better batteries for ridgid why not Lithium Ion?

[Polar Sparky 1224]

Other brands have different tools using just one type of battery. Why not make lithium ion batteries that are compatable with the excisting 18v tools? I have only seen a few people that will get the v28 and that was bought with government money / my taxes. It would be great to have a battery that worked with my drill and the charger without buying a new combo pack.

[thermokitty]

Thats a GOOD idea!! I'd upgrade to Lithium for my 6 18v Ridgid tools.

[Bubahyde]

Well If not Lithium, PLEASE USE NiMh

Nickel-metal-hydride batteries. Found currently only on the Makita and Panasonic drills, NiMH batteries tend to offer longer run time per charge and no memory, without toxic cadmium, an environmental disposal hazard. Besides eliminating toxic cadmium, which should be discarded at designated collection centers, NiMH cells weigh less than comparable NiCads and outlast them.

[snowsquirrel]

You mean ridgid drills don't come with NiMH batteries!? I thought that was only the low end stuff like ryobi/skil/etc.

~S

[plumber]

Another manufacturer, one that has already marketed lithium tools for almost a year looked at and test marketed NIMH technology but discarded it after they found that they are horrible cold weather performers and in fact do not outlast NiCad battery packs.

As lithium patent and licensing contracts expire we will see most tool companies offering this technology. i have both Lithium and Nicad. I like them both but the lithium tools are stronger, and last longer by far. the biggest thing about my red lithium is that they offer fade free performance and don't drop off like the NiCad. A big deal when on a large roof or in a confined space, or 1000 feet from the power source.

[Polar Sparky 1224]

You mean ridgid drills don't come with NiMH batteries!? I thought that was only the low end stuff like ryobi/skil/etc.

~S

As well as: Milwaukee, Dewalt, Bosch, Hitachi, Porter Cable, very few brands use NiMH.

[plumber]

Sparky,

I met a stupid electrical apprentice today. Should I get my suit pressed? :D

[Polar Sparky 1224]

he didn't have foot in mouth did he?:D

[plumber]

No, but it was open all day and he never said anything.

On another note related to your topic check out my post under power tools titled "News just Announced". It pertains exactly to your post.

[snowsquirrel]

I was under the impression that all the upper end tools uses nimh, though this was wrong (see above posts). I was also under the impression that nimh was superior in every way. But it turns out I was wrong. NiCd batters offer almost double the duty cycle of NiMh batteries. This is the best article I have found on the subject: http://blogs.toolbarn.com/mattg/2005/12/cordless-tool-batteries-primer.html

Hope it helps you, it only made my decision harder. ;-)

~S

[Polar Sparky 1224]

I had the time to look on the Milwaukee site and found the article about the Li ion 18v batteries. That is exactly what ridgid should do for us! I won't buy a totally new set of power tools just because the battery last longer but costs more. Considering I spent a total of $514 for a ridgid combo with 3 batteries a mail in rebate and two batteries on special. Milwaukee although it is cool costs $749 before tax and only has two batteries. On the other hand some people will find it worthwhile since i have heard how some guys have never had to charge a battery all day. But then i haven't charged a battery yet today.

Longer run time is obviously better but how does Li Ion do in the cold?

[plumber]

Sparky,

It does very, very well in the cold. much better than Nicad or Nimh. And the weight savings is great. Lighter tools means less fatigue at the end of the day.

[Polar Sparky 1224]

So which brand do you have and for how long? What do you use your tools for?

[snowsquirrel]

What is that about Milwaukee 18v lithium batteries? I couldn't find mention of them on the milwaukee site, only their v28 stuff. I prefer Makita's approach of using Lithium to cut weight, and sticking to 18v.

Going NiCd to NiMH is possible. There are 'howtos' on how to buy the cells, and install them in casings. But from what I have read on the lithium stuff, this would not be possible. It sounds like there is all kinds of 'smarts' built into both the lithium batteries, and chargers. This also means battery prices will remain high for while.

On the topic of cold weather... you mention that the Lithium is good in cold weather. That is interesting, as supposedly that was one of the lithium cons. Can anyone comment on the diff b/n NiMH and NiCd in cold? I am see-sawing between getting a bosch or a ridgid right now, and bosch use NiMH. Although Makita's 18v Lith at less weight that Ridgid and Bosch's 14.4 is definitely appealing. But still a $100 more, so likely not an option, unless I can sneak it by the wife. :-)

Thanks,

~S

[Polar Sparky 1224]

Here is the article from their website.....even if i'm not a bitg fan of milwaukee tools...

http://www.milwaukeetool.com/us/en/news.nsf/vwPressReleases/C467C2658E9A992D862570ED005C92AB?OpenDocument&nav2=hdc

[36volt]

What is that about Milwaukee 18v lithium batteries? I couldn't find mention of them on the milwaukee site, only their v28 stuff. I prefer Makita's approach of using Lithium to cut weight, and sticking to 18v.

Going NiCd to NiMH is possible. There are 'howtos' on how to buy the cells, and install them in casings. But from what I have read on the lithium stuff, this would not be possible. It sounds like there is all kinds of 'smarts' built into both the lithium batteries, and chargers. This also means battery prices will remain high for while.

On the topic of cold weather... you mention that the Lithium is good in cold weather. That is interesting, as supposedly that was one of the lithium cons. Can anyone comment on the diff b/n NiMH and NiCd in cold? I am see-sawing between getting a bosch or a ridgid right now, and bosch use NiMH. Although Makita's 18v Lith at less weight that Ridgid and Bosch's 14.4 is definitely appealing. But still a $100 more, so likely not an option, unless I can sneak it by the wife. :-)

Thanks,

~S

Bosch is not NiMH. Ridgid just announced their 2.5AH batteries so I doubt you will see Ridgid Li-Ion batteries anytime soon, at least until that push is over and done with. Maybe it'll be Milwaukee: Li-Ion, and Ridgid: Ni-Cd.

Lithium Ion batteries are a little more complicated than Ni-Cd and Ni-MH. No cell swapping or upgrading for a while. I'll stop short of saying never, but not for a long time. Maybe I'm wrong, we'll see.

I think the DeWalt, Bosch and Metabo approach of 36 volt tools will prevail. The world has already acknowledges 18V as the standard (by market share) and if the new batteries have the same weight and more runtime then I'll think you'll see more manufacturer's follow suit. Nice approach from Makita, but I think 36 volt will prevail.

From my other post: Bosch, DeWalt, Makita, Milwaukee, and Metabo are all releasing Li-Ion tools. They would be foolish to do this if they did not perform in the cold. So, long way around, they will work just fine in cold weather.

[plumber]

Sparky, I have two 28v Li ion drills and have had them for about 6 or 7 months. They perform very well in the cold weather. I use them as a professional plumber in commercial and industrial applications and around the home for personal projects. I have several 18v tools as well as many, many corded tools. Have used Dewalt, Delta, Bosch and Craftsman, even used a Ryobi once but don't tell anyone ;). Also have been told by a steel processing companies maintenance superintendent that the Ridgid drills he bought for his crews were inadequate. He used different language, but out of respect to others here I won't use it. There are many posters here who are happy with their Orange.

There are also different chemical make ups in the different Lithium tools by the different makers. The 28v system has the advantages mentioned and weighs the same as the 18v.

The new 18v won't have more power per se but will have the extended run time and weigh almost 25% less. They will also work on the older tools so existing Milwauke owners can upgrade, get less weight and more run time without buying additional tools. And the new soon to be available charging station will have ports for both lithium and nicad. Their "tool talk" web site representitive stated the new radio will run on either NiCad or Lithium and have 50% more boost. (which may not be a good thing when five different trades each have a radio)

Since I have yet to hold another makers new 36 volt tools I cannot say if they are very good or very bad, we just have to wait and see. If they do not weigh a lot more than Milwaukee then they should do very well, but there was a reason the 24v NICads didn't sell well and that was weight.

An extremely important factor for me is that most of my tools are made right here in the USA. Not all but most.

[snowsquirrel]

Thanks for the link. I think at least some bosch tools are NiMH. The www.boschtools.com site is down (again), but here is an example of an nimh bosch: http://www.toolstation.com/shop/PowerTools/BoschDrills/d40/sd2625

[Polar Sparky 1224]

I just remembered why my LED light won't work in the morning, It's powered with NiMH and i had to warm them up to see anything. An led light can be powered by an almost dead niccad battery when a xenon bulb won't even glow. I was at first attracted to makita tools because of what i heard about the batteries but i hated the style of the drills, some of which were to small for my hands.