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  • Warranty or workmanship warranty

    Shouldn't we be offering a workmanship warranty vs a blanket warranty on the product we install? We don't manufacture the product. We install it. The manufacturer normally gives a warranty period on their product to cover defective material. So shouldn't our warranty be on what we provide? The workmanship. Example: You install a kitchen faucet and one or two years later the faucet starts to loosen up from its base constitutes defective workmanship and you should go back and fix that absolutely free. Now that same faucet starts dripping one or two years later is a manufactures issue or normal wear and tear and not a workmanship issue? Same for a water heater. The tank leaks a year later isn't a workmanship issue, it's a manufacture issue. The water connections start leaking, that's a workmanship issue. I was thinking about this while installing a water heater yesterday. As long as I've installed that water heater correctly, I should be able to offer a 20 year workmanship warranty that will far outlast that water heater and still not have to eat the bill every time a manufacture defect pops up. I know most of you will disagree with it, especially for what might be considered a minor or quick repair, but I'm going to start wording my written warranties as workmanship warranties instead of blanket warranties and would appreciate hearing your thoughts on this, pros and cons. One might even feel comfortable writing a written warranty as: 6 year manufacture parts warranty, 6 year workmanship warranty and 1 year blanket warranty. Think about what that says. Do you see anything that could be considered not fair about the above warranties for the consumer and the contractor? Assuming you're not providing crap material to begin with.

  • #2
    Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

    How would you handle a situation if the product that failed was one that the customer really didn't specify the manufacturer? For example, items like pipe, valves and fittings, etc. As a customer, I would expect that I would be paying for quality products but if the contractors buys their supplies based solely on price then sometimes quality goes out the window. Should the customer be expected to pay extra down the road because the contractor installed junk and it failed?


    For what's it worth, I feel that the manufacturers should not only replace, at no charge, defective materials but should also pay a labor charge to the contractor for having to reinstall the product a second time.
    Teach your kids about taxes..........eat 30 percent of their ice cream.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

      Originally posted by Sierra2000 View Post
      Shouldn't we be offering a workmanship warranty vs a blanket warranty on the product we install? We don't manufacture the product. We install it. The manufacturer normally gives a warranty period on their product to cover defective material. So shouldn't our warranty be on what we provide? The workmanship. Example: You install a kitchen faucet and one or two years later the faucet starts to loosen up from its base constitutes defective workmanship and you should go back and fix that absolutely free. Now that same faucet starts dripping one or two years later is a manufactures issue or normal wear and tear and not a workmanship issue? Same for a water heater. The tank leaks a year later isn't a workmanship issue, it's a manufacture issue. The water connections start leaking, that's a workmanship issue. I was thinking about this while installing a water heater yesterday. As long as I've installed that water heater correctly, I should be able to offer a 20 year workmanship warranty that will far outlast that water heater and still not have to eat the bill every time a manufacture defect pops up. I know most of you will disagree with it, especially for what might be considered a minor or quick repair, but I'm going to start wording my written warranties as workmanship warranties instead of blanket warranties and would appreciate hearing your thoughts on this, pros and cons. One might even feel comfortable writing a written warranty as: 6 year manufacture parts warranty, 6 year workmanship warranty and 1 year blanket warranty. Think about what that says. Do you see anything that could be considered not fair about the above warranties for the consumer and the contractor? Assuming you're not providing crap material to begin with.
      If you make a profit from the materials you should warranty them for the customer, then you go after the manufacturer.

      Mark.
      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

        I'm NOT in the plumbing business, but my Dad was, and he later became a licensed steam fitter. While I worked with him back in my high-school days, I've been mostly a home owner and I stay the heck away from plumbing as much as I possibly can.

        I really don't know how you can offer a warranty... at least a written one, for your workmanship, without opening yourself to a real "can of worms". People are just damned abusive sometimes and I'd really hate to see you or anyone else get stuck in an uncomfortable situation where the customer's abuse could possibly be blamed on "workmanship". While you surely would know the difference when you examined it, the customer might well pose the argument that "you guaranteed it!".

        What I think, would be better is for the plumber to just "fix" the problem when and if it occurs and to tell the customer "no charge"... IF you think it was something that should not have happened. That way you are left with a customer who feels very good about your service and integrity, rather than a point of argument or feeling that since it did leak (or whatever), it was your fault anyway! (I'm also wondering about shaky California where you may be seeing a lot of tremors and how does that effect plumbing in general... certainly not your fault.)

        Where I'm coming from as a home owner with a bit of plumbing experience is that I simply don't like doing it, find it is never as simple as I had hoped, and GOD BLESS my plumber here in the Binghamton, NY area, who I really like and appreciate his service! I have had times when he has simply said, "No Charge" because it was something really simple, and he knows I'll call him and gladly pay for something bigger.

        (I had a case just about a year ago, when my five-year-old GE water heater sprung a leak. I called Steve and he was here within the hour. Pulled the heater, took it to HD for exchange, and then returned to re-install the new one. He charged me for the exercise, as rightly he should. BUT, he then told me to go to HD and file a claim, under the grounds that I should not have to pay for the labor required. On his advice [which I honestly probably would not have done on my own], the entire amount of his bill was reimbursed by HD. That kind of thing is appreciated and I wouldn't think of calling any other plumber... So, I greatly appreciate my plumber!])

        On the other hand, I had a plumber at my old home in Painted Post, NY (about two years ago) where the main service valve corroded and had to be replaced. The village shut off my water and this fellow came and replaced the valve (less than an hour's work) and he charged me almost $200. But six months later his soldering job sprung a pin-hole leak... and he charged me $85 to fix it. He's about the only 'official' guy left in the area, but I'll NEVER call him again.

        My opinion as a homeowner,

        CWS
        Last edited by CWSmith; 12-15-2013, 12:35 PM. Reason: error, correction in italics.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

          Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
          If you make a profit from the materials you should warranty them for the customer, then you go after the manufacturer.

          Mark.
          This seems like creating red-tape-in-the-middle-headaches. Just let them pursue manufacturing and be done with it.

          No?

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          • #6
            Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

            I offer one year on anything I touch. That covers workmanship and product. It just so happens that most items have a one year warranty anyway...except some sump pumps.
            ~~

            ... it was plumbed by Ray Charles and his helper Stevie Wonder

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

              most residential water heaters come with a 1 year parts and labor warranty. then 6 years parts no labor. this is clearly stated on the owners manual of the heaters.

              but lets say a faucet. most I don't supply as there are more choices out there and the customers have too many choices. unless it's a basic or common kitchen sink faucet. lav faucets are a free for all especially with all the trendy shops in town where customers can see and order their own.

              if the products leak from something I did, then I fix it for free. if I supplied it, then I fix it for free. if they supplied it and it's not an installation problem on my end, then they deal with it and pay me to repair their faucet.

              fortunately I don't need to put this in writing as my customers know me and know I will make good on it. even stoppages are not in writing for a warranty period. if I feel it didn't last long enough, I go back for free. or sometimes for just additional time spent.

              in june I snaked out a 4'' main with 4'' cutters and it stopped up in august. came back and snaked it again with 4'' cutters and it cleared at the same 7' mark. billed her for the minimal time I was there. then it plugged in October. tried to explain to her that the line needed attention and a 4'' cutter down a 4'' line tells me there is something else going on. but she decided to call someone else out in.

              of course I followed up with her and told her to make sure the other guy documents what he finds and how far out. she told me it was also 7' out where he cleared it. so I knew something was wrong at this point. fast forward to this week. she calls me 10 weeks after the last guy was there and it's plugged up again. she knew it wasn't me doing a poor job. this time she had me camera the line and determine the problem. the pipe lies under a concrete walkway on the side of the house and there's a ficus fence line 3' from the sewer line. even though the line is pretty much spotless, the roots manage to grow into this joint faster than anything I've seen. pushed the camera out to the city main 108' and other than some future root issue at 103' that will need to be jetted, the line is spotless. so next week the owner will have the gardner dig up the line and I will replace it. customer is happy and I still kept her.

              so if you work with your customers and are reasonable with them, they will work with you. pretty easy to keep most happy. not all, but most.

              rick.
              phoebe it is

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                Originally posted by BobsPlumbing View Post
                This seems like creating red-tape-in-the-middle-headaches. Just let them pursue manufacturing and be done with it.

                No?
                If it is owner supplied materials I agree with you 100%. However, when you are making money from the sale, you should be responsible for it. You have the relationship with the supply house, not the customer. The supply house is the one who should handle the warranty
                for you.

                Mark
                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                  Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                  If it is owner supplied materials I agree with you 100%. However, when you are making money from the sale, you should be responsible for it. You have the relationship with the supply house, not the customer. The supply house is the one who should handle the warranty
                  for you.

                  Mark
                  I typically handle any trouble with what I supply even if there is no real markup on it just as a service.

                  When it gets to x dollars though ($$$), and it's a material failure, someone else has to get after the manufacturer.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                    Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                    If you make a profit from the materials you should warranty them for the customer, then you go after the manufacturer.

                    Mark.
                    I agree Mark. Do You feel the frost free Hose Manuf. will caugh up $$ ? How would You aproach them ?
                    I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                      Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                      I agree Mark. Do You feel the frost free Hose Manuf. will caugh up $$ ? How would You aproach them ?
                      Sorry it sounds like you are talking about a specific issue and I don't know the details.

                      Mark
                      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                        I give a lifetime workmanship warranty, 6 year material on water heaters and 1 year parts and labor warranty for anything else. I hate for a customer to nickle and dime and so I won't do that to them. I think most people are reasonable for the most part. I have enough clauses to give me a bug out for those one or two eccentric customers.
                        Buy cheap, buy twice.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Warranty or workmanship warranty

                          One year labor an all workmanship , and on all material i supply only exception is for rodding that's usually only 90 days.Sewer repairs are warranted for 5 years free from shifting and settling. 1 free rodding and camera inspection within 1 yrs time even if it's not backed up.I put a reminder on the invoice for them to call and schedule an appointment. Usually use a 6 " blade once the cleanout is installed and have to demonstrate it in front of city inspector along with a camera inspection . They actually want to see your cable in the city main before they allow a back fill.

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