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  • #31
    Re: Census

    Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
    Illegals tend to displace low paying, unskilled labor. Not a big deal.
    Unless you are "unskilled" worker.

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Census

      Originally posted by cpw View Post
      Unless you are "unskilled" worker.
      Thanks for speaking up for me Charles.

      J.C.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Census

        Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
        I don't think our leaders were dumb, at least not for many years. They looked the other way as illegals picked crops and served in other very low paying jobs. This all became a problem as illegals became more mainstream, moving into the cities, using services like hospitals and schools. Now it is clear those of us who pay taxes are paying for the services these folks use. Now with all the violent drug gangs spilling over from mexico we see the border needs to be secured.

        The situation with illegals needs to be resolved, not ignored. I don't think at this late time millions can or will be deported, not after so many years of looking the other way. Come up with a solution and a choice to stay and pay or leave, but stop looking the other way!
        I would welcome the idea of all the "illegal's" being marched back to where they came from.
        with industry jobs being shipped over sea's pretty soon there will be only rich and everyone else fighting over tomato picking jobs
        Rod
        MT. Washington Sewer & Drain Cleaning
        Serving Berlin, NH and North Conway, NH areas
        http://unclognh.com
        http://mtwashingtonseweranddrainclea...m/default.aspx

        Charging less does not mean more call volume it just means you have to work harder to reach your goals.

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Census

          Originally posted by UnClogNH View Post
          I would welcome the idea of all the "illegal's" being marched back to where they came from.
          with industry jobs being shipped over sea's pretty soon there will be only rich and everyone else fighting over tomato picking jobs
          A lot of folks think that's where we are headed, no more middle class, just very wealthy and the rest of us fighting for scraps! Problem with matching the illegals back where they came from is the fact that most of them have been here so long. They have American children, businesses and the whole thing is a big dam mess. The politicians on both sides looked the other way for decades, time for them to stop playing games and fix the problem!

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Census

            Might be easier to take over Mexico turn them into the 51st state and make them all pay taxes. You know they can't afford health care fine them all.Think of Billions in revenue
            Rod
            MT. Washington Sewer & Drain Cleaning
            Serving Berlin, NH and North Conway, NH areas
            http://unclognh.com
            http://mtwashingtonseweranddrainclea...m/default.aspx

            Charging less does not mean more call volume it just means you have to work harder to reach your goals.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Census

              Originally posted by UnClogNH View Post
              Might be easier to take over Mexico turn them into the 51st state and make them all pay taxes. You know they can't afford health care fine them all.Think of Billions in revenue
              I would go for that idea, they got plenty of natural resources. There's no reason all those folks couldn't have a good life in their home country if it wasn't for the corrupt government. How did those drug gangs get so out of control? How come all the businesses that moved their can profit and yet the illegals are desperate to come here?

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Census

                Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
                And what the heck are you thinking here?
                I'm thinking that's how the laws work out. Good bad or otherwise was not the issue I was addressing. I was merely stating as I did:
                An illegal immigrant that fills out a census form will be counted and will affect all the things census counts reflect.
                I also mentioned reasons it does not happen.

                Originally posted by UnClogNH View Post
                This illegal alien thing is a touchy subject for you are you one ???
                Did you sneak into the United states moved to MA, and now your sneaking into the Ridgid forum?
                I don't have a bone in the fight on this issue. Immigration policy bothers me because it is a marked failure of all branches of our government. The executive branch because it fails to enforce the existing law. The legislative branch because it fails to make law to resolve the situation. And to a lesser degree the judicial branch because that have not taken issue with the fact the other two branches are failing in their role.

                Immigration is a debate that needs to be had in this country. When we have debate it is important to me that all parties are arguing honestly and base their opinions on the factual information available.

                I want to believe our government is capable of handling the complex issues of our time. It is very discouraging to see it leaving literally millions of people in a legal limbo.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Census

                  Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                  I'm thinking that's how the laws work out. Good bad or otherwise was not the issue I was addressing. I was merely stating as I did:

                  I also mentioned reasons it does not happen.



                  I don't have a bone in the fight on this issue. Immigration policy bothers me because it is a marked failure of all branches of our government. The executive branch because it fails to enforce the existing law. The legislative branch because it fails to make law to resolve the situation. And to a lesser degree the judicial branch because that have not taken issue with the fact the other two branches are failing in their role.

                  Immigration is a debate that needs to be had in this country. When we have debate it is important to me that all parties are arguing honestly and base their opinions on the factual information available.

                  I want to believe our government is capable of handling the complex issues of our time. It is very discouraging to see it leaving literally millions of people in a legal limbo.
                  Limbo is the safe political place for such issues. Neither party wants to secure the borders of decide what to do about the illegals. Neither party wants to upset the cheap labor the illegals provide. I don't think there is any question that the illegals are the pawns and we who pay taxes they don't suffer in another way. Why is the issue not addressed and fairly resolved once and for all?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Census

                    Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                    Limbo is the safe political place for such issues. Neither party wants to secure the borders of decide what to do about the illegals. Neither party wants to upset the cheap labor the illegals provide. I don't think there is any question that the illegals are the pawns and we who pay taxes they don't suffer in another way. Why is the issue not addressed and fairly resolved once and for all?
                    If you really want cheaper veggies ditch the illegal's and use prisoners all that free labor going to waste
                    Rod
                    MT. Washington Sewer & Drain Cleaning
                    Serving Berlin, NH and North Conway, NH areas
                    http://unclognh.com
                    http://mtwashingtonseweranddrainclea...m/default.aspx

                    Charging less does not mean more call volume it just means you have to work harder to reach your goals.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Census

                      Originally posted by UnClogNH View Post
                      If you really want cheaper veggies ditch the illegal's and use prisoners all that free labor going to waste
                      The prisoners are too busy learning law and preparing their defense.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Census

                        Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                        Limbo is the safe political place for such issues. Neither party wants to secure the borders of decide what to do about the illegals. Neither party wants to upset the cheap labor the illegals provide. I don't think there is any question that the illegals are the pawns and we who pay taxes they don't suffer in another way. Why is the issue not addressed and fairly resolved once and for all?
                        Sometimes I think the illegals are just like any of us-just squirrels trying to get a nut.

                        Want to get them out or make them legal? Place a $100,000 fine for any instance where one is hired for any reason on the person that hired them. Whether contracted, subcontracted, day labor, whatever.

                        Won't be perfect, but it will work.

                        J.C.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Census

                          Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
                          Sometimes I think the illegals are just like any of us-just squirrels trying to get a nut.

                          Want to get them out or make them legal? Place a $100,000 fine for any instance where one is hired for any reason on the person that hired them. Whether contracted, subcontracted, day labor, whatever.

                          Won't be perfect, but it will work.

                          J.C.
                          Depends on what you want to accomplish, if you want to stop folks from hiring them then the fines would work if enforced. If you want the issue of what to do with folks here illegally, then you need the government to step in an do something for a "Change"! I think the million of illegals who are here with homes, businesses and children who were born here, need to be addressed. Those low paying jobs need to pay more and conditions only an illegal would work in need to be made safer. The fix to this problem requires a multi level approach.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Census

                            Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                            Spiff, once again you pick and choose rather than respond to the whole post. If you really care about people more than cheap lettuce, you would admit we do have a problem with illegals, and it needs to be resolved.

                            Demand ALL jobs pay a living wage, give the illegals a choice rather than deport them, and see what happens. Our laws should be upheld, taxes should be paid by those who earn income and use services paid for by taxes. The subculture of the illegal is a breeding ground for a multitude of abuses, step up and call for and end or share in the horror. Like I said, go right ahead and jail the employers who hire illegals, BUT hold illegals responsible for their actions in OUR country! Why is it so offensive that we apply our laws? Why is it so difficult to change the system that burdens the taxpayer and abuses the illegal at the same time? Where is all the dam change? I'm still not seeing it.

                            Franki, I am not picking and choosing points to respond to. I thought I touched on the main points.

                            Are you calling for amnesty when you say "...give the illegals a choice rather than deport them..."?

                            You and I may want the illegals to be legal, tax paying, accountable citizens. But the industry requires this class of worker. Pure and simple. And they carry a lot more weight than a couple of anonymous voices on Internet sites.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Census

                              Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                              Depends on what you want to accomplish, if you want to stop folks from hiring them then the fines would work if enforced. If you want the issue of what to do with folks here illegally, then you need the government to step in an do something for a "Change"! I think the million of illegals who are here with homes, businesses and children who were born here, need to be addressed. Those low paying jobs need to pay more and conditions only an illegal would work in need to be made safer. The fix to this problem requires a multi level approach.
                              Fines instituted. Noone hires them. They cannot survive. A certain % will turn to crime, but a larger majority will just leave. The illegals would leave. Then the free market will be allowed to work in the job area.

                              One thing that pisses me off is this notion that only illegals will do some of these jobs. That is NOT true. For example: Houses were painted, built, roofed, drywalled, landscaped etc. etc. by legal U.S. citizens many years ago. All of them. Illegals have entered these areas because of people wanting it cheaper whether it is legal or not.

                              And I don't care much for the law of being born here making you a citizen. Old and overdue for change. At the very least one parent must be a legal citizen for the child to be a legal citizen.


                              J.C.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Census

                                Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                                Franki, I am not picking and choosing points to respond to. I thought I touched on the main points.

                                Are you calling for amnesty when you say "...give the illegals a choice rather than deport them..."?

                                You and I may want the illegals to be legal, tax paying, accountable citizens. But the industry requires this class of worker. Pure and simple. And they carry a lot more weight than a couple of anonymous voices on Internet sites.
                                Spiff, I agree that our wishes are meaningless compared to the powers that have allowed and endorsed this situation for decades. I want a fair and workable resolve for the people who were allowed to enter our country, live, work and establish a life here. I think they need to come out of the shadows and either become legal residents or if they choose, leave.

                                You may think I'm naive because I think it is unacceptable to have jobs that do not pay a living wage, maybe you're right? Either way, I do not accept our elected officals ignoring this situation. How much longer do these folks hang in limbo, live in fear, work in fear, suffer abuse and not contribute as those who are here legally the taxes on their income?

                                If having Americans without healthcare is unacceptable, then I maintain having a subclass of people in America is also unacceptable. We are either part of the solution or part of the problem. Which is it?

                                Comment

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