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  • #16
    Re: Census

    Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
    What if we all put down 100 per household?

    J.C.

    It would make our taxes go up for no reason......

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Census

      we got the long form. filled it out. the collector came by. asked the pertinent questions. thanked me for my time and went next door to talk to the neighbors

      sorry, but i'm just not as paranoid as some of you are. i realize that as a country we are pretty much screwed, but me having 1,000 cases of ammo for the day "they" take over just means i'm out $$$ for 999.8 cases of ammo. i'd rather have a few cases of cold Heinekin

      maybe i'll take the dogs and go to the beach

      steve
      In the never ending struggle to keep the water flowing.... The Poo Poo Cowboy rides again!!!

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Census

        Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
        Well Spiff, count me as part of that minority! I see the situation with illegals from two different perspectives. First they do cost money for the services they use and tax payers pay for, although most are decent hardworking, family folks, there is a "minority" among them which consists of criminals. Immigration laws were designed to control population and monitor folks coming into the country and other legal and necessary details which are lost when folks enter at will.

        My other thoughts on the situation of illegals is how they are used and abused while forced to live in limbo, afraid to complain of dangerous situations or abuse. I think folks who endorse illegals actually contribute to this abuse because in my opinion they need to come out of the shadows and either be given the option to work towards citizenship or leave. Our country like others, does not exist to benefit and enrich those who want to profit from jobs but not pay into the system that overseas the process (government).

        I have no problem with penalties and criminal punishment for those who employ illegals, but illegals need to be accountable for their actions as well. We have laws for a purpose and they should either be enforced or abolished. If you want to defend the hard working, decent folks who are here illegally, then stop the abuse and demand they be taken out of the shadows. Force employers to pay Americans a living wage to do all jobs, then see if there is any job left undone.
        First of all, they have been leaving the country faster than they have been coming in. The metrics used to arrive at the 12 million figure are now reporting around 10.5 million. And when we have illegals leaving the country faster than they are coming in, that tells you something.

        We don't have an illegal worker problem in this country. We have an illegal employer problem in this country. Once they start throwing employers in jail for hiring illegals you can consider the illegals a dusty memory. Could any American go to Mexico or Canada and get a job without providing proof of residency?

        I'm sure there are employers that take advantage of these peoples illegal status. Heck, many employers barely do what the law requires these days. Employees are simply a work unit. When a work unit wears out or does not perform to specified standards, it is replaced with a better performing unit - often times at a lower cost. Experience and judgement are not marketable commodities for employees.

        Two things you will have a hard time doing to corporate AG.

        One is eliminate their workforce. You think produce is expensive now? Wait till you have to pay those crop pickers a living wage. So in lieu of taxes, we get less expensive lettuce.

        Second is discontinue farm subsidies.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Census

          Illegal aliens cost around 6 billion a year according to government figures. That figure includes such things as healthcare, prison internment ( almost 70% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens) The cost of federal I.N.S agents and agencies, and lost tax revenue not to mention
          the burdon the children put on the schools.
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Census

            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
            almost 70% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens
            Got any info to back up that claim?!

            I've heard a few numbers thrown up on that subject. Illegal aliens with out a doubt take up prison beds disproportionately to their percentage in the American populous. It is an noted issue that they do take up a fair percentage of our prisons.

            But no where have a heard such a claim that the percentage amounts to 70%(well besides you now). So I'm curious as to how you came to believe that number. To me a claim of 70% is completely preposterous and defies common sense. It would be pretty ignorant to believe such a claim.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Census

              In 2007, the CBO released a report based on 29 state and local reports over the previous 15 years. The conclusion was that yes, illegals impose a net cost to state and local government but that the cost was most likely modest. They went on to report that "no agreement exists as to the size of, or even the best way of measuring, that cost on a national level."


              As for 70% of federal prisoners being illegals, that seems a bit high. I would be curious as to who or what your source may be.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Census

                I believe the first time I heard that figure was on MSNBC of all things and later on I found the same report on Micheal Savage's web site which was a re-print from a GAO report on the subject.
                sigpic

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Census

                  Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                  First of all, they have been leaving the country faster than they have been coming in. The metrics used to arrive at the 12 million figure are now reporting around 10.5 million. And when we have illegals leaving the country faster than they are coming in, that tells you something.

                  We don't have an illegal worker problem in this country. We have an illegal employer problem in this country. Once they start throwing employers in jail for hiring illegals you can consider the illegals a dusty memory. Could any American go to Mexico or Canada and get a job without providing proof of residency?

                  I'm sure there are employers that take advantage of these peoples illegal status. Heck, many employers barely do what the law requires these days. Employees are simply a work unit. When a work unit wears out or does not perform to specified standards, it is replaced with a better performing unit - often times at a lower cost. Experience and judgement are not marketable commodities for employees.

                  Two things you will have a hard time doing to corporate AG.

                  One is eliminate their workforce. You think produce is expensive now? Wait till you have to pay those crop pickers a living wage. So in lieu of taxes, we get less expensive lettuce.

                  Second is discontinue farm subsidies.
                  Spiff, once again you pick and choose rather than respond to the whole post. If you really care about people more than cheap lettuce, you would admit we do have a problem with illegals, and it needs to be resolved.

                  Demand ALL jobs pay a living wage, give the illegals a choice rather than deport them, and see what happens. Our laws should be upheld, taxes should be paid by those who earn income and use services paid for by taxes. The subculture of the illegal is a breeding ground for a multitude of abuses, step up and call for and end or share in the horror. Like I said, go right ahead and jail the employers who hire illegals, BUT hold illegals responsible for their actions in OUR country! Why is it so offensive that we apply our laws? Why is it so difficult to change the system that burdens the taxpayer and abuses the illegal at the same time? Where is all the dam change? I'm still not seeing it.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Census

                    Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                    I believe the first time I heard that figure was on MSNBC of all things and later on I found the same report on Micheal Savage's web site which was a re-print from a GAO report on the subject.
                    This seems to be your standard response when people point out your statements are false. Instead of providing any reliable site for your claims you send us on a wild goose chase. It is of my opinion is if you post something as the truth you should be able to point to at least one source that verifies it.

                    googling MSNBC and illegal aliens I found nothing that would lead anyone to believe the percentage of incarcerated illegals amounts to 70 percent of the federal prison population.

                    Here is the GOA report I found on the subject. The report does not contain 70% on a search of it.

                    A few numbers that come out close are 69% of people in the study were from California based prisons and 68% of illegals imprisoned are imprisoned for immigration related crimes. Maybe you or Mr Savage misconstrued those numbers to mean something else.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Census

                      Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                      This seems to be your standard response when people point out your statements are false. Instead of providing any reliable site for your claims you send us on a wild goose chase. It is of my opinion is if you post something as the truth you should be able to point to at least one source that verifies it.

                      googling MSNBC and illegal aliens I found nothing that would lead anyone to believe the percentage of incarcerated illegals amounts to 70 percent of the federal prison population.

                      Here is the GOA report I found on the subject. The report does not contain 70% on a search of it.

                      A few numbers that come out close are 69% of people in the study were from California based prisons and 68% of illegals imprisoned are imprisoned for immigration related crimes. Maybe you or Mr Savage misconstrued those numbers to mean something else.

                      Easy there BTR, you are starting to sound like those angry kids on the various "chan" forums.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Census

                        Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                        Illegals are counted by the census. A few factors prevent them from being counted correctly such as. Many illegals are afraid to fill out census forms thinking they will be found out(a legally unfounded fear) and because their is no documentation elsewhere in our government we don't know to pursue them if they fail to send in a form.

                        An illegal immigrant that fills out a census form will be counted and will affect all the things census counts reflect.

                        If you falsify a census form it is a federal offense btw so I'd recomend against writing in a hundred.
                        There are many laws on the books that are theoretical as opposed to reasonable, practical, and enforceable. Stating it's a federal offense may be 100% correct but....it doesn't really mean much.

                        I'm not even going to Google around to see but has anyone ever heard of anyone getting punished in the last 30 years for falsifying a Census form?


                        J.C.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Census

                          Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                          This seems to be your standard response when people point out your statements are false. Instead of providing any reliable site for your claims you send us on a wild goose chase. It is of my opinion is if you post something as the truth you should be able to point to at least one source that verifies it.

                          googling MSNBC and illegal aliens I found nothing that would lead anyone to believe the percentage of incarcerated illegals amounts to 70 percent of the federal prison population.

                          Here is the GOA report I found on the subject. The report does not contain 70% on a search of it.

                          A few numbers that come out close are 69% of people in the study were from California based prisons and 68% of illegals imprisoned are imprisoned for immigration related crimes. Maybe you or Mr Savage misconstrued those numbers to mean something else.
                          This illegal alien thing is a touchy subject for you are you one ???
                          Did you sneak into the United states moved to MA, and now your sneaking into the Ridgid forum?
                          Rod
                          MT. Washington Sewer & Drain Cleaning
                          Serving Berlin, NH and North Conway, NH areas
                          http://unclognh.com
                          http://mtwashingtonseweranddrainclea...m/default.aspx

                          Charging less does not mean more call volume it just means you have to work harder to reach your goals.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Census

                            Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                            Illegals are counted by the census. A few factors prevent them from being counted correctly such as. Many illegals are afraid to fill out census forms thinking they will be found out(a legally unfounded fear) and because their is no documentation elsewhere in our government we don't know to pursue them if they fail to send in a form.

                            An illegal immigrant that fills out a census form will be counted and will affect all the things census counts reflect.

                            If you falsify a census form it is a federal offense btw so I'd recomend against writing in a hundred.
                            And what the heck are you thinking here? Do you really think an ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT is going to EVER fill out a Census form and will-in your words-"affect all the things census counts reflect."???

                            I can't say I have enough information to conclude the positive and negative of illegal immigrants. But they will not help the Census at all in my opinion and the non recognition of them in turn, will not help legal citizens either.

                            J.C.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Census

                              What other county is dumb enough to allow millions to sneak in
                              like an invading army?
                              Rod
                              MT. Washington Sewer & Drain Cleaning
                              Serving Berlin, NH and North Conway, NH areas
                              http://unclognh.com
                              http://mtwashingtonseweranddrainclea...m/default.aspx

                              Charging less does not mean more call volume it just means you have to work harder to reach your goals.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Census

                                Originally posted by UnClogNH View Post
                                What other county is dumb enough to allow millions to sneak in
                                like an invading army?
                                I don't think our leaders were dumb, at least not for many years. They looked the other way as illegals picked crops and served in other very low paying jobs. This all became a problem as illegals became more mainstream, moving into the cities, using services like hospitals and schools. Now it is clear those of us who pay taxes are paying for the services these folks use. Now with all the violent drug gangs spilling over from mexico we see the border needs to be secured.

                                The situation with illegals needs to be resolved, not ignored. I don't think at this late time millions can or will be deported, not after so many years of looking the other way. Come up with a solution and a choice to stay and pay or leave, but stop looking the other way!

                                Comment

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