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  • #16
    Re: President Bush Attacked

    Originally posted by Gene Bickford View Post
    I am so fed up with people blaming Bush for all the country's problems. You know who's really to blame?
    The people that willingly signed contracts for loans they could not afford.
    The company's that loaned the money to those that could not pay it back.
    I've been saying for years that you can not buy a half a million dollar house if you and your spouse's only source of income is working at Burger King. People got greedy, and it helped to put the country in the position it is in now.

    I don't agree with most of what Bush has done, but the problems with this country were not caused solely by him.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: President Bush Attacked

      [QUOTE=I don't agree with most of what Bush has done, but the problems with this country were not caused solely by him.[/QUOTE]

      "Solely".....like the sole of a shoe...?

      Good play on words.....

      I'm on "The List" and I love it!!

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: President Bush Attacked

        it does not matter if you like him or not. the shoe throwing is not disrespecting him as a president .it is DISRESPECTING AMERICAN . that is what he stand for USA .

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: President Bush Attacked

          Not being an Americian and putting my views on this forum I am happily suprised at the majority view on Bush`s performace with regard to Iraq and not letting your patriotism cloud you views as it normally does.
          I know you are not going to like this but Saddam was the U.S.'s greatest allie and being a dictator he was never going the allow Al Queda to have a foot hold in Iraq as they could have toppled him as well and we all know what dictators are like.
          But now that Saddam has gone and as a Sunnis he kept the majority the Shiitis under his thumb and because we in the west beleave in democracy the Shiites will win in any future election and because the majority in Iran are Shiite as well guess what they will do aline with each other and be great mates.
          What Bush has done is open a pandora's box and heaven help us in the years to come.

          Tony

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: President Bush Attacked

            Originally posted by Dairylander View Post
            Imagine this:
            You live in a country with a dictatorship.
            A foreign country drops a bomb on your house, killing your Mother and cousin.
            That foreign country then comes in, rebuilds your house for you, and gives you a better government.
            Which emotion will prevail in your heart?
            Anger for your dead family,
            or gratitude for the new, better governement?


            Given the posh living before america invaded,


            I'd rather be a Kurd that was gassed like 200,000 others including my family when Saddam and Chemical Ali, along with the torture chambers and their way of justice was so common.


            But see, these were the good ole days when you stood up against Saddam, good times, good times.


            Oh but this didn't happen,

            there wasn't mass graves

            there wasn't torture chambers

            there wasn't constant refusal of UN inspections

            There wasn't SCUD missles lobbed into Kuwait



            This is just a dream, the innocent don't need a voice because it doesn't serve the whimsical purpose for a good political debate here in america.


            It's just a dream, it never happened, these are all just actors in the theater of war.

            Nobody died before we arrived,

            you're dishonoring a soldier. I praise that very soldier. He affords me freedom. His sacrifice for me is a selfless act and I consider that a privilege to voice my opinion in a moment in history where ALL parties involved, by their own voices felt Saddam was a threat to his own people, his neighbors, and the world community as a whole. People don't hide and refuse inspectors unless they're hiding something, something big.


            Where are they? Syria, had 19 months to move the majority out of the country, that's our fault. I can post 100's of videos of what posh living in Iraq was all about before we ever came to town.

            It wasn't pretty, far from it. But if there's a difference in dying from a harsh dictatorship against another country ridding the foul amoungst the muck, one might be more dignified, justified than the other. Neither you nor I have been in a torture chamber. I don't recall any of those here in the states.

            Listen to the majority of soldiers that come back from Iraq, and listen to them, not your political agenda. You'd be surprised. But for some, that's not how you'll condemn or commend. Can't stray from the design of your political way, it might show consideration for the truth.

            Can't have that......oh no. That wouldn't be possible.
            Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: President Bush Attacked

              Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
              I'd rather be a Kurd that was gassed like 200,000 others including my family when Saddam and Chemical Ali, along with the torture chambers and their way of justice was so common.
              Are these the same Kurds Bush Sr. incited to rise, promised help and then did NOTHING when the Kurds were gassed? Oops, I forgot, he actually took a break 10 second form a game of golf to express his sympathy with the Kurds.

              C'mon, the US government did not mind at all while Saddam gassed people around. In fact Iraq enjoyed a lot of American support.



              For those who still live in the Lalaland of "Bush for freedom and democracy", read Brzezinski's The Grand Chessboard: American primacy and its geostrategic imperative. That ought to open some eyes. The book was written a couple years before Iraq. It reads like a script to what is now history.

              Saddam could have gassed, tortured and killed at will and the US government would do nothing. Zilch. And we have had examples of it.

              What Saddam did that was that last straw that broke the camel's back. He started trading oil in Euro instead of the US Dollar. If all countries did that the US economy would have been pretty much finished. It's all about money folks. Freedom, democracy and such are just the stickers used by politicians to get support for whatever their bosses' next financial goals are.

              Throwing a shoe at the decider can certainly be considered as throwing a shoe at the entire American nation, or at least at those who voted for that failed "leader". After all he was elected not once, but twice!!!. I couldn't believe it when he was elected the first time. But twice?!

              On the other hand, a people's reaction to an ofence of a president depends on whether they identify themselves with him or not. I itched to throw a baottle filled with gasoline at the leader of my home country when it was still communist. Right now I don't care, but from what I hear, the current one could do with a kick in his rear end. That does not mean that I would be kicked too.

              Again, as for the shoe, it all depends on its make. If it was a good quality shoe then Bush might actually feel honored. He certainly is not worth more than an average one.
              In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: President Bush Attacked

                So, in your point of view darius, Dead Kurds mean nothing to you other than a political punt because the ever so obvious picture of Rumsfield shaking hands with Saddam...back in the 80's.


                That was then, and my posting was to example how many were dying, not glorify bush and his actions.


                But of course, if your geared to react to death in political retort, "playing golf" as you so speaketh, who was wrong for posting at this point? Surely it wasn't me as I'm letting people know that there was plenty of death in that country long before we arrived.


                But posting what you did would lead me to believe that you are the armchair type that would want Zarquawi, Uday and Qusay alive and well, the underbelly structure of what was known as massive corruption within the highest levels.


                If you so must, do a draw comparison since you're outside the box in Ontario making judgement calls about another countries choices and figure out how bad it is inside the united states against Iraq, and see if it matches up with our government slaughtering its people. It might be starving out the weak financially but the corruption is more of financial than making sacrificial lambs by use of inhumane actions.

                You probably really don't care about dead people, do you? I guess I should go read a book, someone's financial gain of an opinion put to print. No thank you. I've seen far too much distortion already, the filtered information I already have to deal with between what they want us to hear and what is actually going on.


                That's why I recommend everyone talking to a soldier to know what's really going on. But of course, throwing a shoe means more for political warfare.
                Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: President Bush Attacked

                  Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                  Given the posh living before america invaded,


                  I'd rather be a Kurd that was gassed like 200,000 others including my family when Saddam and Chemical Ali, along with the torture chambers and their way of justice was so common.


                  But see, these were the good ole days when you stood up against Saddam, good times, good times.


                  Oh but this didn't happen,

                  there wasn't mass graves

                  there wasn't torture chambers

                  there wasn't constant refusal of UN inspections

                  There wasn't SCUD missles lobbed into Kuwait



                  This is just a dream, the innocent don't need a voice because it doesn't serve the whimsical purpose for a good political debate here in america.


                  It's just a dream, it never happened, these are all just actors in the theater of war.

                  Nobody died before we arrived,

                  you're dishonoring a soldier. I praise that very soldier. He affords me freedom. His sacrifice for me is a selfless act and I consider that a privilege to voice my opinion in a moment in history where ALL parties involved, by their own voices felt Saddam was a threat to his own people, his neighbors, and the world community as a whole. People don't hide and refuse inspectors unless they're hiding something, something big.


                  Where are they? Syria, had 19 months to move the majority out of the country, that's our fault. I can post 100's of videos of what posh living in Iraq was all about before we ever came to town.

                  It wasn't pretty, far from it. But if there's a difference in dying from a harsh dictatorship against another country ridding the foul amoungst the muck, one might be more dignified, justified than the other. Neither you nor I have been in a torture chamber. I don't recall any of those here in the states.

                  Listen to the majority of soldiers that come back from Iraq, and listen to them, not your political agenda. You'd be surprised. But for some, that's not how you'll condemn or commend. Can't stray from the design of your political way, it might show consideration for the truth.

                  Can't have that......oh no. That wouldn't be possible.
                  Yes, the USA supported and paled around with dictators including sadaam. We stood by while he committed many atrocities, and then at some point for reasons many disagree upon a change came and sadaam an his regime came to an end. Has it lead to a worse mess? I don't know. VP Cheneyrecently said we would have gone into iraq regardless of the reports of wmd's. Personally I think better late than never to stop sadaam and his crew. A few years back I read an article in I think it was Esquire magazine about sadaam's son and how he and his bodyguards kidnapped a young woman right off the street. She was stripped , repeatedly beaten and raped over the course of a couple weeks then covered with honey and fed to his dogs who had been kept hungry for several days. Where was the shoe throwing back then? Who protected that young woman and the others who met the same fate? A red carpet was rolled out for that dirt bag from iran and our President has to duck shoes? Wrong guys, it was an insult to our troops and to all Americans who share in the personal loss, emotional suffering and financial cost of the iraq war. Maybe this war will drag on longer than we want and end poorly, but it won't be for lack of trying. The iraquis have been given their chance for freedom thanks to President Bush and our troops. Will they rise to the occassion and cherish this gift or insult the "instrument " of their freedom from that hell?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: President Bush Attacked

                    Bush is the tip of the iceberg, Both sides of the aisle have let their personal gain trump what is good for America. Capitalism without constraints is inhumane. I think we should strive to become more self sufficient, which will allow us to mind our own business as far as trying to control a part of the world where we depend on energy. If we mind our own business and a foreign entity decides to harm us I have no problem with us taking them completely down and leaving them where they lay. This WW2 mentality where we go in destroy rebuild and be buddies is not going to work in today's world. The way we're doing things now is just making us a bankrupt cop.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: President Bush Attacked

                      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                      So, in your point of view darius, Dead Kurds mean nothing to you other than a political punt because the ever so obvious picture of Rumsfield shaking hands with Saddam...back in the 80's.
                      I don't know how you managed to twist my post about callous Bush Sr. into me not caring about Kurds.

                      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                      But posting what you did would lead me to believe that you are the armchair type that would want Zarquawi, Uday and Qusay alive and well, the underbelly structure of what was known as massive corruption within the highest levels.
                      I resent being compared to criminals, and I don't think I gave any reason to justify this. You couldn't be further off in what you think about the armchair type that you think I am. I know real conflict and real fight. And yes, bottles with gasoline were used. I took part in it and I don't regret a single moment of it, even if the risk was genuine - people were killed. Depending on your age you may have been sitting in your armchair and watching this on some American channel, while I was in the midst of what you saw.

                      http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=_exZCp40x9w

                      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                      You probably really don't care about dead people, do you? I guess I should go read a book, someone's financial gain of an opinion put to print. No thank you. I've seen far too much distortion already, the filtered information I already have to deal with between what they want us to hear and what is actually going on.
                      Again, you are distorting my post.
                      Go to your local library. It's free.

                      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                      That's why I recommend everyone talking to a soldier to know what's really going on.
                      Which soldier? The ones who see they shouldn't be there in the first place? Or maybe to the parents of those soldiers who can no longer speak for themselves?

                      Back to the shoe. The decider is lame duck. The shoe did nothing to him. Women throw shoes at ya more skillfully, and it appears Bush has some experience with that.

                      You seem to be defending a possible war criminal, the worst US president ever and a callous bastard. In my book this is not the way to show patriotism. I can't think of a single positive thing about the decider as a politician and a nation's leader.

                      Notice that even his security seems to care little about the incident. If they did the second shoe wouldn't even get in the air. Or are his security that poorly trained?
                      In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: President Bush Attacked

                        Woah there, Dunbar, you're getting way off topic, let's reign it in a bit.
                        This thread is about the shoe.
                        Imagine this:
                        You're an Iraqi at an open air market, and there are U.S. soldiers around, making it safe for you to conduct business.
                        The next day you witness American soldiers gunning down women and children in cold blood.
                        What you don't know is that they aren't soldiers, but rather Blackwater security contractors, and they will be convicted for this crime.
                        http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/...n4649532.shtml
                        All you know is what you saw; Americans in combat fatigues shooting un-armed civilians.
                        What impression of America will you retain?
                        Is it really so hard to understand the contempt that Iraqis may have for Bush?
                        The Iraqis that have blood running in their streets don't have the luxury of a historical perspective on the democratization of their country.

                        Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                        you're dishonoring a soldier.
                        Easy with the cliche's, Dunbar.
                        The only one dishonoring soldiers is the Bush/Cheney administration that has used our sons and daughters as pawns in their Iraq oil adventure,
                        while Al Queda grows in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

                        Comment

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