feel for what everything offered, reading reviews on amazon. etc etc.

Best advice I got on tablesaws was to get the most you can afford. didn't understand it at first, but if you buy a good saw, it will last your lifetime. I'm only 30 so didn't mind upping my budget a bit. I figured I didn't want to have to replace my saw as I outgrew it. Or have to spend another 300 dollars to upgrade the fence later. I got the powermatic 64A with 50" Bies fence / Cast iron table. Like goin from a kia sophia to a lexus. And It'll feel that way every time I use it over the next 30 years. ;)

Question I asked myself is this. "If I had to choose a car and I was going to be driving that car for the rest of my life and NONE of my options would ever break down in any way. What would it be. Well, I'm not a rolls roycer, but I'd much rather buy a lexus for lifetime car than a hyundai."

Jake

[imported_ChipMaker]

Okay - some more comments I suppose.

The fence is very solid and accurate - but not as solid "feeling" as Bies. Nobody ever claimed it to be - but nobody as yet has said a negative word either.Certainly not me.

The leg flex-not here in any I have used. Maybe it true it has occured to someone - I cannot attest nor seen it.

Motor-solid. Powerful. Lifetime warranty vs General. General has a bit more umpppph but never heard anyone complain on Rigid unless ripping 8/4 or thicker. Then slow it down a tad - problem solved.

Screws - I heard comment(s) from 2 individuals. Not many considering number of machines out there.

Yes-new model. Not much in way of accessories yet but that's to be expected. It's not difficult to make inserts as we all know. No company will "pre" manufacture items until they see market for them - it's ridiculous to expect it. They coming as sales have very good.

While I have several mobile bases that are HM - give me a Herc-Lift anytime. It's a nice feature and costs $50-80 to duplicate with aftermarket universal base.

I personally starting to actually favor the semi-open wing design. Allows me easy setup for some jigs, etc - I was always of "old school" in belief that solid was the "only" way to go. I see many pros - only negative is weight is less but no vibrations here so moot point to me.

On to negatives - cost is within general (no pun intended) striking distance of General_dave's states in $50 range, I think actually more like $80 here currently plus shipping if required (not cheap)and w/o a mobile base if wanted/needed. And it is the same as Bridgewood and some others I guess I will not cover as I am not really qualified having not used. On sale with the 20% off I personally think it was/is best buy out there.

At full retail I have do have a different opinion -I look to the General, maybe the Bridgewood (but distributers and warranty negative IMO) and I suspect without any reservations on the "new model" Grizz will be an excellent one - the company has been putting out, in the mainline products, some excellent tools. The z delivered will $600 so there is Rigid pricing(retail).

The game changes above $700 - really like the PM64 and the DW hybrid is nice too - we talking nearing the $900-1000 range and up loaded with bigger rails, etc so while I like them and feel they wonderful top line items-we also at an entry level, nicely equipped cabinet saw. Like the 1023 from Grizzly (currently $890 at your doorstep). I'll take the Grizz anyday or night or a contractor saw in blink of an eye.

I did not even touch on the Delta models - I have somewhat become disillusioned with them unless you really talking the Uni :D - they good but no longer the "great" contractor saw they were I feel and hear from many who own that I know - but a great buy if you can locate a quality used older vintage model.

Confusing topic - you somewhat "upped" the threshold when you stated making furniture at future point. That's only reason I tossed the last items out at you.

Okay - IMO you will be happy with everyone listed above. It goes from good or very good to great without breaking the bank.

Some stated above and it is important - see and feel them, try if you are able to somewhere. It may be harder to do this say with a Grizzly or Bridgewood but if you not near an outlet ask the company if they can provide a name of customer or ask here or on other forums - we all love to show off our messy shops and ***** or praise about the tools we have. ;)

It's going to be your saw and that is only factor that should decide in the end. What feels great and solid to me may feel totally different to you.

Best of luck in this - unless you are delivered a defective one (they are discussed when it does happen as we all realize. Happy it's rare thing!) I think you'll find it very hard to find anything to complain about regardless of choice made.

I see I did not answer your question - shame on me. "is it generally a good buy?" The answer remains - yes
And yes - a router can do those cuts and often times much better at that.

[ 01-21-2004, 10:59 AM: Message edited by: ChipMaker ]

[imported_m00n]

Thank you guys for all your input. I will go to my local woodcrafters store and see what they have on display. I am still debating slightly to upgrading my options higher than this saw by looking at the dewalt hybrid. However, someone mentioned that with the dewalt, you are paying a bit more for the name. At the same time, i am not sure I want to move all the way up to the $900.00 range either... I know how important good quality tools are, but I have to draw the line some place. smile.gif

[Cranky]

m00n - you don't have to go all that way to get a good saw. As many have stated - many out there that will do job and you actually get to return home with some cash in wallet.

You will find that the DW is a bank breakers too.
General may be a great solution - it's a much beloved machine by all who own it.

Happy shopping

[Cranky]

m00n - just got back from quick run to HD to grab some screws and talked to guy I been doing business with for long time there. He's been told they having another tool sale coming up - was unsure exact dates or amount of discount involved at this point but they are expecting large shipments of things and they have to make room for things which just thrilled him of course :(

If time is not critical it may be worth waiting another week or 2 and see what happens there. 20% off it _ if happened again _ would be great. Even better if it happens before end of month with longer warranty.

He was dead on in December sale and gave me a heads up few times before so I do have some faith in what he says.
Anyway - wanted to toss this at you FWIT

[imported_m00n]

Cranky, thank's so much for the tip!!! Time is not too important. Just that if I do choose this saw i would like to get the lifetime warrante with it is all. :cool:

Just a FYI, I just spoke to someone at woodcraft, he informed me that they will be having an anual 10% discount on all times I think he said Feb/29th? Something like that.

[imported_m00n]

Soooo... I am doing some diggine around the forum here and I am reading some posts down in the Tips and Techniques area.

I must confess that I am a bit curious about the strength of the legs. Not saying that is would happen but, what comes to mind is trying to make a cut with a bit sheet of plywood, something heavy and the legs twist and buckel... That just says disaster to me. Am I being a little too dramatic here or is this a possibility?


Also as far as the motor is concerned, how do I tell if it has issues. Not having the experiance that some of you have puts me at a read dissadvantage to finding these types of issues. :(

[ 01-21-2004, 06:32 PM: Message edited by: m00n ]

[woodworkerjake]

I am not a ridgid supporter but as far as your issues worrying about leg buckling, I think your imagination is getting a little wild on that one. I think the concern was a little twisting when moving a heavy wood i.e. a sheat of dense / heavy wood may have some slight movement in the frame.

Regarding the motors, I see them as an unproven entity. They used to be made by emmerson but emmerson got out of the tool making business. Nobody really knows who oversees quality of them b/c Ridgid had major transfer of ownership / manufacturing not too long ago and some of us are waiting for time to set in to decide on quality & longevity of the tool.

All manufacturers will have a defect from time to time, it's part of the manufacturing process moreso today than in the past b/c tools used to be made on mainland. B/c of competition, tools are mostly being made oversees. This is good b/c we can afford them but mfr glitches come up a bit more often. Even the nicest sawas can have issues come up, but the important thing is how they handle the issue. I bought a 850 dollar Powermatic Contractor saw that came in great condition except one part of my 50 inch rails was bent. They sent me a new one in the mail next day. Was bent again, and my dealer swapped it out with a straight one. my guess is both my rails came from the same batch and somehow a bent batch went out. But the company made sure I got a quality product and was happy.

I also know that mfr I chose will continue that service if I have any problems like a motor issue beyond 90 days and even years from now b/c they have a proven history of providing this type of service. Part of why I chose them.

Most saws in the 600 dollar range and up should last 30 - 50 years or more for a weekend warrior / home improvement guy who doesn't grind em 8 hours a day. Many could handle many years of production work as well.

Jake

[Cranky]

Originally posted by m00n:
Soooo... I am doing some diggine around the forum here and I am reading some posts down in the Tips and Techniques area.

I must confess that I am a bit curious about the strength of the legs. Not saying that is would happen but, what comes to mind is trying to make a cut with a bit sheet of plywood, something heavy and the legs twist and buckel... That just says disaster to me. Am I being a little too dramatic here or is this a possibility?


Also as far as the motor is concerned, how do I tell if it has issues. Not having the experiance that some of you have puts me at a read dissadvantage to finding these types of issues. :( I think the leg flex is "unbelievably" exaggerated and overblown. I was one of first to actually reference it if you look way back - and it was me who said I'd add that long since removed angle iron cross brace - and it was due to not setting up solidly with regard to lift and not the actual saw.

Someone else also stated something - I believe that too was lift related ---- and then it was so grossly "I heard or someone said" misreferenced and blown out of factual proportion it started WWIII and then WWIV :rolleyes:

Well - all one needs to do is read history here and you'll see ALL of it.Worst part is I made mistake about posting this flex questions and resolution---ME. ME. I should have been shot for this :eek:

That's what we mainly do in our shop - cut tons of different kinds of ply on one of the 3650's. It's set to slice 4x8's with outfeed table. The other is used for cutting of everything else. Over a week period I'd wager we cut up more ply than most hobbiest/casual users do in a year. I can assure you the legs are not a problem in strength. Popping a sheet on by myself by literally dropping it on (NOT recommended on any saw)as I have done on "weakened occaison" I have felt a slight shudder but that is almost abuse of a ts.

Motor - well, we never know how any motor will perform until we turn it on. Not meant to be smart "reared" comment at all. I've heard of a bad motor on every product imaginable I think by now. Sometimes it happens.

Having said that I think (?) what you are referencing is the "long screw" thing. I believe it was the 2 saws but someone will correct me if wrong. A couple of screws replaced - that was it.
I have not heard of a motor failure - has anyone here? Feel free to correct me anyone but I don't think this has in fact happened.

The motor is _ as some have said above _ not an Emerson as they were on older model. Would I prefer it to be - I guess maybe. I don't put quite the faith as some do that the Emerson is the best motor out there but it is very good. Frankly we don't know how this one will hold up over the next 5-10 years. But we also don't know how any individual Emerson will either. All I care about is if it's warrantied and that it gets remedied if something should ever happen. Afterthought - Heck for all one knows the specs could be the same as the old motor>>>> they could be could be identical even. We don't know is all I can say. And the General is also in same scenario - most are. Enough on that.

I really am not trying to build up the 3650 - like I have said before - at full retail I'd look to General because of better fence. Assuming one is willing to spend the extra $$$ difference which is more than $50-60 if you need the mobile base. More still if shipping involved. I make it out to be actually closer to $180 and change if these things factored in. Gets a better fence and more hp by 1/2. Track record too. But - $180 would likely get the fence later too if desired.

Get's way to complicated ...... so many factors. I am beat - good night gang

[ 01-22-2004, 03:14 PM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[Cranky]

Originally posted by Cranky:
Jake - you still up too-get some zzzz's :D

Your post wasn't here when I started mine and beat me to post. Just saw it - now I looked at my "time" listed and the thing says after 10pm - it's actually exactly 9:18pm here in MN, I in TC's tonight -hows this work????
At ya tomorrow

[imported_m00n]

I have looked at a few saws now
Dewalt
Jet
Craftsmen
Delta

And the price/quality; best bang for the buck just seems to be the ridgid. I am really impressed with this. Even the Jet $750.00 saw with it's stock arm could not compair to the value of the Ridgid and it's stock arm. The Jets arm moved when you pressed on it, the Ridgid does not...

As far as grizzly and universal? Well, I have not been able to actually see one yet. That's something that's important to me. I very much value the heads up to look that direction, but I really want to see and feel the saw before I plunk down that kind of money. I hope you can understand. :rolleyes:

I think I am sold. I am about 95% positive the Ridgid 3650 is what I am getting. :cool:

As far as the motor goes, my dad is an electrician, he should be able to help me out with the motor... Heck knowing him he would have something laying around that is more powerfull and tell me to take it and hook it up.

The legs? Well, I trust that nothing bad will happen, perhaps my immagination was running wild. I just know how accidents seem to find me. :D

Oh and thank you guys so much for answering all my newbie questions! It's been a great help.

I really think this is going to be the best price/performance saw for me. Sure I can afford more, but I don't want to. I am not even a weekend warrier yet. ;)


Oh yeah, the Jet... I was at the store tonight where it was on display. Neither tinnioning (sp?) jig would even slide down the miter slot... For that matter neither jig would slide down either miter slot and they were supposed to be for that saw table... :eek:

[ 01-21-2004, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: m00n ]

[Smokin'Joe]

I do not know where you are located in OR but maybe there is a General distributer near to look at their model also. Even if it means a short drive. Great ts.
Rigid is good choice also. As covered here - General does have some advantages and if dealer is close to you all the better.
Here's a link to check

http://www.general.ca/english/main.html

http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50175an.html

Re: Jet at store. It is sad fact that most stores cannot seem to grasp concept they need to set up things properly. They deserve to lose customers in manner in which they often do these things-it is incredible. Is it that hard to get it right? Guess so. :rolleyes:

I appreciate the last comment you made on abilty vs desire to pay more. All the above choices are good saws yet the money one can save and use in other things required is indeed a consideration.
And the 3650 will cut well and suit most woodworkers just fine.

[ 01-22-2004, 12:08 PM: Message edited by: Smokin'Joe ]

[woodworkerjake]

Joe this is the second time I'm agreeing with you in a row.. LOL

It is sad hwo people set up tools and make em look like junk. Ever see a delta at Blain's farm & fleet. Looks like junky junk there and beautiful at woodcraft. Go figure.

Curious what saw you saw for 750. If you saw the jetfence, I noticed there can be a little play on the back of the fence when not set up PERFECTLY. If you saw the Jet with Exacta fence, it was set up entirely wrong. You can take a sledge hammer to back of those puppies to get them to move any bit. They're based on saem design as Bies. If you can get a chance to see a biesmeyer they should be available at specialty woodstores. Woodcraft, rockler maybe. I live in chicago area and called Powermatic's 800 number to get a hold of a dealer. I asked if they had the saw I was considering in stock setup adn they did. * I did get misdirected 2 times from PM operator before I got to the right guy *

Bies / Incra and a couple other aftermarket fences are significantly different than ridgids with considerable advantages. They come as accessories for most jets / Deltas, standard on powermatics 64A. If you are considering a bies, you can pick them up on the saws listed for an extra 5- - 100 dollar upgrade.

If you bought later would be roughly a 300 dollar upgrade for any saw. Jetfence, never used, but I had some concerns when I toyed with them at stores. Most say you can line up accurately with them though.

Jake

[imported_m00n]

It was actually at a woodcraft where I seen the Jet last night. It was this saw

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000223M8/104-4504878-7176713?v=glance&s=hi&me=ATVPDKIKX0DER&vi=pictures&img=14#more-pictures
(sorry could not find Jet's website)

Prices at Woodcraft were as follows

Jet 708300K with stock fence = $749.99
Jet 708300K with Exacta fence = $899.99

Oh yeah I did see the beismeier. Nice fence for sure. Unless I can find a saw with the beis for less than 900.00, I am still favoring the Ridgid. The stock fence on the Ridgid that I have seen is far superior to any stock fence on any other saw that I have seen in it's price range. At least saws that I have physically seen and played with.

I will call around today and see of I can find a store that has a Grizz and or General. I would like to see those too before I make buy.

[ 01-22-2004, 01:37 PM: Message edited by: m00n ]

[imported_ChipMaker]

Originally posted by m00n:
It was actually at a woodcraft where I seen the Jet last night. It was this saw

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000223M8/104-4504878-7176713?v=glance&s=hi&me=ATVPDKIKX0DER&vi=pictures&img=14#more-pictures
(sorry could not find Jet's website)

Prices at Woodcraft were as follows

Jet 708300K with stock fence = $749.99
Jet 708300K with Exacta fence = $899.99

Oh yeah I did see the beismeier. Nice fence for sure. Unless I can find a saw with the beis for less than 900.00, I am still favoring the Ridgid. The stock fence on the Ridgid that I have seen is far superior to any stock fence on any other saw that I have seen in it's price range. At least saws that I have physically seen and played with.

I will call around today and see of I can find a store that has a Grizz and or General. I would like to see those too before I make buy. m00n-the fence on the General is in fact a licensed clone of the Bies as they have paid for rights. This has been published in most reviews on these contractor saws.

Read the new grizzly is backordered - some have been waiting almost 3 weeks now. If this is concern that may put it out of decision process.

Jake is right on cost of adding later. Some have been able to buy much cheaper from remfg or scratch-dent sales I've seen posted. If this can be done always I cannot say

General dealer is in Portland - close to you?
When you decide and get one I'd appreciate knowing what one you bought.

[imported_m00n]

General dealer is in Portland - close to you?
When you decide and get one I'd appreciate knowing what one you bought. [/QB]Yes, I actually live just outside of Portland city limits. It the outter ring of the subs. I didn't know there was a General dealer in town. I will definitly give them a call today.

[Smokin'Joe]

Originally posted by m00n:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />
General dealer is in Portland - close to you?
When you decide and get one I'd appreciate knowing what one you bought. Yes, I actually live just outside of Portland city limits. It the outter ring of the subs. I didn't know there was a General dealer in town. I will definitly give them a call today. [/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]I see Portland Tool and Supply and a Barbo listed in the link above-click on distributors on left and US and then state. You are in luck it seems.

[Smokin'Joe]

Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
Joe this is the second time I'm agreeing with you in a row.. LOL

Jake It's the water jake - the water :D

How that new PM of yours??? A friend of mine just ordered one with larger rails also.....5-7 days they told him so sometime late next week hopefully he's up and running too.

Did you put yours up on a mobile base? He's thinking of doing it or even not using legs and mounting on big table type set-up with outfeed. If he does that I would think he's giving up mobility or at very least making it a PITA to do. Outfeed and big rails - need lots of room to do a full swing. Base sounds easier and done with it

What's up o'er there with you? Read above on forum - it was there still. They do get real fickle there don't they. Visited maybe twice since I've been back - something's different or posters changed? Maybe me - days adding up on my health calendar unfortunately.
Take care

[imported_m00n]

I must say that I'm absolutly in awe that people are being so honest on this board.

I just went to the general website and yes I noticed the two location nearby. Should not take more than 20 minutes to get to either. I'll DEFINITLY check out the General before I make any purchases.

BTW, I am not sure exactly how it works with hardware/tools and what not, but I know in the audio world you can generally dicker with the dealers and get better bargans.. Does the same apply for tools?

[daveferg]

Glad you're at least giving the General a look-see---they're worth the time to consider.

As to dickering----it's been widely reported that there isn't much of a mark-up on stationary tools, so a dealer may not have a lot of room to play-----However, doesn't hurt to ask.

What I'd do is go in and explain that you're a new woodworker, starting to put together a shop (read---if you treat me right I'll be back ;) ).
When you focus in on the saw (if that's what you decide on) first ask if they can do any better on the price----if no go-----the next approach is OK---how about throwing in a mobile base, dado insert, rip saw blade, etc.----whatever accessories you want now----if not free, bet you could get a sizable discount on the accessories.

[imported_m00n]

Thanks Dave for the tips smile.gif

Looking at this general (http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50175an.html), I notice that I can get either a left or right cut unit. Are there reasons why I would want to buy one over the other?

[Cranky]

Looking at this general (http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50175an.html), I notice that I can get either a left or right cut unit. Are there reasons why I would want to buy one over the other? [/QB][/QUOTE]

Tilt is a personal preference in my opinion---a million threads and things been said pro-con.

Start here and decide what works best for you and if a sliding table will ever be used.

http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=751979&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1


http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=705449&Forum=All_Forums&Words=left%20tilt&Match=And&Searchpage=5&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=705449&Sear ch=true#Post705449 (http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=705449&Forum=All_Forums&Words=left%20tilt&Match=And&Searchpage=5&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=705449&Search=true#Post705449)

Do a search and you'll read more than you ever want to on this if you so desire. Weeks even worth of reading - and debate rages on.

A year ago some General dealers were said to have offered a small discount if they really hungry to move tools. Highly doubt it now as the currency exchange rates have done the dollar no good - rather than raise some prices they have toed the line on old prices tho which is nice.
Margins always in the extra goodies they sell - these mobiles bases with $3-5 worth of steel in them sell at anywhere from $49 to $100 plus. Imagine that - buy 10 of these spendy bases and you'd have a Grizz 1023 CS. Yep - they make it on accessories. Way to much. :mad:

[ 01-22-2004, 03:10 PM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[woodworkerjake]

Never seen a general in person, but it looks on that picture exactly the same structure as my powermatic 64A with a different coat of paint.. LOL

From switch mount to the base style to everything else. Different cranking handles, mitre guage, blade guard, probably motor too. I would guess the insides are a little different but if bet the casings roll off the same line.

Jake

[woodworkerjake]

60 pound difference on two saws too. Wonder where that's from?

Jake

[imported_m00n]

Called the local General dealer here in town. Only one left as the other went out of biz. Anyway, said he is having a hard time keeping the GI in stock. They sell like hotcakes. Said a new shipment would be in around Feb/6th time frame.

Prices
===========
30" Fence = 639.00
50" Fence = 749.00

[hewood]

Chip - The GI has a Biese fence and it's way under $900 ($650), plus it comes with a dado insert (LOL).

Jake - The guts on the GI look identical to the PM from what I can tell from looking.

[woodworkerjake]

I'd love to poke the two of them side by side, to see how similar / different they are but I'm guessing that'll probably never happen.

hmmpfff

Are there any general dealers in IL. Maybe I'll take some detailed pictures of my saw someday and visit a dealer just for kicks.

How is the finish on the cast iron? the Powermatic came mirror smooth. My delta bandsaw table has swirlmarks all over it?

Jake

[Cranky]

Originally posted by m00n:
Called the local General dealer here in town. Only one left as the other went out of biz. Anyway, said he is having a hard time keeping the GI in stock. They sell like hotcakes. Said a new shipment would be in around Feb/6th time frame.

Prices
===========
30" Fence = 639.00
50" Fence = 749.00 It's been same in this area too. Maybe they don't order enough to start with as independent stores -and then the few distributors that are here seem to be only scattered and when one goes "away" the rest get really over-taxed. You can look at it from a different perspective - they are selling!

Those prices are close to around here. At least if you were to get one you'd not have to deal with the big shipping bill and only have base to add into cost.

Are you heading over to look at it then? May at least put your mind at ease in decision and not second guess either way later

[woodworkerjake]

If they are selling like hotcakes, how come the other dealer went out of business.. LOL

That makes ALOT of sense.

Jake

[hewood]

Jake/Cranky - The surfaces on the GI are about the same as the PM64a, not quite as reflective as the PM66, but nice. I swear, the two saws are made in the same plant. After a year of "memorizing" my saw, when I go into a dealer and see a PM, the biggest differences are the blade guard and the miter gauge. There are minor differences in the fences, but are pretty similar in design and are functionally about equal.

[Cranky]

Originally posted by hewood:
Chip - The GI has a Biese fence and it's way under $900 ($650), plus it comes with a dado insert (LOL).

Jake - The guts on the GI look identical to the PM from what I can tell from looking. hewood - I know they license the bies and have rights. The ones I have seen never actually state bies on them but just a grab and lock and it's apparent as heck.

"guts" - they do huh? It'd be fun to gut all these things and do a looksy. So many appear similar on all tools. Especially these bandsaws -paint 'em this or that and relabel and sell the HF as a Jet! :D Now tha'd be some kinda profit - heck with the labeled small margin things ;)

[Cranky]

Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
If they are selling like hotcakes, how come the other dealer went out of business.. LOL

That makes ALOT of sense.

Jake (whispered to Jake) it was those dang Delta and other brands that they had to floor plan and don't sell so fast ...... carrying the paper killed 'em. ;)

The 2 I have seen go under actually sold pretty much all brands . One was into reselling used stuff too.Both were independent stores and while big they really didn't seem to be able to offer much in way of discounts. Or elected not to, dunno. It's hard to compete with the BORG's on prices for mainstream stuff and how many big ticket items can these places turn anyway? It's a tough business.

[woodworkerjake]

hewood,

I'm not gonna argue that. No such thing as patents in some of the asian countries.. LOL

But I don't like spreading rumors. However the dealer where I bought my PM told me that some of the discount tool companies like grizzly &lt; not sure if general is in that group or not &gt; sell tools that companies like Powermatic & Delta & jet reject for quality reasons.

Maybe the tool mfr's sell overproduction to them, maybe they sell quasi defective ones. I really don't know. However I'm trying to figure this out over time and am always keeping my ear to the pavement for credible information in this arena. That was just something that peaked my interest when he says they don't always have them. And backorder. I had backorder on my 50" rails, but every dealer I go to has most saws in stock unless there's a big sale and are quickly replenished when they're out.

Just some food for thought? Anybody have any input gladly listen :D

Also. I don't think the PM 66 could have a better finish.. LOL. Really. It's like a frigging mirror. my guess is they have same finish on cast iron. Only downside is I always catch myself polishing it b/c I want to keep it that way. So maybe it's not such a good thing

Jake

[hewood]

Jake - I'd be scared to death to put that first scratch on a PM66!

You know enough about business to realize that Grizzly and GI wouldn't stay in business long selling PM rejects. Did you mean parts like the 50" PM rails? LOL! :D When's the last time you heard a General owner complain of something breaking or being out of tolerance? It happens to all companies sooner or later, but if it were an everyday occurrence they'd have to run the business like HF. Not sure that Griz and GI are all that similar anyway. I own both and think the GI is a step up. Better finish anyway. Usually GI gets a premium over Griz...could be the dealer's cut...

Sorry if we're stealing the thread, but at least we seem to be enjoying the discussion!

[imported_m00n]

No no no.. Your not steeling it at all. I am very much enjoying reading it.

The GI dealer also told me also on the phone that unless I ordered on the phone that I was taking a risk of them all being sold by the time they arrived. Said that two of them on order were already sold. Leaving 3 that were not. Said there may be some left when they arrive, and maybe not. Guess I could just take my chances. Oh and no chance for any kind of discount either.

Damn... This is hard. I really want to keep that extra 150.00 and apply it to something like a scroll saw or something, at the same time, I want a SOLID PROVEN table saw.

I have to admit, I am starting to lean towards the GI now. Was perfectly happy with the Ridgid until you guys had to cast doubts in my head. Now I about to drive myself nuts with this decision :D

[woodworkerjake]

yeah sorry bout the thread steal.. LOL

Hewood you are right. I also know that these tools even in taiwann or china are not free. Shipping alone is prohibitive. There has to be something in there that allows their production cost to be sizeably different. Like I said. I don't have an answer today. If you chage less you have to take that money out of some pocket

Customer service
Design
Distribution
Production
Profit

Not many companies are willing to work for free so that leaves the 4 other areas to work from.

I personally have walked through harbor freight and most every tool ( the free standing ones ) I see their is kinda junky to me. However I'm happy to buy a set of wrenches there. However I read lots of people harp on how great they are. I like to use my own experience over other's opinions unless I know the individual and their credibility personally. My problem is I haven't seen or used either of these. So I'm just boffled.. LOL

Jake

[daveferg]

m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322----

[Lorax]

Moon,
Does the GI dealer have one on display? If so, go and check it out. Shake it, twist it, play with the miter gage and fence and handwheels. I assume you have already done the same with the Ridgid. Which one "feels better" to you? That's the one you want! tongue.gif

[imported_ChipMaker]

Originally posted by daveferg:
m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322---- Not quite - the difference above is $53 and big jump from what they quoted. Only a retailer can take and make this type of mark-up and get away with it. Unless my math is wrong they increased price by nearly $110. 749-639=110
Does anyone believe the cost to distributer from General for the upgrade is more than $40? at high end? I don't - that's what the spread was just a month or so back when some in MN and NY were wandering over border to pick up there.
Everyone needs to make money and when the item is ordered on your behalf they make even more. No floor planning - no inventory - just profit.
The Rigid 3650 sale price is truly starting to look like the most incredible buy of 2003 for those that received it. Some had 30% discount - a decent saw for $420 - the same price of some of these universal motored Delta and Craftsman and like.
I cannot see how they can ever duplicate that sale - just not enough margin there. Congratulations to all who did

[ 01-23-2004, 09:05 AM: Message edited by: ChipMaker ]

[Cranky]

Originally posted by Cranky:
Looking at this general (http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50175an.html), I notice that I can get either a left or right cut unit. Are there reasons why I would want to buy one over the other? Tilt is a personal preference in my opinion---a million threads and things been said pro-con.

Start here and decide what works best for you and if a sliding table will ever be used.

http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=751979&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1


http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=705449&Forum=All_Forums&Words=left%20tilt&Match=And&Searchpage=5&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=705449&Sear ch=true#Post705449 (http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&Number=705449&Forum=All_Forums&Words=left%20tilt&Match=And&Searchpage=5&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=705449&Search=true#Post705449)

Do a search and you'll read more than you ever want to on this if you so desire. Weeks even worth of reading - and debate rages on.

A year ago some General dealers were said to have offered a small discount if they really hungry to move tools. Highly doubt it now as the currency exchange rates have done the dollar no good - rather than raise some prices they have toed the line on old prices tho which is nice.
Margins always in the extra goodies they sell - these mobiles bases with $3-5 worth of steel in them sell at anywhere from $49 to $100 plus. Imagine that - buy 10 of these spendy bases and you'd have a Grizz 1023 CS. Yep - they make it on accessories. Way to much. :mad: [/QB][/QUOTE]

Read your post ___ Now I got ya hooked o'er on woodnet too m00n - see how this thing goes! ;)
Gonna say this also - and mean it in all sincerity. You gettin' mighty mighty close at $749 to the Griz 1023 range, especially if you have to pay sales tax there. If one reaches to higher shelf to get something the next level is just a tad higher. Full blown CS vs a TS. Another $126 gets ya there, less if ya pay sales tax. To me now anyway I'd really have to chew on this.

I'd definetly myself jump to the Griz but I can justify it based on these numbers. And while I don't need a big ol' CS I know I'd use it alot and can therein justify other side too. Not sure if this will apply to you as much even at future date based on what you've stated. You may or may not.Goes back to the "how much is enough and how much is to much" thing. This is where we all part ways......................

I was lucky sales priced buyer of 3650-almost 2 for the price of 1 Griz. Darn near 2 for price of one GI at that.

Oh boy - I will further muddy the waters now :rolleyes:
Sorry

[ 01-23-2004, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[Cranky]

Originally posted by ChipMaker:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by daveferg:
m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322---- Not quite - the difference above is $53 and big jump from what they quoted. Only a retailer can take and make this type of mark-up and get away with it. Unless my math is wrong they increased price by nearly $110. 749-639=110
Does anyone believe the cost to distributer from General for the upgrade is more than $40? at high end? I don't - that's what the spread was just a month or so back when some in MN and NY were wandering over border to pick up there.
Everyone needs to make money and when the item is ordered on your behalf they make even more. No floor planning - no inventory - just profit.
The Rigid 3650 sale price is truly starting to look like the most incredible buy of 2003 for those that received it. Some had 30% discount - a decent saw for $420 - the same price of some of these universal motored Delta and Craftsman and like.
I cannot see how they can ever duplicate that sale - just not enough margin there. Congratulations to all who did </font>[/QUOTE]This got me curious so I made a call.
GI 50-185 w/ 52" rails and router insert is now $611.85 USD ---- if ya willing to drive to get over border that is (this was outta ThunderBay area) ;)
Man - the dollar is getting weaker by the day. I looked and got pricing last spring on this-plus $60 in 9 months. Good for those living just north of me no doubt. And I do love all ya cannuckers I do. Best fishin' waters in the world too. :D

[woodworkerjake]

cranky you're a smart cookie

I heard on the news the other day that european vacations are steepening for the rason you mentioned bout dollar weakening. In the neighborhood of 20 % more expensive today then just a year or 2 ago. Maybe this will help us with exportation of jobs &lt; I SURE HOPE SO &gt;

REgarding them being kind to us about not raising prices. This is because we are still the largest consumer market in the world. Don't wanna buck the bull. :D

Jake

[Cranky]

Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
cranky you're a smart cookie

I heard on the news the other day that european vacations are steepening for the rason you mentioned bout dollar weakening. In the neighborhood of 20 % more expensive today then just a year or 2 ago. Maybe this will help us with exportation of jobs &lt; I SURE HOPE SO &gt;

REgarding them being kind to us about not raising prices. This is because we are still the largest consumer market in the world. Don't wanna buck the bull. :D

Jake Good point - we buy bundles down here don't we :D

They probably could get away with it tho as so dang manner others sure as heck passing it thru and on us.Guess it be what goes around comes around or whatever.

Helluva a time to head to Europe now - some friends did it at Christmas and they gonna be paying for it for a long time.....all on CC's at that. Kinda foolish way to go IMO....but hey-we only here a short time I guess so whatever trips ones trigger.
They coulda sent us eh! We coulda brought e'm back some pictures and a trinket too. ;)

[daveferg]

Chipmaker----sorry but, I ommitted the price difference between the extension table inserts between the two sizes of fence.

I'm a bit confused. Is the $611 a higher Canadian price? A weak dollar actually raises the cost of imports.

In any event, that is one heck of a deal. Wonder if you have to pay duty, coming back over the border?

Good luck m00n.

[Cranky]

Originally posted by daveferg:
Chipmaker----sorry but, I ommitted the price difference between the extension table inserts between the two sizes of fence.

I'm a bit confused. Is the $611 a higher Canadian price? A weak dollar actually raises the cost of imports.

In any event, that is one heck of a deal. Wonder if you have to pay duty, coming back over the border?

Good luck m00n. Yes - it is higher now. No duty - taxes if paid refunded with paperwork at border also. Not sure what the dollar limit is but you can get both the TS and jointer and not exceed it.

Proximity here to Canada is likely why they light on distributers around here. WI and MN folks always seem to spend time fishing and such and easy to just add a extra trip a little further at that. Scott at the Thunder Bay place said about 2 of every 3 sold thru them goes south across border thru MN. Not surprised - seen many pick-ups with "big boxes" in bed pulling a boat going thru Customs. Used to be real fast - now suppose slower with all issues. Would be with or without goodies tho.
If one can do it that way it's a savings. Warranty is still covered as usual.

[ 01-23-2004, 11:24 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[imported_m00n]

Hey all... Still very tempted by the ridgid... Allows me a little wiggle room for a few nice blades.

[Cranky]

Originally posted by m00n:
Hey all... Still very tempted by the ridgid... Allows me a little wiggle room for a few nice blades. So the woodnet gang didn't chase you away from it then?! It gets mighty "interesting" there. Sometimes to much for me even :rolleyes:

No jake-not you ;)


If this saw ends up being the one - if you can hold off for bit I'd maybe do so and see if the sale does appear - wouldn't be surprised to see it kick in about the day the switch warranty (if they don't extend again)

[imported_m00n]

Chase me away? Oh no... I have a tough hide. :D

I do have a question about the saw. The miter dial gage plaque thing (parden the newbie terms). Can that be replaced with something more accurate? That is the only thing I have seen on the saw that I don't care much for...


Thanks

[woodworkerjake]

Ever notice woodnet is full of grizzly thumpers. If you mention any tool but that, they say you can get X exact same tool for cheaper. I think it's funny how every web forum tends to attract different tool buyers.

I found another that is pretty pro ryobi and less expensive tools.

Take everything with a grain of salt. Most saws in the 500 + range are good. After that it depends on what you want.

Jake

[imported_m00n]

Jake, thanks! I feel comfortable with this purchase. The only think that is causing me to NOT make that 100% choice is the doubt that people have put in my mind.

Again, anyone know if the miter dial plaque thing can be changed?

[hewood]

Yes - There are lots of aftermarket miter gauges that'll be more accurate. Pricing goes from about $30-$200 and up.

[imported_m00n]

Thank you! VERY good to know! :cool:

[imported_m00n]

I'm off to HD to go by that ridgid! Woot!

[woodworkerjake]

Cool,

Hope you enjoy your new toy.

Jake

[woodworkerjake]

Awh man,

I just realized something. Does this mean that we have to hijack another thread.. lol

I was kindof enjoying this one

:D :confused: :eek: :D

Jake

[imported_m00n]

Perhaps Jake... Perhaps!

I occured to me tonight that I have a cousin who works for Home Depot. Gave her a jingle. She was not able to get me a employee discount, BUT, she can get me a 10% coupon. She said that about this time of year HD gives thier employees a discount coupons, said she would give me hers! Yippie. I also got two Freud Diablo blades. One 24 tooth the other is a 80 tooth... Two C-Clamps for putting the saw together and two new combo 16" combo squares.

I WAS SOOOOOOOO TEMPTED to get the Ridgid planer/jointer unit.... So tempted. Could, wanted to but... Oh hell... I still may.

[Cranky]

Congrats my man - you'll be happy. And I'm sure it will serve you well. Gets to the point you have heard so many opinions both ways you sit back, say whoaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Heck - I'm buying this one! :D

jake - I want to locate a forum of primarily Black and Decker users that doesn't allow anyone else in......they do eye scan before you allowed to enter. Know where I can find it-I lost my bookmark ;)

[ 01-24-2004, 10:12 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[Cranky]

Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
Awh man,

I just realized something. Does this mean that we have to hijack another thread.. lol

I was kindof enjoying this one

:D :confused: :eek: :D

Jake yes it' does ..... wassssssssssss the next one gonna be smile.gif :eek: :D

[imported_m00n]

Crany, it will be someone just like me asking the same ol question. ;)

I'm afraid to go over to the woodnet forums. They are brutal over there. There is as of last night a 8 page long tread on this saw and other issues. I have not had a chance to catch up on all of it since it was six pages long. I was gonna go post last night saying I bought my ridgid, but, I seen I had a lot of reading to do first.

[woodworkerjake]

Yeha woodnet can be brutal sometimes on the toolfront... lol. But it's ag reat place to learn. Especially in the first forum about techniques and projects. I just hit the point with tool that I say my piece, try to get people to look at everything and slow their decision making and give my point and shuddup. Sometimes I get sucked in though.

Cranky YOU pick the next forum. I'll jump in.

Can you believe I had a 2nd good HD experience in a row today. Decided to get tools off floor and make pegboard framed with wood today. I had my tools on everything. floor / toolbox / new and old tablesaw. Couldn't find a thing.

LOL

Jake

[Cranky]

Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
Yeha woodnet can be brutal sometimes on the toolfront... lol. But it's ag reat place to learn. Especially in the first forum about techniques and projects. I just hit the point with tool that I say my piece, try to get people to look at everything and slow their decision making and give my point and shuddup. Sometimes I get sucked in though.

Cranky YOU pick the next forum. I'll jump in.

Can you believe I had a 2nd good HD experience in a row today. Decided to get tools off floor and make pegboard framed with wood today. I had my tools on everything. floor / toolbox / new and old tablesaw. Couldn't find a thing.

LOL

Jake You and m00n - gloats and gloats and having fun...that be the way it should be. Happy as he!! for you both. :D

I think I'll avoid hijacking one on the 8" jointer but tempted as needing one now for big project.

I guess we need to keep eyes open and grab when the "gitten's good".

HD - twice! Great ---- I won't hex it by saying anything more &gt;&gt;&gt;whispering sooooo softly&lt;&lt;&lt; maybe they turning the corner at all locations. I'd say my satisfaction rating now at a 6.5 of 10.
Not bad really factoring in everything. If they ever hit an 8 I'd say it best I personally can expect based on business model. I'll always dream of a 10 tho

So - glue up dry and all finished? Are you putting a finish on them?
You done it now too ---- when they up ya have no excuse for mess anymore. See what you did to yourself ;)

[woodworkerjake]

Not done yet. Glue not working all that well that I'm using. Frame is fine though. I'll have to play around with some ideas tomorrow if Gorilla glue doesn't set into pegboard. Not gonna finish it for a lil while. Size will be varrying for a little while. Once I got a handle on how big and proportions, I'll consider a nice border out of scrapwood and worry about some finishing possibly.

Home Depot is only a block from my house so I've given them a million 2nd chances. LOL. Doing well as of recent. But had lots of bad experiences before that. tongue.gif

Jake

[imported_m00n]

You guys know what?


I have 3 bolts and 3 nuts left over. I don't know where they go. Ohhhhh LOL! This aint good cause I have no desire to go back and try to figure out where they go.

You know... I was asked by someone to report how it went. I must say I really like the saw, BUT the instruction manual needs a LOT of work.

[woodworkerjake]

Moon,

From what I hear from other tool owners. THEY ALL DO.

I don't thing the folks that write technical manuals for these tools have ever put together a saw. A well tuned saw has become a RIGHT OF PASSAGE. Besides, how could they sell so many table saw books if it were EASY.
:D
Jake

[Lorax]

M smile.gif smile.gif N,
The 3 nuts and bolts are for attaching an aux fence. It's in the manual. pg 52 I believe. I have heard that Ridgid assembly manuals are among the best out there, so if you don't like the Ridgid manual, you're gonna hate the other ones. So, enough of that. How's that puppy run? Made any sawdust yet?

[imported_m00n]

Phew, good to know about the extra bolts.

Oh yeah, I have made some sawdust. :cool: Saw cuts VERY nice. First time I have ever used a tablesaw so I have nothing to compaire it to but damn, smooth as butter going through some 1/2 pine. Don't have any hard wood to run over it yet.

All in all. I am very happy I purchased this saw over the GI. It's saved me a little money and I am perfectly happy with this saw. :D

[imported_ByteButcher]

m00n

The manual definitely is lacking. One of the posts claimed he set up the saw in 3 hours. I don't know how. I spent 15 minutes myself just reading through the manual to find out what the 3 bolts were for. The rails and fence took me at least 2 hours. After shimming the rails per instructions, the fence was tighter on one end that the other. I should have known that process wouldn't work since it doesn't guarantee the rails will be parallel. Unfortunately they don't warn you of that until the rip fence instructions and then they only say "more shimming may be required". The second time around, I started with 2 shims at each bolt in the center section so the rail would defintely clear the extensions and then bolted up just the center. The rails measured straight and parallel at that point so I could accurately measure the shim thickness at the extension bolts. Unfortunately there weren't quite enough shims supplied for this process so I had to get some more. While I was at it, I drilled a new hole in the extension to relocate the right, front rail bolt out near the end to better support the rail.

The only reason shimming is required is because the extensions are not machined perfectly square. It would simplify things to make the extensions slightly smaller than the main table so there is no chance they will protrude. Then the rails could be bolted directly to the main table with shims only on the extensions. If the table is machined parallel, the rails will be parallel.

[Cranky]

The manual does leave a tiny bit to be desired but having stated that I think it's the one of best manuals I have ever seen from a manufacture. That doesn't say a lot for the vast majority of them now, does it!

Setup will vary with user and if they've done setup of equipment in past. 3-4 hours is realistic IMO and then additional fine tuning after some cuts to be expected.

Be happy - at least you had some extra parts. More is always better. Nothing more irritating than trying to assemble something and the parts bag short........doesn't cost that much to add extra of everything for us fumble fingered assemblers.

Yep - extra is better ;)

[ 01-26-2004, 09:09 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]

[imported_m00n]

I got lucky, I didn't have to do any shimming. When I put my wings on, the back and fronts were aligned up perfactly and square.

As far as time to setup my saw? I took my time, "tried" to read the instructions as carefully as possible. I would say it took me about 5~6 hours. Yeah I know it took a while but at least I know it's put together right. ;)

[ 01-26-2004, 10:35 AM: Message edited by: m00n ]