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  • welding question

    First off I purchased some 16 GA 1" square tubing..Damn..made in china! 91 cents a foot
    Then they spec it at 0.060....I thought 16 GA=0.065 [per the pocket reference book]
    I also saw 16 GA= 0.062 in a different steel catalog!

    Are we now doing steel like lumber?

    I suspect in china they do metric and when it's converted to the proper way to measure in inches it loses some in translation...That is the only thing I can rationalize. On the other hand perhaps we are just getting cheated.

    When you set up to weld say, a 45 degree miter corner, do you cut to exact dimensions or do you add say 1/16" for "shrinkage"?

    With my older stock, I never had issues with shrinkage!
    I'm using a Hobart wire feed MiG welder

    Cactus Man

  • #2
    Re: welding question

    I think, just because the stock is suspect, that I would set up a small test weld first.
    sigpic

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    • #3
      Re: welding question

      at times I have some warpage but I cant really say shrinkage, I have always cut to exact length with steel, if there is some difference usually I space the steel under the weld, yes I know steel shrinks some when heated and cooled, but I would not think any where near a 1/6 of an inch on wire feed weld on that type of tube, the easiest is to cut one corner and weld it up and see what the actuly change is, and if one needs to make adjustmetns go from there,

      I have had more problems when cutting some thing with a torch than from welding,

      but with out fail there will be some pulling or twisting depending on how it is welded and the sequence in which it is welded, and how it is tacked.
      Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
      attributed to Samuel Johnson
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

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      • #4
        Re: welding question

        Since this is a welding question thread.

        What is some good equipment to get started in welding? Welder brands, types, what they'll do and won't do. My experience is almost nil.

        Thanks.

        J.C.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: welding question

          Cactus,
          Like the other two said, why don't you cut yourself some 45s, set up a test, tack it up, then weld it up, and see if the end result is going to work for the parameters you want to get. Just nosy, but what are you going to be making. If you're looking at building a cart for a welder, the tolerance for any slight variation is going to be a whole lot wider than for say, a critical weld on some project with really tight tolerance. There is some shrink when you weld, but it's so minute that you probably won't notice.

          JC, to answer your question, questions, could result in a rambling, long, obtuse answer that doesn't fit your need. What kind of welding would you like to do/are interested in? What do you want to fix/build? What kind of money do you want to spend? Do you have room for a weld booth at your shop? Etc. If you go on chat here at Ridgid, I could probably knock out some answers immediately and give you a hand. What say you?

          Cheers to both,
          Jim Don

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: welding question

            Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
            Since this is a welding question thread.

            What is some good equipment to get started in welding? Welder brands, types, what they'll do and won't do. My experience is almost nil.

            Thanks.

            J.C.
            Lincoln, Miller, Hobart, ant not necessarily in that order.
            Depends on what you plan to weld with it.
            Welding can't be learned from a book. It takes lots of practice to become proficient. It's best to take a class at the local jr college.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: welding question

              To tell you the truth Jim, I'd have to think about it more and research it to even ask you the right questions. Stay tuned.

              J.C.

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              • #8
                Re: welding question

                Newman,
                Don't forget ESAB and HTP. Both get strong marks in many circles. HTP Tig unit cause you've got pulse control that never ends on AC, and it is the only welder I know of where you can vary the Amps while sticking it. WOW!!! I want one of those beasts.
                Jim Don

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                • #9
                  Re: welding question

                  JC,
                  If you just want to get into arcing and sparkin with no particular goal in mind, why don't you check your local Craigslist. Up here, we've got stick welders for sale up the yazoo. Buy yourself a used Lincoln, Hobart or Miller stick unit that is AC/DC, get some rod 6011, 6013 or 7018 and go at it. See if you like it. If the bug bites hard, you can upgrade to a Mig unit. If the bug bites harder you can again upgrade to a Tig unit. You should be able to buy a good used Miller or Lincoln for around $200-$275, lot of times even cheaper.
                  Good luck,
                  Jim

                  And send me a PM when you have some particulars to ask, I'll be glad to meet you in chat room and we can thrash that puppy around for hours. Only thing I like better than under hood time, is talking time about welding.

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                  • #10
                    Re: welding question

                    Thanks Jim. I'll definitely look you up for all the welding I don't know. (Everything. )

                    Looks like I might have a winter hobby/project.

                    J.C.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: welding question

                      Stick is definitely the cheapest way to get into it, but if you want to weld thin stuff, you need to learn MIG or TIG. Stick is easiest to learn from the tech side as you have essentially one big knob. If the rod sticks, turn it up, if it blows holes turn it down. With mig you have to get the feel for the voltage, current, and wire speed. Taking a basic course at the community college is a great idea. Before scrap got crazy expensive, you could ask any welding/machine shop for some practice material, but you will probably have to buy it now! I am not a welder by any means, but I have done enough to realize what an art it is. The company I work for is a DOT certified to manufacture tanks for highway use and there are some welders there that can lay some weld joints that would be considered "Pretty"!
                      Another consideration - Don't go cheap on the helmet/glass. You only get one pair of eyes! Self darkening is the way to go, IMHO. Then you don't have to jerk your head to drop your helmet when starting a bead. Much easier for a beginner. But if your budget is limited, by a good non self darkening before a cheap self darkening. You will see a spec on them about response time - get the best - your eyes will thank you.
                      Last edited by JTROANOKE; 09-21-2008, 09:51 PM.

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                      • #12
                        Re: welding question

                        JC if you're serious about getting into welding I would suggest you look at
                        your local community colleges and see if they offer a welding class.

                        I did that here in Glendale AZ and took an outstanding 12 week welding class.
                        I was taught the essential safety criteria, proper equipment, an introduction to the various welding styles, stick, MiG, tig, torch..cutting steel using a plasma cutter and mechanical presses etc.

                        Aside from classroom work we had "lab" or real experience using the various techniques, and equipment under proper supervision.

                        Each of us aside from written tests and homework we had to accomplish a welding project
                        [of our choice]. The project is to demonstrate our skill level and what we learned. Our welds were looked at with a critical eye!

                        After the class I developed the confidence to use my newly found skills. Now I'm not a licensed welder and I do not have the skill or experience even close to that, but I am safe, comfortable, and enjoy assorted projects.

                        I have built a tubular steel trailer, a myriad of arts and craft goodies like lamps, book ends, a barbecue grill from a 55 gallon drum, gates, a welding table, a specifically designed welding cart for my HOBART welder and Thermoline plasma cutter, and a lot more stuff.

                        The project I'm working on right now is a dog feeder. It is about 16" tall and 9 1/2" square.
                        It is designed to hold a 2 quart stainless bowl. I also added horseshoes for decoration.
                        The entire thing is made from 1" sq tubing 16GA.
                        The mitered corners are for the top assembly
                        I previously made a dual feeder of a different design for my son.
                        Sorry guys I'm unable to present photos.

                        Cactus Man
                        Last edited by cactusman; 09-22-2008, 12:15 AM.

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                        • #13
                          Re: welding question

                          One of my friends took Welding 101 at the local Community College years back. This is the most honest guy in the world. He said the instructor literally gave them the stick welder and some metal and said weld. No instruction whatsoever. Nothing like hands on but a little instruction would be good. He said there was not even a book for the curriculum. I hope it's changed.

                          I'll check into it.

                          Thanks.

                          J.C.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: welding question

                            I learned on a very old AC only GE brand 50's welder Dad picked up at an auction in about 1957.IIRC he got it for like 50 bucks brand new with the helmet.About 20 years ago I bought an Miller lightening thats A/C and D/C..what a world of difference.I have a little Lincoln 240 volt wirefeed that I really prefer,I had a lot of weeks on a job with a Hobart 120 volt wirefeed and hated using it..I really think that was mostly the supply voltage fault as the site was on gennys.
                            I've no idea how many boxes of rod I've burnt thru but built masts for small to 50' commercial boats.Built several flatbed trailers,hard faced on buckets,welded pins on loaders,built 3 flatbeds for pickups,I forget what all else.Guess I was about 12 when Dad started me in and that was hard facing an old bucket on the loader we had.
                            Welding is just LOTS of practice and learning from mistakes.Once you start in on a wirefeed you'll wonder how you got by before it,specially on thin stuff.The little wirefeed I have has maybe 20 rolls of wire gone thru it and that was done in the 1st 4 years I owned it.I haven't welded in about 8 years now so it'll be some practice again..soon too as the welders get shipped out next month to the Philippines for some fence and window grate making.
                            Sam

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                            • #15
                              Re: welding question

                              Sam,
                              Even though there may have been some time in between welding jobs, it's kinda like riding a bike. You get going again and it'll come back real fast. Just takes a little practice to get the skill level back to what it was when you last pulled the plug on the machine, but it'll happen. Don't worry.
                              Cheers,
                              Jim Don

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