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  • #16
    Re: Freedom Alliance

    Here's another wonderful, warm and fuzzy thing that fell out of an elected officials mouth:

    "Today in a front page article the Enquirer carries a quote from John Boehner (taken from the National Review). Boehner, who represents the neighboring district to the north says if Driehaus votes for the bill ""the Catholics will run him out of town. He may be a dead man. He can’t go home to the West Side of Cincinnati."

    This is what passes for reasonable political discourse? Saying someone is a dead man if they don't vote the right way? Really? He couldn't find a better choice of words?

    Health insurance is a huge drain on business. If we can get health insurance costs down, that will make us more competitive. How are other countries that do provide 'socialized' health care able to be more competitive? I know for a fact that our health insurance premiums at work have had double digit increases for the past ten years. Often times in the 13%-16% range. I like to think that I could have received a raise or two during that same time, which would have been a lot better for the economy. I guarantee you that an extra buck or two in my pocket would get recirculated faster than an extra buck or two in the top .2%.

    As for FOX News, they are a corrosive element in any dialog key to the nations interest. They do a fine job preventing honest debate. Of course we also have the Wall Street Journal and Washington Post polluting the waters.

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    • #17
      Re: Freedom Alliance

      Then what is the "right" news to watch and read?

      J.C.

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      • #18
        Re: Freedom Alliance

        Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
        Then what is the "right" news to watch and read?

        J.C.
        J.C., it doesn't matter, they are all slanted. Which is the right political party to vote for? Seriously, has either helped the country, economy and people ahead of their own agenda?

        We know politicians from both parties have stolen, cheated and worse, above all, together both parties have got us in two wars, bailing out big businesses and wallstreet, over our head in debt to communist china, double digit unemployment, Americans living in tents! Still think there is a "right" News?

        The old saying "Keep your friends close, your enemies closer" is true. At least I know where Fox News is coming from and I can easily sort out the obvious, unlike the other stations. I was fed up with the republicans and trusted Obama, could be the worst voting mistake I've made my entire life. Now we have democrats telling us what constitutes being Patriotic. Some change alright.

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        • #19
          Re: Freedom Alliance

          Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
          I was fed up with the republicans and trusted Obama, could be the worst voting mistake I've made my entire life.
          You can do what I do Frank anytime you regret voting for Barack Obama just remind yourself the other option was John McCain.

          I'll take the lesser of two evils any day.

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          • #20
            Re: Freedom Alliance

            Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
            Now we have democrats telling us what constitutes being Patriotic. Some change alright.
            Really? Please do share.

            Obama and the mainstream democratic party are nothing more than corporatists. As for the war in Afgahnistan, had W ordered Shock-n-Awe in Afghanistan on 9/12/2001 instead of waiting eight weeks to send in troops. Meanwhile he could have told the world we are going to cut our dependence on oil from nations that want to destroy us.
            Last edited by SpiffPeters; 03-20-2010, 06:35 PM.

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            • #21
              Re: Freedom Alliance

              I'll take the first guy that stands up there and has the balls to tell it like it is whether we want to hear it or not.

              I'll take the first guy that lives like we live. That knows how much a loaf of bread costs, that takes the bus, that grumbles every time he fills his oil tank or has to pay the gas bill. A guy that pays cash for his dinner and drives a 97 Civic.

              I'll take the first guy that tells lobbyists and the other crooks that skulk around the halls of congress to get the F out of his office.

              I'll take the first guy that isn't screwing his secretary or anyone else other than his wife.

              I'll take the first guy who's kids go to the same public schools that my kids go to.

              I'll take the first guy that has the same health care coverage that I have because sure as hell congressmen are not going to get the same crap they are selling us.

              I'll take the first guy that sheds a real tear when one of our soldiers is killed in the line of duty.

              I'll take the first guy that puts AMERICAS and Americans interest above the interests of anybody else in the world.

              I'll take the first guy that runs the illegal aliens out of this country.

              I'll take the first guy that brings Detroit back to life.

              I'll take the first guy that does not give a damn about political correctness or hurting someones feelings.

              I'll take the first guy that does not lie, cheat, steal, spin, double talk or bambooze us.
              sigpic

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              • #22
                Re: Freedom Alliance

                Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                Really? Please do share.

                Obama and the mainstream democratic party are nothing more than corporatists. As for the war in Afgahnistan, had W ordered Shock-n-Awe in Afghanistan on 9/12/2001 instead of waiting eight weeks to send in troops. Meanwhile he could have told the world we are going to cut our dependence on oil from nations that want to destroy us.
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTamBfz0Efo&NR=1
                Guess it's only okay to speak up and speak out when it fits her needs? She must have gotten this out of Hannity's play book.
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lyaMrS0hzk
                Oh, we have freedom of speech alright, right until someone in power shuts you up!
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWACkbIh6H4
                Someone said Freedom of Speech?

                Come on guys, you'd have to be living under a rock or in denial to believe democrats have not done the same thing to stifle opposition.
                Last edited by Frankiarmz; 03-20-2010, 07:03 PM.

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                • #23
                  Re: Freedom Alliance

                  Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTamBfz0Efo&NR=1
                  Guess it's only okay to speak up and speak out when it fits her needs? She must have gotten this out of Hannity's play book.
                  I agree with her. And so should every American.

                  Democracy isn't about who is the loudest. Last summers town hall theater was a sham. People were given scripts and instruction on how to disrupt these meetings.

                  Disrupt. Got it? Disrupt. Not contribute, not challenge, not to disagree but to disrupt and prevent others from sharing their views at these meetings.

                  Why should someone who was bused in from another district be allowed to disrupt a public meeting between a congressperson and their constituents?

                  Do you have more evidence where the dems have accused dissenters of not being true Americans, because that example doesn't cut it.

                  Now forcing congress to pass the so-called Patriot Act on the eve of the mid term elections was a clever way of making every member of congress 'prove' they were patriotic. Can you imagine having to explain to your constituents back in the fall of 02 that we voted against the Patriot Act? And no one beat the drum louder then, and now, than FOX News and their pundits as to what a good American said and did.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Freedom Alliance

                    I attended two town hall meetings last summer. NOBODY was given a script. Nobody was told what to say. It was and is people angry and concerned over what is going on in our nations capitol and if we can not voice our own opinions then we might as well all move to China. Funny how the same liberals that were more than happy to march on Washington during the Viet Nam war are so threatened by protesters.
                    sigpic

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                    • #25
                      Re: Freedom Alliance

                      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                      I attended two town hall meetings last summer. NOBODY was given a script. Nobody was told what to say. It was and is people angry and concerned over what is going on in our nations capitol and if we can not voice our own opinions then we might as well all move to China. Funny how the same liberals that were more than happy to march on Washington during the Viet Nam war are so threatened by protesters.
                      Did you disrupt the meeting? Did you shout over others? Did you prevent other people, with perhaps different perspectives, from voicing their opinion?

                      Spirited, lively, heated debates and meetings are fine. What is un-American is preventing others from exercising their freedom of speech.

                      Fact of the matter is the majority of people want HCR. Now Scott Rasmussen has polled differently, but every other major poll has shown a clear and decisive majority want HCR. Just because the minority is vocal doesn't mean they are right.

                      And what heck does disrupting a meeting and preventing others from exercising their constitutional right to free speech have to do with Vietnam war protest marches? And BTW, I think history has more than vindicated those marchers concerns. They were right.
                      Last edited by SpiffPeters; 03-20-2010, 08:41 PM.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Freedom Alliance

                        Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                        Fact of the matter is the majority of people want HCR. Now Scott Rasmussen has polled differently, but every other major poll has shown a clear and decisive majority want HCR. Just because the minority is vocal doesn't mean they are right.
                        Wanting HCR and wanting this bill are very different things.

                        I would like cost containment measures, but there are none in sight.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Freedom Alliance

                          I think the majority do want healthcare reform. The system has evolved into a hornets nest of paperwork driven by business types with no concept of medical care. What the majority don't want is government run health care. Name one thing the government does that truly cannot be done more efficiently by private industry. All health care would need to be fixed would be a law stating that everyone pays the same for the same service. How can a hospital provide surgery for insurance company A for $3000, for insurance company B they charge $5000 and for the poor working guy with no health insurance, he pays $12,000. That is the kind of crap that needs to go away. I am not saying that each hospital needs to charge the same as the next hospital, but rather within each hospital they need to charge one price for the same service. If Mcdonalds charged different prices for big Macs based on who the customer worked for, there would be riots. Why should health care be any different?
                          Last edited by JTROANOKE; 03-20-2010, 09:02 PM.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Freedom Alliance

                            Originally posted by cpw View Post
                            Wanting HCR and wanting this bill are very different things.

                            I would like cost containment measures, but there are none in sight.
                            According to the CBO, it cuts the deficit. Whether it does or doesn't is another matter perhaps, but according to the crystal ball it doesn't cost us anything thing in the long run.

                            There is plenty to not like about this bill. Absolutely. But there are some long overdue fixes in this bill too.

                            "The insurance giant Cigna last year gave compensation packages worth more than $120 million to two executives who left the company, according to a filing with the SEC on Friday.

                            The vast majority of that total went to former chairman and CEO H. Edward Hanway who left his post with a retirement package worth $110.9 million -- which included $18.8 million in executive compensation for 2009, as well as a healthy pension plan, deferred compensation and stock options."

                            Link to the article

                            Link to the SEC filing See pages 5-16 for details and page 93 for the grand total.

                            Don't know about the rest of you, but that's a lot of money that could have and should have gone to patient care. Executive compensation packages have simply become obscene.
                            Last edited by SpiffPeters; 03-20-2010, 09:57 PM.

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                            • #29
                              Re: Freedom Alliance

                              Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                              According to the CBO, it cuts the deficit. Whether it does or doesn't is another matter perhaps, but according to the crystal ball it doesn't cost us anything thing in the long run.
                              It is easier to do when you've got 10 years of taxes and 6 years of benefits. If you run the analysis out farther, that is no longer true.

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                              • #30
                                Re: Freedom Alliance

                                Originally posted by cpw View Post
                                It is easier to do when you've got 10 years of taxes and 6 years of benefits. If you run the analysis out farther, that is no longer true.
                                Politifact.com has some brief articles on those quotes.

                                Your first quote is half true. Some programs will only be in effect for 6 years.

                                http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...10-years-taxe/

                                Your second quote, implying it will cost us money in the long run has no factual basis. At the same time, the savings Pelosi put out are questionable. The CBO report expects savings after the first 10 years as well but they were not so bold as to put numbers on that.

                                http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...uld-cut-defic/

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