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  • C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

    The same folks that mandated MBTE in Calif Gas , MARY NICHOLS HEAD OF CARB, screwed up again. Science from Phony degree fraud http://wwwkillcarb.org/tranpage.html
    CARB= calif. air recourse board. Mary Nichols admits She knew the #s were not right and never shared this info with the rest of the board. Older diesal trucks [ mine] wile have to be junked. Also tree chippers. a air compressors ,generators. All on made up phony science.
    Ask Mark what MBTE has done to wells and ground water. thanl MARY NICHOLS !
    Jerry Brown wants to enact these new diesel restrictions if elected! MEG WHITEMAN wants to suspend this for at least 1 year !
    I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

  • #2
    Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

    Disturbing and upsetting events, hope justice is eventually served. I believe C.a.r.b., was mentioned in the movie "Who Killed The Electric Car", as being unreasonable and complicit in the electric car's (EV1 made by G.M.) demise.

    I'm not clear on the specific of this diesel pollution case, but I remember parking my diesel construction rig in an enclosed garage years ago. In the morning forty or so trucks would start up and fill the air with black soot. Sometimes the exhaust fans would not work, but we were told not to worry. The foremen said diesels produce no harmful pollution! Remember, real men don't complain about such things, they just die from exposure.

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    • #3
      Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

      These restrictions will destroy the light and medium duty diesel vehicle market. Already happening.

      J.C.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

        I have some tree service friends. Guy brings in chipper for maintenance ,didn't pass emission. Guy "says sucks ,I'll pick it up. Nope state says I have to turn it over to them.
        Older Trucks delivering to ca. from out of state won't be able to pass through unless they install $25,000 - $30,000 exhaust, installed only by state certified Mech. Davy tree has already bought all new chippers in Ca. My shop shares a large yard with about 15 of their trucks. Truckers and small contractors are just hanging on, this will sink them!
        I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

          Global warming rings a bell.

          Numbers can say whatever you want, just depends on who is paying the "scientists".

          The world is flat.
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          • #6
            Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

            Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
            I have some tree service friends. Guy brings in chipper for maintenance ,didn't pass emission. Guy "says sucks ,I'll pick it up. Nope state says I have to turn it over to them.
            Older Trucks delivering to ca. from out of state won't be able to pass through unless they install $25,000 - $30,000 exhaust, installed only by state certified Mech. Davy tree has already bought all new chippers in Ca. My shop shares a large yard with about 15 of their trucks. Truckers and small contractors are just hanging on, this will sink them!
            Perfect example of a good idea at the worst possible time! I'm all for saving the environment and conservation, "But", this must be done in a way and at a time that does not sink working people and their families. Why can't these different branches of the government work together?

            Given our current economy, wouldn't it be wise to postpone such devistating legislation? I'm surprised the govenor and other legislators don't step in and overrule the C.a.r.b., would they rather see more people unemployed, homes foreclosed?

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            • #7
              Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

              Frank it is all based on PHONY #S By a Guy without a degree !!
              I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                Frank it is all based on PHONY #S By a Guy without a degree !!
                I get that, but even if it was not the case and these new standards were environmentally wise in my opinion now would not be the time to enforce them. I would like to breathe fresher air, enjoy a less polluted environment and I don't need scientific proof to figure out what needs to be done. I am sensible enough to realize we are at greater risk of harm by failing economically at the present time, so the environment needs to wait a while longer.

                A couple of weeks ago when I suggested something like this to my daughter's h.s. teacher he said if your friend jumps off a bridge do you? I did not engage him any further, his response childish. We are in an economic war with communist china and losing, they are going full steam ahead the environment be damed and we are putting Americans out of work!

                How will our society survive if we continue to self destruct with such poorly timed legislation? Will communist china, house, clothe and feed us as a concillation prize for having lost the economic war while saving our environment?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                  Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                  We are in an economic war with communist china and losing, they are going full steam ahead the environment be damed and we are putting Americans out of work!

                  How will our society survive if we continue to self destruct with such poorly timed legislation? Will communist china, house, clothe and feed us as a concillation prize for having lost the economic war while saving our environment?
                  No matter how many times you say we are at economic war with China it doesn't actually make it true. They are an economic ally. They have invested heavily in America. Our economy failing would destroy the Chinese economy as well. They have banked their own country's economic country's future on our success. That's how bonds work. They own so much of our debt because they bought our bonds.

                  If you ignore that fact then we should also consider Japan an enemy. They own nearly as much American debt as China does. China only actually beats them by like 1% of our debt. Is it about time we bomb them again?

                  Then lets move on to the fact if we were actually at economic war with anyone we are fully capable of paying off every penny of debt our country has. All our money hasn't gone overseas. Most of it has actually gone into the pockets of Americans who make up the worlds richest people. Tax them 90% of their total assets they'd still be among the worlds richest people and we'd have 0 debt. I know it might be a rare change for them to have to sacrifice a 7th or 8th house for the good of the country rather then the average American sacrificing their one home to just survive.

                  The other thing about debt is their is no country on earth that can actually collect against the US through force. If debt was actually such an issue that it might destroy America, we could simply respond to the rest of the freaking planet we declare all American debt null and void. What are they going to do about it, the best outcome for a foreign nation would be mutually assured destruction.


                  Not trying to advocate such solutions but hoping perspective might help. While our government may be in debt, by no means are we a poor country. Most the wealth in the world is still tied up in America. No country has the actual means to bring us down economically. The only way for this country to be brought down is internally, and that we seem to be doing a fine job at.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                    the way i understand the diesel tier level laws was it only applied to engines with a rating of 50h.p. or more.

                    my jetter comes in at 49h.p.

                    my sprinter has a diesel particulate filter and i believe an catalytic converter.

                    it's the small engine market and 2 strokes that are dirty.

                    rick.
                    phoebe it is

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                      Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                      the way i understand the diesel tier level laws was it only applied to engines with a rating of 50h.p. or more.

                      my jetter comes in at 49h.p.

                      my sprinter has a diesel particulate filter and i believe an catalytic converter.

                      it's the small engine market and 2 strokes that are dirty.

                      rick.
                      Rick Your ox isn't getting gored. A lot of little folks struggling will be hurt.
                      Talk to some smaller tree outfits ,when You see one working. Big outfits have the cash to
                      buy new Equipment [davy tree,garbage cos.] TERRIBLE TIMING, ON FALSE STATS. !!!!
                      I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                        Ten years ago I closed my company in the Midwest and I wondered where will I go? I thought back to Southern California as I had lived there most of my life. Then I thought "do I really want to put up with all of that DMV crap, smog and traffic again?" I moved to Nevada instead and I am sure glad that I did. Unemployment is a mess here right now, I don't know if So. Ca. is much better off but I am sure glad that I don't have to deal with the headaches some of you guys do. I wish you the best of luck with this new round of regulations and I hope that you hit the jobs that will keep you working.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                          Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                          No matter how many times you say we are at economic war with China it doesn't actually make it true. They are an economic ally. They have invested heavily in America. Our economy failing would destroy the Chinese economy as well. They have banked their own country's economic country's future on our success. That's how bonds work. They own so much of our debt because they bought our bonds.

                          If you ignore that fact then we should also consider Japan an enemy. They own nearly as much American debt as China does. China only actually beats them by like 1% of our debt. Is it about time we bomb them again?

                          Then lets move on to the fact if we were actually at economic war with anyone we are fully capable of paying off every penny of debt our country has. All our money hasn't gone overseas. Most of it has actually gone into the pockets of Americans who make up the worlds richest people. Tax them 90% of their total assets they'd still be among the worlds richest people and we'd have 0 debt. I know it might be a rare change for them to have to sacrifice a 7th or 8th house for the good of the country rather then the average American sacrificing their one home to just survive.

                          The other thing about debt is their is no country on earth that can actually collect against the US through force. If debt was actually such an issue that it might destroy America, we could simply respond to the rest of the freaking planet we declare all American debt null and void. What are they going to do about it, the best outcome for a foreign nation would be mutually assured destruction.


                          Not trying to advocate such solutions but hoping perspective might help. While our government may be in debt, by no means are we a poor country. Most the wealth in the world is still tied up in America. No country has the actual means to bring us down economically. The only way for this country to be brought down is internally, and that we seem to be doing a fine job at.
                          Boy, here's my take on our situation. Holding someone's debt does not make you a friend or ally, loan sharks will own your soul and then dispose of you when ready! I think communist china will do the same when the time comes. Japan may be an ally in many people's minds, but I consider them to be part of our problems. Japan simply brought the poppy fields closer to the drug addicts by building factories in the USA! We are fooling ourselves into thinking America benefits by having foreign interests employ some Americans so they can sell their product to Americans. Wake up we need American owned businesses employing Americans, because once our wealth leaves our economy and finds it's way to japan, china, europe, asia, it does not come back! Free trade and open markets only apply to the USA as a brothel for the rest of the world's goods. The rest of the world plays by very different rules.

                          In my opinion our two hundred year old experiment has evolved and resulted in some individual and corporate wealth, at the expense of the masses. I am not suggesting communism as an alternative, but checks and balances should have prevailed in the realm of American capitalism.

                          We don't need to strip the wealthy to solve our economic problems, we need sensible laws to prevent a further raping of the American economy.

                          If you really believe we can sustain our society by taking from the rich and little by little giving to foreign interests who you consider our friends, I hope you are right. I think we are a dying society, growing more and more dependant on others to bank roll our government and supply us with our consumer goods.

                          Lastly, I have come to believe any idea worth supporting must eventually work in the real world. I am a strong Union supporter, but if contract demands and concessions by employers (some of which are governmental), cannot be paid for down the road; we must rethink the process! The same goes for all the outsourcing and importing, it is not working to the benefit of the American economy on the whole. The success of some individuals and corporations in this economy cannot be confused with what is happening on the greater scale. I see this tunnel vision as a large experiment with many phases, the phases that see positive results think the experiment is going fine, even when it fails terribly in the end.
                          Last edited by Frankiarmz; 10-09-2010, 05:28 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                            Originally posted by boytyperanma View Post
                            No matter how many times you say we are at economic war with China it doesn't actually make it true. They are an economic ally. They have invested heavily in America. Our economy failing would destroy the Chinese economy as well. They have banked their own country's economic country's future on our success. That's how bonds work. They own so much of our debt because they bought our bonds.

                            If you ignore that fact then we should also consider Japan an enemy. They own nearly as much American debt as China does. China only actually beats them by like 1% of our debt. Is it about time we bomb them again?

                            Then lets move on to the fact if we were actually at economic war with anyone we are fully capable of paying off every penny of debt our country has. All our money hasn't gone overseas. Most of it has actually gone into the pockets of Americans who make up the worlds richest people. Tax them 90% of their total assets they'd still be among the worlds richest people and we'd have 0 debt. I know it might be a rare change for them to have to sacrifice a 7th or 8th house for the good of the country rather then the average American sacrificing their one home to just survive.

                            The other thing about debt is their is no country on earth that can actually collect against the US through force. If debt was actually such an issue that it might destroy America, we could simply respond to the rest of the freaking planet we declare all American debt null and void. What are they going to do about it, the best outcome for a foreign nation would be mutually assured destruction.

                            Not trying to advocate such solutions but hoping perspective might help. While our government may be in debt, by no means are we a poor country. Most the wealth in the world is still tied up in America. No country has the actual means to bring us down economically. The only way for this country to be brought down is internally, and that we seem to be doing a fine job at.

                            The trade balance with China is dramatically lop-sided.

                            The Chinese Government subsidizes their industries, controls the valuation of their currency to their benefit and keeps their markets closed to imports.

                            They have no real labor laws, and do not protect employees from human rights violations.

                            The Chinese have no virtually nothing comparable to OSHA and no environmental control - which gives them a dramatic economic advantage.

                            There is no control of quality or safety of their exports, other than that imposed by those American and European firms that maintain a quality control presence in China.

                            The Chinese government gives nothing more than lip service to intellectual property rights.

                            Yup, China's a great economic ally!

                            The facts don't support your assertion that taxing the rich would enable us to pay our debt. The debt is 13 trillion. The GDP is 13 trillion.

                            As for taxing the rich at 90%, that obviously wouldn't eliminate the debt, but it certainly would eliminate investment in US business. Doesn't seem like a good solution to me.

                            Maybe we should look at a taxation plan that hits up the lower half of the citizenry, that currently pay nothing in taxes but consume inordinate amounts of resources through entitlements. Individually, they couldn't pay a lot, but there's many, many of them. Of course they are also the mass that actually controls the elections, so no politician will every suggest such a novel idea. Certainly, no liberals will ever suggest that everyone needs to pay their share.

                            Or maybe we should as a nation work on growing OUR economy instead of China's.... thus increasing our own tax base and allowing us to perhaps be able to afford our own military, health and social programs.

                            Japan actually is an economic enemy and has been for some time. Although their significance is less than it was. If anything, they have traditionally maintained an even more closed market than China. They overtly targeted industries and subsidized them through their trade ministry (MITI). That's how Japanese optics overtook German optics, and how they came to dominate consumer electronics, automobiles and (probably most importantly of all looking to the future) machine tools. Japan hurt US manufacturing very severely through some of the same tactics we currently see the CHinese employing.... disregard for intellectual property laws, closed consumer markets, illegal dumping, and government subsidies. The issue of "levelling the playing field" was and is a huge issue with Japan, and they have never shown any interest in doing so. Interestingly, after they established their dominance in certain areas and killed off US industry in those areas, prices rose as the Japanese standard of living increased. Now they are having the same problem we are - competing with China and the other developing nations.

                            As for voiding debt, yes, any country can refuse to honor their debt. But that wouldn't be a solution, it would just be a desperate action before our government failed. If we voided our debt, we would not have credit....without the ability to raise capital to meet short term obligations, the US government would be out of business, just like any other country or company, for that matter.

                            No nation ever collects debts through force. The object of the force basically has no means left to pay. What force results in is annexation or occupation. Historically, military superiority goes hand in hand with economic superiority. Right now, China's growth rate is such that they will overtake the US as the world's largest economy. They haven't had a watershed change in political perspective or suddenly become drifted away from communism. They simply watched the Soviets fail and go out of business. The Chinese understand that much more effective strategy is to defeat the United States through economics. If they can dominate industry and buy the mortgage on the government, why would they need force?

                            It is true that the US still controls very much wealth. You have to look at the trends. If you don't, it's like the guy that jumps off a building and says to himself on the way down, "so far, so good".

                            It amazes me that some Americans can see that we have massive job losses, complete industries that are collapsing domestically, a technology base that is losing ground to other countries, huge debt that continues to grow, a "service economy" that provides generally low paying jobs, and a massive trade deficit... and not think that we are in an economic war.
                            Last edited by Andy_M; 10-10-2010, 01:41 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Re: C.a.r.b. Off 340% on diesel pollution #s

                              It seems to me many in America see China's economy growing and point to them as the problem. The problem is with American business investing in China in order to further profit off other Americans. China is simply a beneficiary of bad US policy, they aren't the enemy they are the ghouls that come along after the battle to sell collect and sell the armor and weapons for their own profit.

                              GDP is Gross Domestic Profit. It isn't how much total assets we have. Our total assets do far exceed our national dept. While it is true our profits do not so much. Again we could easily pay off all our debt by taxing the hell out of our citizenship. We currently don't need to and aren't willing to. If you are going to declare we are losing an economic war the gloves could come off and we'd win hands down.

                              Yes American jobs being sent overseas is a serious issue our government needs to address, but the problem is American companies buying our government off from dealing with those issues because doing so would hinder their profits. Now with our campaign finance laws in shambles foreign companies are also afforded the right to buy our politicians so I don't see things getting better any time soon.

                              A recent example of the government working against the interest of the people would be S.3816 Creating American Jobs and Ending Offshoring Act. This law basically called to remove government subsidies from any business who chooses to hire outside the US. The full text of the bill is available for anyone to read.

                              Our Senate voted to not even debate that bill. If the American people actually paid attention there should be outrage. Instead we'll continue to elect those who would send jobs away because by taking huge sums of money from corporations can buy expensive and flashy campaigns that can easily overcome the objects of the few Americans paying attention.

                              As I've said we get the government we deserve.

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