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  • Protecting 'our' trade ...

    Wow, I've had a true experience here.
    I'm in my early 30's, got my ticket at the beginning of the year and one of the things I got from this site was some peoples protective nature in handing out free advice. Though I'm working with a serivice company since getting certified, I have my own business name and propper paper work in order to do work myself... mainly for my wife's uncle who does renos. In the last few months, the number of phone calls I've taken from him in which I have at times "held his hand" through his questions has made me realize the value of the education I took, but most recently the aspect of the loss of 'my' trade to someone who didn't put up the money or time to learn a specific skill (ie: carpenter, plumber, electrician. ...) He doesn't carry ANY training or recognized trade certificate; His education is ALL from personal experiences and I've witnessed visits where he has asked other 'certificate holding individuals' in our extended family questions on doing tasks that he isn't trained for.
    To stretch it even farther, the consiquences of giving advice, having him make a mistake and having it come back on me is even more of a reality to me as I learn the business aspects of working with the public yet protecting my own interests and values.

    Your thoughts would be appreciated.... ?

  • #2
    Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

    he's your wifes uncle. either help him do it, or tell him you can do it for him at a family price.

    he'll either hire you or not deal with you and hire someone else.

    i help out family and they help me out. that's why they're family.

    rick.
    phoebe it is

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

      I do not care what business or job your in, all take time to learn and to be good at, there are tips and techniques and ways and methods of doing things.

      I to think all groups get asked for some free help from time to time, many times that is with in the trade, and some times it is with out,

      For the most part the information is out there in some way, (I am sure if I worked hard enough I could find and get the information on the medical procedure on how to do a heart bypass), Now I doubt I would ever try to do one even if I had step by step procedures, but it would be fun to explore it some time. and the residual knowledge would be great.

      so I really doubt if you give some one the info that you have done some thing that is not out there all ready,

      but you have to come to a point in your mind how you feel about the information you process is it, Priority or is it in public domain or some place in the middle.

      In my country you will find few if any in farming that think they have trade secrets, (unless there in some type of contest), knowledge is shared freely with any who ask,
      yet in some arenas you would think that doing the simplest process is like asking for the recipe for Coke a Cola,

      I think it is a decision that you will have to decide where you stand, and what is right in your heart, and what you think you can live with.

      some times it is obvious that some people are lazy, and will not even type a few key words in to Google or other quality search, and spend a few Min's reading what is easily found, I have a harder time helping them than the ones who it is obvious have done some home work and are really between a rock and hard spot.

      I think your heart, personality, and your upbringing will be your guide.
      Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
      attributed to Samuel Johnson
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

        A homeowner, guy renovating properties, etc., is not going to make the investment to get a ticket. Any more than a guy working on his car would go get an ASE car repair certificate. He's not doing it on a commercial basis... just trying to get a job done.

        People that are inclined to fix things are going to do it with or without your help. There are plenty of resources out there, including old-fashioned libraries. They might not get it all perfectly correct, but they will do it anyway. And good for them. People that have the skill and desire to do these sorts of things are such a small percentage of our (essentially helpless) population anyway, what's the difference? So I don't think you're really costing anyone in the trades any work. But of course that's just my opinion.... you've earned the right to deal with the situation in a way that you're comfortable with, and I for one respet any way you choose to go.

        As an engineering consultant, I give a lot of free advice. If someone (typically an engineer working for a company) can do the job with some talk and coaching... good for them, then they didn't need me anyway, just a little nudge in the right direction. When they do need something, they'll remember the guy that knew what to do.... and I will get the call. Better for me, better for them.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

          Originally posted by Andy_M View Post
          When they do need something, they'll remember the guy that knew what to do.... and I will get the call. Better for me, better for them.
          that is the truth

          steve
          In the never ending struggle to keep the water flowing.... The Poo Poo Cowboy rides again!!!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

            sounds like he's using your knowledge to make money without compensating you. Family or not, if he wants you to do the job, or even just help, he needs to pay. Doesn't have to be the full rate, but at least Something.

            It would be different if his personal water heater were leaking, etc, but he is making a profit off of you.
            No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

              It's hard for me to knock anyone who gives free advice as I've been doing it for years across the internet.


              I've been doing it for my customers that I know appreciate me as well. Simple things like a clogged garbage disposal (reset button or the allen key trick)

              Another good one is the floor drain backup at the furnace, right at cooling season. ( no brainer that last year's gunk has filled the trap, short shot with a garden hose and it is open)

              but that is all relative to how much I appreciate them. If they was fair with me I am fair to them, and not everything I do as a plumber is going to be a monetary reward.


              I'm friends with a few that are handymen, I know they do plumbing work all the time, even some for my customers that I've referred to them at one point. But I don't care because they are usually working $50/hour cheaper than I and I don't knock the property owner for saving a buck, I know I would!

              So I'm not going to work for that wage to think I lost wages against these guys...it'll never happen.


              Every once in awhile a subject like this about how plumbers are making it difficult for themselves "online" by giving away their expertise.


              Remember, information is why we are on the internet and I'll be damn if I will hold back and not share what I know helps others. If everyone starts thinking like that in the plumbing profession by not sharing our knowledge, it will be another setback in this profession.

              If you type one word in one conversation about anything plumbing related, it's information trading and you are a part of it, guilty.

              In the big picture there are not a lot of plumbers that get online and discuss plumbing. I blame the inability to type well as it's a talent that if you're a slow typer, you now post considerably less since you belong to the hunt and peck team.


              This trade is dumbing down not by helping someone relay information, it's being done by the mentality of plumbers that strive for easy and fast, along with no desire to stabilize the definition of workmanship.

              I constantly do work behind licensed plumbers, what does that tell you? They don't care.

              When the wage earning keeps dropping in the plumbing profession, all I can say is the writing is on the wall for all of us because too many don't pride their work. That's a kick to the nuts for all us.

              And the suckers start at the supply house that listen to that new product sales pitch sitting on the counter and now you want to save a buck.

              Thanks...for the selfish means.
              Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

                I see a slight difference on this one Dunbar, This guy is not asking for information on his own home. he's asking for information on a trade he isn't qualified for from someone who is, so he can turn a profit without paying the price. While it does work that way, it shouldn't.
                No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

                  Originally posted by MoJourneyman View Post
                  I see a slight difference on this one Dunbar, This guy is not asking for information on his own home. he's asking for information on a trade he isn't qualified for from someone who is, so he can turn a profit without paying the price. While it does work that way, it shouldn't.
                  Just asking here,

                  Have you ever hooked up an electric hot water heater? or hooked up an element or thermostat?

                  and just to extent this a little further,
                  Have you ever asked electrician on the correct way to do something so it met code?
                  Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                  attributed to Samuel Johnson
                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Protecting 'our' trade ...

                    Originally posted by BHD View Post
                    Just asking here,

                    Have you ever hooked up an electric hot water heater? or hooked up an element or thermostat?

                    and just to extent this a little further,
                    Have you ever asked electrician on the correct way to do something so it met code?
                    we have to have an electrician do the connection on an electric hot water tank here as part of the permit. and I don't have to ask how to test out the element or thermostat.

                    and as for asking an electrician on the proper way to install something; If it's anything more than low volt wiring we have to have an electrician on our permit, so they either get paid to do it, or get paid to come put their name on it, depending on the job.

                    But I see your point, I just take some issue with the idea of someone not only Not hiring a plumber to do a job, but then asking for advice on how to do a job they aren't licensed to do while being paid for it. I do ask for advice on this forum, but the jobs I do are typically within the realm of plumbing, which my license says i'm capable of doing. I think most of us run into things we haven't seen before on occasion.
                    No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

                    Comment

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