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Presidential Election 2008

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  • Presidential Election 2008

    Who are you planning on voting for so far, and why?

    Obama? Mccain? Or maybe Bob Barr or someone else?

    Lets try to be open-minded and not attack others opinions. Mainly state your own opinions on the matter, and I think this could be interesting without becoming hostile.

    I am going for a hike, but I'll post my opinion when I get back.
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  • #2
    Re: Presidential Election 2008

    This is the first election where I have not really been excited about anyone. At this point I am leaning towards McCain but who knows what will happen between now and then. I think a lot will have to do with which running mates they choose.

    My concerns regarding McCain are his age and health but my concerns about Obama is the fact that he has limited experience. Obama has been in the Senate for 3-years but has been running for President since his freshman year. McCain is old to begin with but you need to remember his body was tortured for years as well.

    McCain admits his weakness is the economy but Obama is making promises none of us could afford to pay for. I'm afraid Obama will be worst than Carter and Carter was about as bad as they get.

    McCain is strong on defense and Obama seems to not have a clue about what's going on. Although he has slightly changed his positions he came off as excessively naive during the primaries.

    I am also a little concerned about what Wright said about Obama being a politician who says what is expedient instead of what was true. So I guess we will have to wait until the real campaigning starts. McCain has pretty much laid out his plan while Obama has been very vague. Perhaps one or the other candidate will come out during a debate with something new which will excite me.

    Mark
    "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

    I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Presidential Election 2008

      Mccain

      Obama's going to win.I would love nothing more than to be wrong.Though it is going to be entertaining to count how many white floozies come out from under the desk.

      Have fun with your points of views.Debating religion politics too much energy for me.

      God bless

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Presidential Election 2008

        Remember folks.. be careful in here. Politics is a topic to tread lightly through.

        BTW.. I agree with Mark. disappointed in both candidates. There just happens to be one that I have to vote against.

        Josh

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Presidential Election 2008

          Ok, hike is on hold, wife got a phone call...

          Anyway, I have long been a swing-voter. 'On the fence' so to speak. The problem being I like some policies of the right and republicans, and yet I like some policies of the left and the democrats! Well, this year I have done a bunch of reading about the different parties and I have decided to support Obama and the democrats.

          Why? Well, after reading all that the republican party currently stands for, and all that democratic party stands for, I have realized that the majoirty of my political leanings lie with the democratic party.

          The following policies from a wikipedia articele on the democratic party, I generally agree with.
          Economic issues
          Minimum wage
          Democrats favor a higher minimum wage, and more regular increases, in order to assist the working poor.
          Renewable energy and oil
          Democrats have opposed tax cuts and incentives to oil companies, favoring a policy of developing domestic renewable energy, such as Montana's state-supported wind farm and "clean coal" programs as well as setting in place a cap and trade policy in hopes of reducing carbon emissions.
          Fiscal policy
          Democrats generally support a more progressive tax structure to provide more services and reduce injustice.[27] Currently they have proposed reversing those tax cuts the Bush administration gave to the wealthiest Americans while wishing to keep in place those given to the middle class.[28][29][30] Democrats generally support more government spending on social services while spending less on the military.[31][32]
          Democrats call for "affordable and quality health care," and many advocate an expansion of government intervention in this area. Many Democrats favor national health insurance or universal health care in a variety of forms to address the rising costs of modern health insurance.
          Environment
          Democratic belief is that the health of families and the strength of the economy depend on stewardship of the environment. Democrats have promised to fight to strengthen the laws that ensure people have clean air to breathe and clean water to drink. They also promise to make sure these laws are enforced. They feel that a sensible energy policy is key to a strong economy, national security, and a clean environment.[36]
          The Democratic Party rejects the idea that a healthy economy and a healthy environment is mutually exclusive, because they believe that a cleaner environment means a stronger economy. They protect hunting and fishing heritage by expanding conservation lands. They encourage open space and rail travel to relieve highway and airport congestion and improve air quality and economy, and "believe that communities, environmental interests, and government should work together to protect resources while ensuring the vitality of local economies. Once Americans were led to believe they had to make a choice between the economy and the environment. They now know this is a false choice."[37]

          College education
          Most Democrats have the long term aim of having low-cost, publicly-funded college education with low tuition fees (like in much of Europe) which should be available to every eligible American student, or alternatively, with increasing state funding for student financial aid such as the Pell Grant or college tuition tax deduction.[39][40]

          Social issues
          Discrimination

          The Democratic Party supports equal opportunity for all Americans regardless of sex, age, race, sexual orientation, religion, creed, or national origin.
          Democrats also strongly support the Americans with Disabilities Act to prohibit discrimination against people on the basis of physical or mental disability.
          Also regarding foreign policy, I DO NOT support the war in Iraq and think we should pull our troops out of there as soon as is practical. Obama seems to share my veiwpoint there.
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          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Presidential Election 2008

            Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
            Debating religion politics too much energy for me.

            God bless
            This isn't supposed to be a debate. Simply a sharing of your voting opinion (for others to read) if you feel like it. I am not going to argue with anyone of opposing opinion, and I hope nobody else decides to do so.

            I feel if we all listen to what the others have to say, WE WILL ALL BE MORE INFORMED for the better come election time.
            Water Heater Reviews & Water Heater Information

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Presidential Election 2008

              Originally posted by Service Guy View Post
              Ok, hike is on hold, wife got a phone call...

              Anyway, I have long been a swing-voter. 'On the fence' so to speak. The problem being I like some policies of the right and republicans, and yet I like some policies of the left and the democrats! Well, this year I have done a bunch of reading about the different parties and I have decided to support Obama and the democrats.

              Why? Well, after reading all that the republican party currently stands for, and all that democratic party stands for, I have realized that the majoirty of my political leanings lie with the democratic party.

              The following policies from a wikipedia articele on the democratic party, I generally agree with.


              Also regarding foreign policy, I DO NOT support the war in Iraq and think we should pull our troops out of there as soon as is practical. Obama seems to share my veiwpoint there.
              You left this off of your cut-n-paste


              This article needs additional citations for verification.
              Please help improve this article by adding reliable references. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (February 2008)


              +
              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Presidential Election 2008

                Too many times we get tied into the talking points of one party or the other and when nothing gets done they blame the opposing party. Health care has always been my favorite as one of my friends voted for Bill Clinton because he promised everyone would have health care within 90-days of him taking office. Now 16-years later Hillary promised the same thing. Pelosi promised a bunch was going to happen within so many days of when the Dems took control of Congress and none of it ever happened. We really need to pay more attention to results and less to talking points. All we ever hear are feel good promises and then they don't deliver. Why is it we can go after Major League Baseball but not the major issues we have to deal with.

                Mark
                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Presidential Election 2008

                  I'm not enamored with either of the choices, but it is unlikely any Democrat would get my vote at a national level.

                  I'm for McCain, though I disagree with him on three things that matter to me (immigration, campaign finance reform, carbon credits). I doubt Obama would be better on either of these issues.

                  The things I like better about McCain than Obama:
                  - McCain does not want to increase our income taxes, Obama does. My wife and I work hard for our money, we want to keep it. We live in a high tax state, so between the feds, state, county, town, and school district we pay thousands of dollars in taxes a month.
                  - McCain is willing to drill for oil. I know it won't be an instant solution, but I think drilling for oil will eventually bring the price down or at least stabilize it. Taxing oil company profits will just increase prices.
                  - Iraq. I think we need to stay until we can assure some level of stability.

                  I do think that John McCain thinks government programs can solve our problems; which I disagree with. If Ron Paul ran as a third party candidate I would vote for him.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Presidential Election 2008

                    Both parties suck.
                    The reps suck a little less.
                    The dem agenda, as previously posted, will do nothing but harm the economy.
                    If min wage is such a good thing and does not damage the economy then why not make it $1000 per hour? Then everybody will be rich. The recent rise in min wage in California put me in a position where I had to cut the hours of several employees or fire 1. So I cut the hours of some employees. Maybe 1 out 1000 politicians has actually run a business, they have no knowledge or understanding of what it takes to do it.
                    Taxes here keep going up.
                    Dems want to tax the oil companies more? Stupid. The taxes are passed on to the consumer. Many pensions and 401k's are invested in gas companies, you will be harming the incomes of retirees.
                    Taxes do not improve the economy, they do not promote investment, they do not create jobs. They help nobody but govt bureaucrats, who already have cushy overpaid jobs.

                    I have a business in the least business friendly place in the USA, Los Angeles. In L.A. you actually pay a business tax even if your business loses money.
                    I am not expanding in L.A., I am looking to expand in a more business friendly area, that is what taxes and min wage laws cause people to do. Raise the min wage enough and more jobs will go overseas.
                    Last edited by Rafael; 06-22-2008, 01:50 PM.
                    www.TheWoodCellar.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Presidential Election 2008

                      Economic issues
                      Minimum wage

                      Democrats favor a higher minimum wage, and more regular increases, in order to assist the working poor.

                      Minimum wage is an entry level wage not a wage meant to sustain a family. I believe a more appropriate wage would be a schedule based on skills. A factory worker building widgets is likely worth more than a worker at a McDonalds flipping burgers. They should not be working at a wage based on the same minimum wage. The unintended consequence of raising the minimum wage is it proportionately raises the wages of the workers who are above the minimum wage. As has already been pointed out raising the minimum wage also cause employers to cut back on labor. A quick review of the minimum wage in the City of Santa Monica has proven that.


                      Renewable energy and oil

                      Democrats have opposed tax cuts and incentives to oil companies, favoring a policy of developing domestic renewable energy, such as Montana's state-supported wind farm and "clean coal" programs as well as setting in place a cap and trade policy in hopesof reducing carbon emissions.

                      This section is almost laughable. The Democrats have opposed the wind farms off of Ted Kennedy’s and John Kerry’s beach, prevented nuclear plants, prevented off shore drilling, prevented Alaskan drilling and impeded the construction of new refineries.


                      Fiscal policy

                      Democrats generally support a more progressive tax structure to provide more services and reduce injustice.[27] Currently they have proposed reversing those tax cuts the Bush administration gave to the wealthiest Americans while wishing to keep in place those given to the middle class.[28][29][30] Democrats generally support more government spending on social services while spending less on the military.[31][32]

                      This all sounds nice but is just another way to take money away from those who have worked hard.

                      Democrats call for "affordable and quality health care," and many advocate an expansion of government intervention in this area. Many Democrats favor national health insurance or universal health care in a variety of forms to address the rising costs of modern health insurance.

                      Again who do the Dems think the Government is? As the Government does not have any money they will take my money and your money to give us a Health care system which is blotted in waste.


                      Environment

                      Democratic belief is that the health of families and the strength of the economy depend on stewardship of the environment. Democrats have promised to fight to strengthen the laws that ensure people have clean air to breathe and clean water to drink. They also promise to make sure these laws are enforced. They feel that a sensible energy policy is key to a strong economy, national security, and a clean environment.[36]
                      The Democratic Party rejects the idea that a healthy economy and a healthy environment is mutually exclusive, because they believe that a cleaner environment means a stronger economy. They protect hunting and fishing heritage by expanding conservation lands. They encourage open space and rail travel to relieve highway and airport congestion and improve air quality and economy, and "believe that communities, environmental interests, and government should work together to protect resources while ensuring the vitality of local economies. Once Americans were led to believe they had to make a choice between the economy and the environment. They now know this is a false choice."[37]


                      Anyone in a business or industry understands the effect some of the requirements as suggested by environmental groups would have. I believe we all want a clean environment regardless of party affiliation but we have to have a reasonable balance.


                      College education

                      Most Democrats have the long term aim of having low-cost, publicly-funded college education with low tuition fees (like in much of Europe) which should be available to every eligible American student, or alternatively, with increasing state funding for student financial aid such as the Pell Grant or college tuition tax deduction.[39][40]

                      I don’t see a difference in the parties here. Where I do have an issue is the fact that illegal aliens in California pay in State tuition while US citizens from out of State pay a higher tuition.

                      Social issues

                      Discrimination

                      The Democratic Party supports equal opportunity for all Americans regardless of sex, age, race, sexual orientation, religion, creed, or national origin.

                      Democrats also strongly support the Americans with Disabilities Act to prohibit discrimination against people on the basis of physical or mental disability.

                      I don’t see a difference between the parties here other than the way they accuse the other side of discriminating.
                      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Presidential Election 2008

                        On one hand we have a guy that refused to be released as a POW unless the other porisoners were releaesed, he almost lost his career standing up against the special interest payoffs of the tobacco industry (low and behold...smoking really IS unhealthy!)

                        On the other we have our handsome young promising guy who has made some very promising campaign promises, he stands for something...so he tells us.

                        I don't car what kinda health McCain is in...if he drops after 6 months the changes he'd affect would be more than worthwhile.
                        I don't agree with all of his policies, but dear god, he beats the alternative by a far stretch in terms of experience and proven track record.

                        This is a time when we aren't going to get better in terms of the economy or world affairs unless we eat some crow and make sacrifices we don't want to make...so far I see McCain has the integrity to stand by what is right for his country over what is lucrative for himself...he also has no fear of stating the unpopular truth.

                        I say we need him...desperately.
                        I've been saying this for years.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Presidential Election 2008

                          I promised myself I would TRY to not talk politics here anymore. We'll see how long I can hold on to that........I guess that will change once Eli and Frankiarmz post

                          In the meantime

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Presidential Election 2008

                            If someone could tell me just one worthwhile thing Obama has done in his entire carreer then perhaps I could feel a bit better about him. As of now all I see is a carasmatic face telling us everything that is wrong with the country and offering no concrete solutions to any problems. The mantra of change is all well and good, but not everything needs changing and what does needs a plan.
                            sigpic

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                            • #15
                              Re: Presidential Election 2008

                              Columbo,


                              He solves all the problems in one hour.
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