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Day 48 In The Gulf..........

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  • #16
    Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

    Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
    The rig and spill are in international waters and we have no jurisdiction
    The rig and well were 40 miles out. The US claims 200 miles out as an exclusive economic zone. In that 200 mile zone we control of all economic resources within our exclusive economic zone, including fishing, mining, oil exploration, and any pollution of those resources.

    It is certainly within our jurisdiction.

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    • #17
      Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

      The Mexican spill by volume is still the worst spill in history. In that case however the currents worked in out favor and much of the oil was flushed out into the deep Atlantic where the environmental damage was minimal. We aren't so lucky this time. This oil is destroying the parts of the ecosystem we use.

      Sure we the environment may recover but it could be a hundred years before that recovery occurs and our oil policies and use isn't lending itself to stop the same thing from occurring again and again.

      We didn't kill the ecosystem this time we only chopped off a major limb. While you can say it is still technically alive it is struggling to survive our abuse.

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      • #18
        Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

        Actually, the Mexico spill is the third worst:

        1991 - Gulf War Spill, 1,360,000–1,500,000 tons of crude

        1909 - Lakeview, California Gusher, 1,230,000 tons of crude

        1979 - Ixtoc I, 454,000 - 480,000 tons of crude

        Mark - I've listened to many a critic of bog government complain about government regulations. "Get the government out of there and let the experts and private market regulate that stuff" is the typical battle cry.

        Time and again whenever regulations are pushed aside or disregarded, the only ones that don't suffer the consequences are the ones that benefited from the breach in the first place.

        Regulations are a burden. No one would dispute that. But I kind of prefer that airliners don't fall out of the sky on a regular basis, the air is not toxic, the water won't make me ill and so on.

        I know some folks have an absolute hard on for the EPA, but when it comes to our environment, no single entity should be allowed to pollute or destroy that which everyone else is equally entitled to. My neighbor may feel they have the right to burn piles of rubbish or whatever they so desire, whenever they want, but my right to clean air trumps their right to pollute it.

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        • #19
          Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

          Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
          Actually, the Mexico spill is the third worst:

          1991 - Gulf War Spill, 1,360,000–1,500,000 tons of crude

          1909 - Lakeview, California Gusher, 1,230,000 tons of crude

          1979 - Ixtoc I, 454,000 - 480,000 tons of crude

          Mark - I've listened to many a critic of bog government complain about government regulations. "Get the government out of there and let the experts and private market regulate that stuff" is the typical battle cry.

          Time and again whenever regulations are pushed aside or disregarded, the only ones that don't suffer the consequences are the ones that benefited from the breach in the first place.

          Regulations are a burden. No one would dispute that. But I kind of prefer that airliners don't fall out of the sky on a regular basis, the air is not toxic, the water won't make me ill and so on.

          I know some folks have an absolute hard on for the EPA, but when it comes to our environment, no single entity should be allowed to pollute or destroy that which everyone else is equally entitled to. My neighbor may feel they have the right to burn piles of rubbish or whatever they so desire, whenever they want, but my right to clean air trumps their right to pollute it.
          I may have taken you quote out of context. I read

          "Everyone wants government regulation after a disaster or accident. But there is a very distinct, vocal minority that doesn't want the government overseeing anything. This particular group has been strangely quiet for the past month and a half."

          to include the handling of such a disaster. I would agree there are some including myself who feel the Government is too often over-reaching on regulations while ignoring the real issues.

          I believe a prime example in History will be the year Congress spent on Obamacare while jobs and the economy suffered. That was just not unpopular with me but it was unpopular to the majority of the United States for one reason or another.

          This disaster is an epic disaster times ten. People will look back at this and wonder why the Government sat back and sold us kool-aid without having a clue of what was really going on. Obama saying he is angry almost 7-weeks into this mess is a reflection on his lack of oversight.

          Mark
          Last edited by ToUtahNow; 06-06-2010, 07:49 PM.
          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

            Ummm....yes. My initial point may have been poorly made, but there seems to be no distinct flow(hah!) of responsibility between BP and the government.

            If the idea is "Let BP clean up the mess" then make sure they're doing it.

            Then again why are communities crying for supplies to clean/block the oil?

            Why is aid in the clean up being given from other countries when it's a disaster caused by a private company who in turn is supposed to fit the bill to clean it up.

            See how the lines of responsibility get blurred?
            I'm on "The List" and I love it!!

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

              Originally posted by tinmack View Post
              Ummm....yes. My initial point may have been poorly made, but there seems to be no distinct flow(hah!) of responsibility between BP and the government.

              If the idea is "Let BP clean up the mess" then make sure they're doing it.

              Then again why are communities crying for supplies to clean/block the oil?

              Why is aid in the clean up being given from other countries when it's a disaster caused by a private company who in turn is supposed to fit the bill to clean it up.

              See how the lines of responsibility get blurred?
              Here is my take, the annual economy of the Gulf Coast has been estimated at $234,000,000,000. That economy has been brought to a sudden stop. BP and all those responsible should do everything in their power to stop the leak and clean up the mess. Because the people of the Gulf Coast are at risk of losing everything, BP and all those responsible should reimburse them for their loses.

              Considering what is at risk, our Federal Government should have been on this leak from day one. Dismissing this disaster by playing the blame game does not solve anything. Eric Holder has no business in the Gulf looking to file criminal charges at this time. We need all available bodies at the spill and at the coastline from day one and we can hand the bill to BP and all those responsible later. Instead we have had a lack of action and have now created a situation which may turn against us if those at BP are at threat of criminal charges.

              Mark
              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

                Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                Here is my take, the annual economy of the Gulf Coast has been estimated at $234,000,000,000. That economy has been brought to a sudden stop. BP and all those responsible should do everything in their power to stop the leak and clean up the mess. Because the people of the Gulf Coast are at risk of losing everything, BP and all those responsible should reimburse them for their loses.

                Considering what is at risk, our Federal Government should have been on this leak from day one. Dismissing this disaster by playing the blame game does not solve anything. Eric Holder has no business in the Gulf looking to file criminal charges at this time. We need all available bodies at the spill and at the coastline from day one and we can hand the bill to BP and all those responsible later. Instead we have had a lack of action and have now created a situation which may turn against us if those at BP are at threat of criminal charges.

                Mark

                Exactly.
                I'm on "The List" and I love it!!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

                  Everybody out of the water!!!!

                  You could call this guy

                  Name:  7b8fa721b1603ae1c70eb0e8a2390261.jpg
Views: 1
Size:  35.3 KB


                  JIM TARBALL!!!

                  He'll make sure they clean up all these tar balls, once and for all!!!


                  Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

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                  • #24
                    Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

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                    • #25
                      Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

                      So Holder should only come back well after the crime and investigate because BP may not resolve their mess? Why not just have Holder seek BP's permission to come back at a later date to investigate? If they deny him permission then that would be a clear indication that no crime was committed and that those 11 workers died because of unforeseen circumstances. Purely accidental.

                      I shudder to think that we should ever hold an employee of BP responsible for the deaths of American workers.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

                        Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
                        So Holder should only come back well after the crime and investigate because BP may not resolve their mess? Why not just have Holder seek BP's permission to come back at a later date to investigate? If they deny him permission then that would be a clear indication that no crime was committed and that those 11 workers died because of unforeseen circumstances. Purely accidental.

                        I shudder to think that we should ever hold an employee of BP responsible for the deaths of American workers.
                        There are a bunch of Government Officials and Engineers on site with BP, who are documenting and taking evidence of everything. Holder has zero to do with investigating a crime site. Holder simply files charges and prosecutes crimes based on investigations by others.

                        The fact the White House announced Holder was on his way to talk to the local agencies to see if any crimes had been committed is simply for show. Obama cannot brag about being a partner with BP during the cleanup and threaten them with criminal prosecution at the same time.

                        There will be a time for criminal charges when this mess is under control. To make an announcement now does not help the effort at all and may in fact impede it.

                        Mark
                        Last edited by ToUtahNow; 06-08-2010, 03:56 PM.
                        "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                        I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Day 48 In The Gulf..........

                          I haven't heard Obama bragging about being a partner with BP. I have heard him demanding that BP will pay all costs and damages. You make it sound like he's paling around with Tony Hayward.

                          Perhaps you don't find any value in hearing that the government is pursuing this as a criminal case. But I am glad to hear that they are. 11 workers died and many accounts indicate that BP's decisions were careless and reckless. Signs of trouble were disregarded or otherwise discounted. 11 workers are dead and now we are facing a economical and environmental catastrophe whose scale and scope is evolving daily.

                          Damn right this is a crime scene and should be treated as such.

                          I don't know about you, but I do believe the USA has every right, and the might, to say and do anything they want in the Gulf spill, and tough titty if BP gets offended. This mess is entirely of their making. They do not dictate to US how WE will pursue justice in this disaster that occurred in our front yard.

                          Obama can't do anything right, can he?
                          Last edited by SpiffPeters; 06-08-2010, 10:33 PM.

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