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  • #16
    Re: Are we saying to much?

    it is stuff like this that reminds me of these words......

    "can't we all just get along?"
    9/11/01, never forget.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Are we saying to much?

      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
      Elaborate on this statement for us to avoid the effort of searching endlessly for who knows what.


      To put it mildly,


      Are you starting to feel a little left out of the mix if we as licensed professionals decide it's best to not be giving the ritual away?


      You diss a cleanout but I've seen a million websites hacked like porky pig was pounding the keyboard.


      And why should we be inclined to start a private forum you're recommending?


      There's information in this business the general public doesn't need to know about, just like there's information in your business that follows the same confidentiality.

      So what's the problem? You don't need to know the inner workings of the plumbing profession, you just need to know plumbing and that's it.
      www.johnbridge.com - - you might just learn something about tile

      Ritual - no I'm not feeling left out in the least bit. Aside from business practices (which can't be much different from any other trade) your rituals are on display over a number of channels at any given time during the weekend.

      About the cleanout - the on call plumber did more "dis"ing about the clean out than I did - especially since he had to call in another truck that had the new 75' snake in it. Neat part was that we had a genuine discussion about how that clean out should have been done correctly. And for what it's worth, I'm not defending any DIYers in my area of expertise. But I will defend any body's rights to do it themselves where the law allows.

      Starting out your own private forum keeps out the riff-raff like me That way you can discuss any "secrets" you think you need to with out giving away the store. Also, there is nothing sacred in any business except proprietary trade secrets - like the shape of an injector nozzle which can increase burn efficiency - and I doubt anybody would be discussing that here.
      “If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace” - Thomas Paine

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Are we saying to much?

        Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
        Point is, this thread is about not having to butt heads with DIY'ers, posted in the "Professional Plumbing Discussion" Forum.
        Yet we're obligated to debate our case with you, who feels a mislocated cleanout is symbolic of utter incompetence for my trade.
        Indicating a DIY is better suited to perform our simple and mindless work.
        Took ya long enough to notice the lil' err in my advanced program.
        I'm ready for major software production now.
        "who feels a mislocated cleanout is symbolic of utter incompetence for my trade"
        These are all your word not mine.

        "Indicating a DIY is better suited to perform our simple and mindless work."
        If it was simple and mindless I would not have had a plumber over would I? Again your words not mine

        And remember, no job is sacred in this country - just ask those tens of thousands of Indian programmers making $5 an hour putting a lot of my brethern out of work.
        “If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace” - Thomas Paine

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Are we saying to much?

          somebody go to www.lespaulforum.com and ask Lily (head Admin) about how they set up their "members only" section. they don't call it that but they have a section you must be a member to see or participate. granted their criteria is "paid membership" but you too could have your own secret meeting place. just establish the criteria. i'll abide by the Admins wishes

          steve
          In the never ending struggle to keep the water flowing.... The Poo Poo Cowboy rides again!!!

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Are we saying to much?

            SteveA, what was your reason for contributing to this thread? You've never shown an inkling of plumbing interest by your previous posts but once we plumbers start talk of our our section, you come in with guns blazing. Our interests would not smother or effect your woodworking interests. Just let us be. Don't be a "fronty".
            Buy cheap, buy twice.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Are we saying to much?

              I believe you guys are putting too much into the importance of your "business secrets". I am fairly certain your customers do not frequent the site and even if they do the only reason to not want them to see what you post is you feel there is something wrong with it. Be up front and honest with your customer and there is nothing to worry about.

              Mark
              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Are we saying to much?

                Originally Posted by SteveA(MD)
                Perhaps you should make a visit to the John Bridge tile forum and read what he has discovered about DIYers in large.


                Elaborate on this statement for us to avoid the effort of searching endlessly for who knows what.


                Originally posted by SteveA(MD) View Post
                www.johnbridge.com - - you might just learn something about tile

                Please, answer the simple 6th grade level question.



                Ritual - no I'm not feeling left out in the least bit. Aside from business practices (which can't be much different from any other trade) your rituals are on display over a number of channels at any given time during the weekend.
                Your last posting on this site up to this thread tells another story

                About the cleanout - the on call plumber did more "dis"ing about the clean out than I did - especially since he had to call in another truck that had the new 75' snake in it. Neat part was that we had a genuine discussion about how that clean out should have been done correctly. And for what it's worth, I'm not defending any DIYers in my area of expertise. But I will defend any body's rights to do it themselves where the law allows.

                Can't let it go can you; plumber plumbs an entire house but the cleanout is the downfall of society :sighs:

                Starting out your own private forum keeps out the riff-raff like me
                That's why there's a discussion and you happened to spout off
                Also, there is nothing sacred in any business except proprietary trade secrets - like the shape of an injector nozzle which can increase burn efficiency - and I doubt anybody would be discussing that here.
                Please fronty, I've read enough

                This thread excludes you and your opinion and proves the point that it needs to go invisible.
                Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Are we saying to much?

                  Originally posted by oldslowchevy View Post
                  gear,
                  but that leaves the question of what about guys like me? 12 years ownner Right there, you have an interest and reason why you should be a pros only member 15 years in carpentry, then walk away from it, now i drive a dump truck part time. but i write alot of "fluff" in my opion, so should i be in the pros forum? i mean after all i do have a vast amount of knowlege? so what would you say to me ........... hosestly?


                  now the point of that question is this.... not what about the new members, it is what about the old members, or the members that only come here every once in a while, why should we care what these members think? They come in once awhil, but do they care about this forum? Not really. They come here to get there free information and leave. Oh well, that's why there's a "ask the plumbing experts" section that i am worried about upsetting, i just simply used my self as an example
                  If you try and please everyone, you end up pleasing no one.
                  Buy cheap, buy twice.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Are we saying to much?

                    Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                    I believe you guys are putting too much into the importance of your "business secrets". I am fairly certain your customers do not frequent the site and even if they do the only reason to not want them to see what you post is you feel there is something wrong with it. Be up front and honest with your customer and there is nothing to worry about.

                    Mark
                    Mark, I really believe that this would be a good section to have but I know you're much more knowledgeable in these matters than me so I'll drop pushing this subject. Maybe in some years when I can be in your shoes that I can look back and realize you were right. By the way, did Josh put you up to this?
                    Buy cheap, buy twice.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Are we saying to much?

                      LOL!!


                      No page of happiness awards here tonight
                      Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Are we saying to much?

                        Originally posted by SteveA(MD) View Post
                        And remember, no job is sacred in this country - just ask those tens of thousands of Indian programmers making $5 an hour putting a lot of my brethern out of work.
                        In a bizarre twist of fate, I worked for an Indian fella thats not a citizen, recently married an American gal, and works 1099 as a sub for a software firm, explained he'd just been laid off after purchasing a $1mil home.
                        His job had been outsourced. NO lie.
                        Steve, do understand the irony of your post vs threads topic.
                        Or, give us a link here to your favorite professional discussion forum and show us the good faith..as we pick away for knowledge..possibly insulting members as we underestimate the difficulty of programming.
                        Very tempting to take a certification in Java, .NET or C# and try to make some loot sitting at home these days, but I enjoy the back aches.
                        I think there's a tension here and you may have just enlightened us of the source.
                        We're not that source.
                        Indeed, no job is sacred...I'd truly like to see an Indian lug a 350lb boiler down a flight of stairs, remove the old 600lb boiler and do it for the prices they seem to expect me to do them for.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Are we saying to much?

                          Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
                          Indeed, no job is sacred...I'd truly like to see an Indian lug a 350lb boiler down a flight of stairs, remove the old 600lb boiler and do it for the prices they seem to expect me to do them for.
                          Have you seen what they expect their sewer cleaners to do, and what they pay them? lug your boiler and smile lol.
                          This is my reminder to myself that no good will ever come from discussing politics or religion with anyone, ever.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Are we saying to much?

                            Originally posted by gear junkie View Post
                            Mark, I really believe that this would be a good section to have but I know you're much more knowledgeable in these matters than me so I'll drop pushing this subject. Maybe in some years when I can be in your shoes that I can look back and realize you were right. By the way, did Josh put you up to this?
                            No but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

                            Look all of you guys are talented and I believe it is important for you to have these discussions. However, when you feel you need to do it in private it gives a look of impropriety. When you charge a customer you need to charge them something which is fair to both of you. That does not mean to do it on the cheap it means to have real world costs and expenses figured out. If the customer decides they don't want to use you any more it will be their loss.

                            Mark
                            "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                            I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Are we saying to much?

                              Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                              No but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

                              Look all of you guys are talented and I believe it is important for you to have these discussions. However, when you feel you need to do it in private it gives a look of impropriety. When you charge a customer you need to charge them something which is fair to both of you. That does not mean to do it on the cheap it means to have real world costs and expenses figured out. If the customer decides they don't want to use you any more it will be their loss.

                              Mark

                              Did you make the wife mad or something?


                              It's not impropriety Mark, it's not even the content of the majority of subjects discussed, it has mostly everything to do with interjections and unobjective statements being entered into the mix by "outsiders" that will spin and turn the subject matter somewhere it wasn't intentionally designed to go.

                              In other words, this topic alone should of died out when the pros on this board here had their say, it died down by its own merits. In opposite fashion......someone who doesn't hang their hat like "we" do felt compelled to throw hesitation to the mere idea that we want our privacy. 20 posts later and nothing's accomplished.

                              Nothing wrong with the mix of pros/diy'rs/wannabes/hacks but it helps when there's a selective format introduced to provide problems like these from arising.

                              The only secret I'm holding back is I eat a ton of salted peanuts when I get upset.

                              No secret now, I'm sad.
                              Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Are we saying to much?

                                Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                                No but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

                                Look all of you guys are talented and I believe it is important for you to have these discussions. However, when you feel you need to do it in private it gives a look of impropriety. When you charge a customer you need to charge them something which is fair to both of you. That does not mean to do it on the cheap it means to have real world costs and expenses figured out. If the customer decides they don't want to use you any more it will be their loss.

                                Mark
                                Mark, there's alot more to it than that.
                                Alot of us either talk on the phone or in PM's when we're not comfortable in the open.
                                It would be pretty huge to be able to openly swap trade secrets or simply vent in our own terms.
                                It would be very nice to be able to talk shop with "the boys" without having to worry about another situation like the one we recently had.
                                It's one thing when an experienced member disagree's with anothers experience, code or idea's, sure it might get ugly, but both opinions are usually valid from experience.
                                Another altogether when a defensive homeowner/DIY decides to bash other members for their advice or warnings, when misconstrued as insult.
                                There's also the comfort in being around those we relate to without concern for other lifestyles that may feel offended...language for starters, we tend to come in contact with some pretty ugly situations, what might seem distasteful or off color to a software engineer, or businessman for example, is often par for the course for us.

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