Soldering Threaded Brass Fittings

[Ski John]

I recently ordered a faucet from Husdon Reed (Ultra Group England). The faucet valves are 1/2" theaded valves, however the thread depth is more shallow that normal 1/2" MIP to 5/8" OD comression fiitings. As a result the fitting bottoms-out in the valve before getting a good seal (even with a lot of teflon tape). I have already cracked one valve by over tightening the fitting to get a seal. Hudson Reed replaced the whole assembly under warrantee but I still am having seal problems (slow drip on pressure side).

1. Can a threaded brass fitting be soldered after being hand tightened?
2. Can the cracked valve be repaired (brased or epoxied) if the crack is small and not on the pressure side (down stream to faucet)?

[ralphtheplumber]

British Standard pipe threads are different than American (NPT) threads.. but I guess you already figured that out.

You need to call them back and get some bsp-to-npt adapters.

I'm surprised they gave you another valve.

[Ski John]

I have requested the adapters, we shall see if they appear. Hudson Reed does appear to have a good no questions warrantee. I can get five of the six connections leak proof, but have one with a very slow drip (like a hanging bubble of water). Four connections held with teflon tape and one with Great White teflon paste.

[PLUMBER JAY]

Ralph
i don't think ski john has a faucet with british standard threads. the one time that i came across this NPT would not thread one more than one or two threads.

Ski john what type of fitting are you using on the faucet?
A coupling or a braided supply with a rubber seat?

[plumbdog10]

Is there a particular reason why you are using this faucet? Good luck finding repair parts, etc.

[Ski John]

The valves and mixing tee provided by the vendor all have female 1/2" threaded connections (they expect you to connect with tube or pipe). Since the vendor supplied what appears to be 1/2" (similar threads to MIP) x 15mm OD compression fittings, I purchased 1/2" MIP x 5/8" OD compression fittings.

The main difference between the adaptors I bought and the ones provided by the vendor is the lengther of the 1/2" threads, the ones I bought are longer (deeper), which is why I cracked the first valve cranking it down to get a seal.

I tested the adaptors provided by the vendor, and they are actually a looser fit. The instructions say to use teflon tape, and that got most of them sealed but I still have one with a very slow leak.

Provided that the vendor cannot provide the correct adaptors, I am thinking about undoing the adaptor from the valve, cleaning it, reinstalling hand tight and then soldering the 1/2" threaded connection. If if works it makes that connection perminant, however I could still un-couple the valve from the pipe with at the compression side of the adapter.

Will the soldering work between a threaded brass fitting and valve?

[Ski John]

Plumbdog,

Good point about replacement parts. This manufacturer is marketing into the US and Canada. The faucets appear to be high quality and about 25% price of the Moen equivalent (at least for this style). The selection of different designs is also very impressive. This faucet is wall mounted for a bowl style lav basin and available in brushed nickle.

When I called the vendor about the cracked valve, they were not only quick to replace the part but they sent an entire faucet replacement kit (both valves, handles, everything - accept the correct adapters). So I now have a full set of replacement parts.

Final back-up plan is that my brother-in-law lives in England and could get me spare parts, or I toss it in the trash and get the Moen.

[plumbdog10]

Ski John: "...and about 25% price the Moen equivalent (at least for this style)."

Yea.....well...... the Moen does not require special fittings and the repair parts are available. I'm not sure this qualifies as "the equivalent". Maybe cosmetically, but not truthfully.


If the threads are the same, the lenghth is not important unless they are way too short. If they are the correct threads you went over-board tightening them. Getting threads super-duper-delux tight does not prevent leaks.

Advice: buy name brand plumbing fixtures, have pro's install them.

[Ski John]

plumbdog,

This is more of a hobby than a necessity, and it is not a critical service (I am leaving the fittings exposed with the wall open until I can get a hydro-pressure test to hold), so I will be doing it myself.

Do you have any suggestions to my original question? I am in the industial construction business and we normally backweld SS/CS threaded fittings on hazardous and/or high pressure applications. So it would seem logical that brass fittings can be back soldered to eliminate slow leaks in this case.

JC

[plumbdog10]

Ski John,

Assuming both are brass they could be soldered. However, you would be soldering a cap around the top, rather than gaining penatration of the socket. Standard plumbing "soft solders" are not recommended for this, and will often result in leaks months down the line. If you are determined to go this route I would suggest silver brazing it togather. With brass you would need to flux it as well. I would also recommend disassembing the faucet to prevent damage to seals.

If Plumber Jay is right about it being BSPT you can get adaptors through McMaster-Car. They will ship to you, and it can be returned if it is the wrong size. See http://www.mcmaster.com

Go to page 28 of their catalog.

Good Luck.

[ralphtheplumber]

Ralph
i don't think ski john has a faucet with british standard threads. the one time that i came across this NPT would not thread one more than one or two threads.

I based that on having a U.K. manufacturer and "the threads not fitting".. seemed like the most likely explanation to me.. I'm not really familiar with that brand.

I could be wrong.

[plumbdog10]

I based that on having a U.K. manufacturer and "the threads not fitting".. seemed like the most likely explanation to me.. I'm not really familiar with that brand.

I could be wrong.

Sorry Ralph, I was thinking Jay wrote the above.

That's why I suggested McMaster-Car, because they can be returned.

I'm no expert on British threads but I know there is also a British straight thread that is sometimes used.

[Ski John]

Thanks Plumbdog,

I will do a test on the cracked valve to double check.

JC

[Australian Plumber Josh]

I know its old school.

But on critical threaded joints i find i cant beat Hemp and Bosswhite.

Having said that when I worked in BC, Canada, Hemp was unavailable. In fact illegal I think.

Canadians ,please correct me if Im wrong.

I have silver brazed threaded brass fittings together. As others said remove any part of assembly that may be heat affected and wrap any thing chrome in a wet cloth.

[plumbdog10]

Aussie Josh,

What is "Bosswhite" and what is the proceedure. I've never heard of this.

This is not what we would refer to as "lead and oakum" is it.

[PLUMBER JAY]

APJ
In canada some provinces have different codes than others. B.C and Ontario are different. I have used hemp here on hydronic heating but never on domestic water. But i don't think it is illegal for that.

[Australian Plumber Josh]

Bosswhite is a brand name for a paste type pipe jointing compound.

Made by a Brittish company BSS. Their website isnt very Helpful.

You apply Bosswhite over the Hemp. Its oily and has a distinctive smell which non plumbers hate.

i'll take a good look at the tub for some more info tomorrow.

Similarly I dont know what Lead and Okum is.