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So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

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  • #16
    Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

    Bush is regularly brought up because the double standard employed by repubs is stunning.

    Many of Bush's appointees are still entrenched through out the federal agencies. Obama is largely responsible for not removing these industry sympathizers that refuse to enforce the regulations. MMS is home a away from home to the very industries it is charged with regulating. Same is true for the SEC.

    We've seen a systemic failure in regulatory agencies that are charged with looking after OUR best interests, not the industries they watch over. And I blame Obama for not cleaning house.

    But the simple fact is that BP blew it and no matter how badly people want to blame the feds for this, a foreign owned company, through sheer negligence on their part, is now destroying American communities, their way of life and the wild life that exists in the gulf. And now, all of a sudden, the repubs are screaming about the president securing this escrow account as somehow unconstitutional. Could someone please point to which part of the constitution he is violating? Could someone please provide evidence that the president is using some illegal tactic on BP? The burden of proof that the president is violating some law or the constitution has not been met.

    Warrantless wiretaps, now that is a violation of the constitution. But the repubs were curiously quiet about that.

    See the double standard now?

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    • #17
      Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

      Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post
      Could someone please provide evidence that the president is using some illegal tactic on BP? The burden of proof that the president is violating some law or the constitution has not been met.
      How about due process?

      The burden of proof should be on the government that it is following the constitution.

      What is the government going to do with the fine of $4300 * 40,000 * 90 days = $15,480,000,000? That seems like a good start to compensating some of the victims.

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      • #18
        Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

        What due process.

        BP has claimed responsibility from the start. They have claimed that they will pay for all damages, from the start. Getting them to put up earnest money in a independently managed escrow account is simply holding them to their word.

        Given the way BP has managed many aspects of this disaster, from refusing to stop using dispersant's, denying access to the well head so scientists can actually measure the rate, to their own internal documents showing their public statements about the flow rate were grossly understated, I see little reason to take them at their word on anything.

        We don't want to give foreigners who try to blow up a plane over Detroit any constitutional rights so why should a foreign corporation that is inflicting untold damages beyond anyones imagination at this time be given the same access to constitutional rights?

        Regardless, I think due process claim is a very thin claim.

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        • #19
          Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

          BP has accepted the financial responsibility to clean it up and to stop the leak. I'm not sure that is the same as taking the blame for the accident. This will be litigated for many many years.

          As for Obama playing the "it's Bush's fault" card, I think he lost that when he told us Salazar was in charge of cleaning up the MMS.

          Mark
          Last edited by ToUtahNow; 06-25-2010, 04:50 PM.
          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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          • #20
            Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

            Originally posted by SpiffPeters View Post

            We've seen a systemic failure in regulatory agencies that are charged with looking after OUR best interests, not the industries they watch over. And I blame Obama for not cleaning house.

            I don't want anyone looking out for my best interests. I can do that on my own.

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            • #21
              Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

              Originally posted by DanLawrence View Post
              I don't want anyone looking out for my best interests. I can do that on my own.
              Fine. You can make sure that your property or lives are not endangered by commercial aircraft falling out of the sky. Or that your employer doesn't create a work place that can injure or kill you. Or that your garage door opener doesn't disrupt your neighbors pacemaker.

              Sorry, but I want someone that is not beholden to investors making sure that our airlines are safe, the mining industry doesn't regularly bury its workers, that my cordless phone doesn't get disabled by a neighbors remote control, that the drugs I may need to take have been thoroughly test to make sure they do what the producer claims they will do, that the air I breath and the water I drink meet some standard.

              Yeah, Obama has made reference to the way things have been managed in the recent past. Not at all uncommon for presidents to use the previous administration as an example of how things are different or how they disagree with the way things were done or as a way of explaining why things are the way they are currently.

              I know the righties are all up in arms over Obama overreaching and securing $20 billion from BP. It's a power grab as it has been put by the well paid punditry. Unlike Cheney's claim that he wasn't part of the executive branch or that he was the first VP that could claim executive privilege. Or that FISA didn't apply to a war time president (never mind the constitutional measure was never met - congress never declared war) and on and on. I guess when the pundits say Obama is over reaching his presidential powers that is code for 'he's getting uppity'.

              So I'll take it that no one is able or willing to articulate an argument against the escrow fund.

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              • #22
                Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                How did the escrow account come about? Was there transparency I don't know about? Are there going to be fines and punishments not levied because of the account? Were threats made against BP to get them to go along with the escrow account. I really have no idea. It just seems strange that a big evil multinational oil company would do the right thing without being strong armed.

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                • #23
                  Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                  Originally posted by saysflushable View Post
                  How did the escrow account come about? Was there transparency I don't know about? Are there going to be fines and punishments not levied because of the account? Were threats made against BP to get them to go along with the escrow account. I really have no idea. It just seems strange that a big evil multinational oil company would do the right thing without being strong armed.
                  Well, we don't know what was said. Do we? But that simple fact isn't stopping the Reich Wing from calculating an angle of attack on the matter. And their followers are lapping it up like spilled cream.

                  When it comes to transparency, it's clear for anyone to see that the GOP will do anything to get their jobs back. They forgot they've been fired because they were corrupt (Jack Abrahmoff, K Street, Marianas Island, 'Duke' Cunnigham...) and they were the ones behind the wheel when they drove this economy and regulatory system into the ditch.

                  Still waiting for proof or evidence that the $20 billion escrow violated the constitution or that some law was broken.

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                  • #24
                    Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                    if BP gave the money without being extorted great. I just find that hard to believe, but if they did awesome. If they were extorted just like what happens in Chicago ( My family is from chicago). Then that is very scarey to me. Thats all.

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                    • #25
                      Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                      Lot of if's in there.

                      I'm okay with Obama getting BP to pony up $20 billion the same way folks were okay with Bush torturing suspects.
                      Last edited by SpiffPeters; 06-26-2010, 12:30 PM.

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                      • #26
                        Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                        I suspect that the chances of BP actually "ponying up" anything and not making a profit anyway are pretty slim. In the scheme of things 20 bil is not a whole lot for BP to worry about. Obama can demand anything he wants but in the end the lawyers will draft the documents and some will get compensated ( most likely large corporations that donate to the DNC ) but the little guy will see squat. Yet another example of a group of ignorant politicians making political hay while the oil continues to bubble forth. Let's take care of the friggin problem first and grandstand later.
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                        • #27
                          Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                          Talk about grand standing. Jindal takes the cake. He'd rather complain about not having every federal resource he demands rather than use the ones he has.

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                          • #28
                            Re: So is the $20 billion escrow account a bad thing for taxpayers?

                            For sure. This tragedy will be used by every politician hoping to score points in the next election.
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