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  • Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

    It's on right now.

    More than enlightening to hear about how these investments were pilfered outside of the economic situation right now.
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  • #2
    Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

    Which is why I don't have a 401k. Somehow, the thought of putting my retirement funds to the mercy of the forces that drive Wall Street (Let's not kid ourselves folks, those forces are Fear and Greed) that care nothing for my well being, just doesn't sit well for me.

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    • #3
      Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

      What's amazing in that interview was the lobbyist for 401K's; he basically called it as "take it on the chin, you're pretty much have to chalk it to personal responsibility"


      Nice you SOB, people invested all that money thinking they was doing the right thing and indirectly they lost it all.


      You wouldn't believe how many people have told me that they won't even open up their 401K statements when they come in the mail.

      As the saying goes,

      I never had a 401K...and I'm glad I didn't because to think of all those people that had something worthwhile that all disappeared in a flash?

      Welcome to the school of hard knocks. People in their 50's on up have a grim sadness about them on that topic. Changes everything for them when they "thought" it was there and now it isn't.

      I found that lobbyist to be very cynical, and he basically said that you won't see anything in those work out to what they was worth in 15-20 years.


      And why in the hell do you people put money in CD's with only a 2.8% interest rate? F**K them. If it don't earn above normal sales tax, I'm not bothering. And the efforts and BS paperwork for a CD is ridiculous. Banks are scams and if I could I'd start my own.

      I got $5 who wants to borrow it.
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      • #4
        Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

        You found a CD over 2%?

        You sure it's a bank?

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        • #5
          Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

          i think 4 years back i had a 6 month cd that was around 5.3% last month down to 1.4%
          i agree that not much point in thinking you are going to make much money with that percent.
          but on the plus side when tax time came around i didnt have to pay as much in taxes

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          • #6
            Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

            Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
            What's amazing in that interview was the lobbyist for 401K's; he basically called it as "take it on the chin, you're pretty much have to chalk it to personal responsibility"


            Nice you SOB, people invested all that money thinking they was doing the right thing and indirectly they lost it all.


            You wouldn't believe how many people have told me that they won't even open up their 401K statements when they come in the mail.

            As the saying goes,

            I never had a 401K...and I'm glad I didn't because to think of all those people that had something worthwhile that all disappeared in a flash?

            Welcome to the school of hard knocks. People in their 50's on up have a grim sadness about them on that topic. Changes everything for them when they "thought" it was there and now it isn't.

            I found that lobbyist to be very cynical, and he basically said that you won't see anything in those work out to what they was worth in 15-20 years.


            And why in the hell do you people put money in CD's with only a 2.8% interest rate? F**K them. If it don't earn above normal sales tax, I'm not bothering. And the efforts and BS paperwork for a CD is ridiculous. Banks are scams and if I could I'd start my own.

            I got $5 who wants to borrow it.
            I'm gonna' take the other side on some of this. I thought the report was biased on some accounts and left out some information to draw a proper conclusion.

            There is not one 401k of Mutual Fund with any guarantee of a return. Not one. Your initial investment could go down in value irregardless of fees. I have empathy for that poor lady that lost her job and portfolio had lost thousands in value. It made for good TV with her being that upset.

            But her job loss had zero to do with hidden fees in 401k's. On top of that, unless I missed it, they did not show the hidden fees of her 401k and how it impacted her investment. If I missed it correct me. If they would have checked with her 2 or 3 years earlier, I bet she wouldn't have any complaints of fees. Because when your investment is outrunning the fees, nobody cares. When the reverse happens, something is terribly wrong.

            Then they showed another couple that would not be able to retire as they had planned. Told of how much they lost in their retirements. But they did not show the total that the hidden fees had impacted their investment.

            The lobbyist for the 401k industry is no surprise. Ever seen an ethical lobbyist? I don't think I have. Don't get me started on pharmaceutical lobbyists. The 401k guy they had on even looked like a typical con man out of some old BW film.

            Don't get me wrong, there should definitely be transparency of fees. If any business doesn't have it clearly for laypersons, then your just trying to mislead or cheat in some way.

            I think that the mobile phone providers are worse that these people still. And regulators have been on their azz to be more clear about their fees.

            I don't go into any "contract" without knowing the total to end/satisfy that contract.

            Here's something interesting to do that I do, go check on mobile phone plans and tell them you don't care about the monthly cost, you won't to know the total cost of the contract. That's what a contract is, right? I have not ran into one that didn't get all flustered and not know what to do. I want to know what it costs to satisfy the 1 to 2 year commitment with all fees for my area included.

            And I have to calculate myself, every time.

            What I'm getting at is responsibility. It's your responsibility to check on your investments costs. Intelligent, more educated people than myself just blindly put there hard earned money in investments because they did not want to "miss out" and really don't pay attention to the total risk and cost.

            And blind faith in anything will get you killed.

            J.C.

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            • #7
              Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

              Definitely spot on with those statements. It's a "choice" that people made thinking they had what was guaranteed because the masses were doing it, everyone bragging about how their 401K was growing leaps and bounds and everyone is happy, almost trying to make people envious that they had it.

              AFAIK, people could of pulled out this money which was subject to fines and fees, penalties and get taxed on the money.....but they still would of had it, just a significantly smaller amount.

              But it has to be more than what they have now....which is almost damn near nothing.

              People wonder why I have 4 banks, 13 bank accounts, 3 businesses and 27 website domains........? Diversify because I'm making sure I have dollars coming at me from every direction when it all comes together. It's going to happen at some point and I'm not going to trust anything that the masses follow at this point.

              The stock market is basically comprised of day traders now, not really investors at this point. Still too risky and remember that the percentages are low for the majority of those who recently got burned.

              Just think about how many people lost their arse in the stock market, and they're not coming back. Those replacement values are hard to come by when so many lost such a considerable percentage......which all equates to personal risk.

              How much are you willing to gamble...is the best way to figure it all out.
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              • #8
                Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                AFAIK, people could of pulled out this money which was subject to fines and fees, penalties and get taxed on the money.....but they still would of had it, just a significantly smaller amount.
                A 401K should have more options than just stocks, including government bonds etc that should hold value reasonably well (they can still lose, but shouldn't have as wild swings as stocks). Moving from one fund to another in a 401K has no tax consequences. Hell you can even buy gold if that floats your boat (of course that is even more speculative).

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                • #9
                  Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                  Originally posted by cpw View Post
                  A 401K should have more options than just stocks, including government bonds etc that should hold value reasonably well (they can still lose, but shouldn't have as wild swings as stocks). Moving from one fund to another in a 401K has no tax consequences. Hell you can even buy gold if that floats your boat (of course that is even more speculative).

                  Didn't the value of gold spike sky high when everything else started to fall?

                  Seems like gold is the default safe place to go, short of a mattress.
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                  • #10
                    Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                    "Ever wonder why fund managers can't beat the S&P 500? 'Cause they're sheep, and sheep get slaughtered." -Gordon Gekko (Wall St.)
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                    • #11
                      Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                      Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                      Didn't the value of gold spike sky high when everything else started to fall?

                      Seems like gold is the default safe place to go, short of a mattress.
                      If you think gold is safe take a look at this chart DJIA vs gold since 1980.

                      http://stockcharts.com/charts/histor...agold1980.html

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                      • #12
                        Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                        401Ks came about after the S&L debacle. It was a way for them to get you to sock a big pile of money away and not touch it because it was too painful (penalties/taxes/etc) to do, so you just left it there watching it grow (on paper). In the mean time they had that huge block of cash that wasn't going anywhere soon and when it did go they knew long in advance when it would be due so could plan for it (your retirement day). In between they loaned out your money and made money on it for themselves. Worked great for a long time. Now they needed to find a way to make your paper profits disappear because your money was spent a long time ago. Now that the biggest block of potential retirees is ready to call it quits they have to come up with something to account (I use that term loosely here) for what happened to your earnings from the past 20 or so years.
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                        • #13
                          Re: Watch the 60 Minutes segment about 401K's

                          Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                          401Ks came about after the S&L debacle. It was a way for them to get you to sock a big pile of money away and not touch it because it was too painful (penalties/taxes/etc) to do, so you just left it there watching it grow (on paper). In the mean time they had that huge block of cash that wasn't going anywhere soon and when it did go they knew long in advance when it would be due so could plan for it (your retirement day). In between they loaned out your money and made money on it for themselves. Worked great for a long time. Now they needed to find a way to make your paper profits disappear because your money was spent a long time ago. Now that the biggest block of potential retirees is ready to call it quits they have to come up with something to account (I use that term loosely here) for what happened to your earnings from the past 20 or so years.


                          Definitely a true statement and I can see how it worked well for them, all the way.
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