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  • Could be interesting....

    If you're about to go or want to get into position to help send someone.

    Airs Tonight.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...ource=proglist

    J.C.

  • #2
    Re: Could be interesting....

    I think we're going to reach a point where people stop going to college unless they are looking at a field that Needs it. No one needs 30k in student loan debt for an arts degree.
    No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Could be interesting....

      Just finished watching. It was interesting as I didn't know what "distance" colleges and learning centers were charging.

      I always azz-u-med what they provided was a "street sheet" to a certain degree.

      But I had no idea they were charging that much for a degree that doesn't seem to hold the same value.

      J.C.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Could be interesting....

        Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
        I always azz-u-med what they provided was a "street sheet" to a certain degree.
        What is a street sheet?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Could be interesting....

          What I call a degree from a "University" that has a fair but less stringent admittance policy & doesn't really follow through on making sure that the holder of the degree is completely qualified and prepared for their field.

          Just what I call it. Doesn't make me right as I have not done any major study with taxpayer backing.

          J.C.
          Last edited by BobsPlumbing; 05-04-2010, 10:14 PM. Reason: NOT DID ANY STUDY! :p

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Could be interesting....

            This topic really strikes a chord with me. For some time now, I have felt that colleges have become a profit-making institution unto themselves. I believe that colleges do have a place/neccessity and offer a great opportunity for some people but why do we value a certificate over real-world experience for almost any job? Would any pro on here be better at their job with a 4yr degree? I think not. Maybe you could benefit from some business management or PR classes, but will poetry 101 double your earnings? The answer is no. So why do we as a society cram the heads of children with the imperative that a college degree is the only path to a good life? How many doctors, lawyers, and political science majors do we need? We would be doing ourselves a favor to encourage children to follow their own path and offer scholarships to someone that truly wants (and has the apptitude) to be a doctor (etc) but does not have the means; IMO that person would make a better doctor than someone that was coerced into following mom or dad's footsteps. I know I'm ranting but I just call it as I see it. I had the opportunity to attend college but I declined as I did not know what I wanted to do (still don't) and couldn't comprehend saddling myself or my parents with substantial debt for an unknown. As it turned out, I am more financially comfortable than the majority of my friends that have college degrees. Perhaps hearing so many times that I could not amount to anything w/o a degree lit a fire under my butt to prove a point that I didn't need a piece of paper proclaiming my intelligence in order to be successful. I could go on but I'll spare all of you that misery.

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            • #7
              Re: Could be interesting....

              I think the kids that are good students (B or B+ average) in grade school should receive a free four year college education. But, no English or Art degrees are available. You want one of those degrees, you pay for it.

              If they want to go on to their masters or Phd, that is another matter.

              And let's end the GD legacy system that allows below average students to go to Ivy League universities simply because mom and or dad went there. Why have an idiot taking up a seat that could be occupied by a brilliant mind?

              For the kids not cut out for academia, cut them loose after the tenth grade and enroll them in a trade school. A couple of years of trade school followed by several years apprenticeship is a pretty good start.

              We don't need more English major or Art majors. We need physicists, mathematicians and engineers.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Could be interesting....

                Spiff, I couldn't agree with you more.

                Just want to add that I have children and I will bend over backwards to help them achieve whatever profession they choose but I will not push them into what I think they should be doing. There are limits however, as professional couch warmer is simply not acceptable. Joking aside, I will feel successful as a parent if my children live the majority of their lives healthy and happy. Being a parent is the most important job I have ever or will ever have.
                Last edited by Paul5409; 05-04-2010, 11:55 PM. Reason: additional comment

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Could be interesting....

                  Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                  I think the kids that are good students (B or B+ average) in grade school should receive a free four year college education. But, no English or Art degrees are available. You want one of those degrees, you pay for it.

                  If they want to go on to their masters or Phd, that is another matter.
                  I don't think we need to pay for it. At least in NY, state schools are cheap enough that if you want to work for it, you can get a degree and pay for it. The tuition and fees for a SUNY school is $8500. I would assert that if you are really the material for a job which a degree is required, i.e. you have the motivation; you can make $8500 a year to apply towards college.

                  It is much easier to get paid for a graduate degree, at least in engineering fields than an undergraduate degree. I got paid between $22,000-$30,000/year while doing my Ph.D. Depending on your discipline, there are many funding opportunities available as a teaching assistant or research assistant.

                  I'm surprised at how much an English major can make, my sister is doing her Ph.D in English and says that you can make $80k-$90k as a tenure track professor after graduation (assuming you can find a job).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Could be interesting....

                    Originally posted by cpw View Post
                    I don't think we need to pay for it. At least in NY, state schools are cheap enough that if you want to work for it, you can get a degree and pay for it. The tuition and fees for a SUNY school is $8500. I would assert that if you are really the material for a job which a degree is required, i.e. you have the motivation; you can make $8500 a year to apply towards college.

                    It is much easier to get paid for a graduate degree, at least in engineering fields than an undergraduate degree. I got paid between $22,000-$30,000/year while doing my Ph.D. Depending on your discipline, there are many funding opportunities available as a teaching assistant or research assistant.

                    I'm surprised at how much an English major can make, my sister is doing her Ph.D in English and says that you can make $80k-$90k as a tenure track professor after graduation (assuming you can find a job).
                    I don't necessarily agree with tenure, removing pressures to allow "free thinking", or anything that protects one from scrutiny.

                    Regardless of background or years, you produce, or you're gone.

                    J.C.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Could be interesting....

                      IMO, if a kid knows from the first day of kindergarten that there is a college education or a trade school education and apprenticeship waiting for them, their attitude and approach to education will be fundamentally different.

                      High school was a waste of time for me. I had little to no idea what I wanted to be when I 'grew up'. Letting kids know they have a choice and there will be appropriate training in their future sends a positive message.

                      Paul - On another note, I just read some excerpts from a book that just came out titled "Sh*t My Dad Says". One quote came to mind when you describe your standard for success in raising your children.

                      "A parent's only as good as their dumbest kid. If one wins a Nobel Prize but the other gets robbed by a hooker, you failed."

                      This is one of the less racy quotes. But they all make me grin.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Could be interesting....

                        Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
                        I don't necessarily agree with tenure, removing pressures to allow "free thinking", or anything that protects one from scrutiny.

                        Regardless of background or years, you produce, or you're gone.

                        J.C.
                        I think it depends on what your job is. I don't think that teaching positions need tenure, but very little of what a university professor is responsible for is actually teaching.

                        I never actually applied to any academic jobs (I wouldn't want to be a lecturer, so the only thing I actually would have considered is a tenure track job), because I didn't want the pressure of having to get that next grant to stay employed.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Could be interesting....

                          Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                          High school was a waste of time for me. I had little to no idea what I wanted to be when I 'grew up'. Letting kids know they have a choice and there will be appropriate training in their future sends a positive message.
                          High school was a waste of time for me too. No point in most of the classes, and I learned a lot more by working.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Could be interesting....

                            What the program shows is how people are learning to cash in on higher education with many of these distance degrees. I always thought that in the hiring world that these degrees "held less weight" and in-turn, cost less to achieve them.

                            Not the case. If it was represented factually, the cost was much more and some degreed individuals were shown to not be qualified for their field of study. So the cycle for them is:

                            1. Student loans for a more expensive education.

                            2. Not qualified for the real world position after graduation. So....they can't pay back the loan.

                            3. The program focused that the majority of the loans were by the government.

                            So, in short, we're loaning money to people that can't pay it back. In a big picture analysis from myself, I just keep thinking mortgage debacle.

                            Loaning people money that don't meet the criteria of someone that will be able to pay it back in such large volumes is bad, bad, bad.

                            And remember, these are strictly for profit, often PUBLICLY TRADED companies shown to have the mentality of sale, sale, sale the student/customer and get them a loan without any worry on the back end because just like many in the mortgage "crisis"....

                            .....the university is getting their payment on the front end.

                            J.C.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Could be interesting....

                              cpw- I understand where you are coming from with your POV and your points have sensibility in regards to someone accomplishing their goals through motivation. However, as much as I stand against college being preached as the end-all goal for every child, I would be more than happy to have my taxes utilized for furthering the education (college, trade-school, etc) of those that truly desire it as opposed to the many ways in which my taxes are currently squandered. Once again, I am only in favor of this if said student is actually there of his or her own accord with a passion for a particular field.

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