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  • #16
    Re: Gasoline Prices

    Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
    Andy, I'll respond to some of your points but first, let's agree that our government is so slow to act or be proactive that we are probably sunk.

    I doubt even zero taxes would be enough of an incentive to have big business build factories here. Maybe zero taxes, no EPA or OSHA involvement and no minimum wage might be enough? I say legislate to make imported products so costly tfor the importer that they will be forced to make it here! I was reading today that the USA exports over 300 million dollars worth of chicken paws (feet) to china( they really like'em). Now it seems china has a problem with that so they set a limit, essentially knocking down the export amount and "profit" for us.

    China can develop and impliment the new altenative energies because they are more of a developing nation. We on the other hand already have millions of cars on the road along with all the machines and junk necessary for our daily lives, it is much more costly to make a transition than to simply go forward. I said before, even if you had alternative energy cars how would the American consumer who is near broke and barely keeping their gas clunker going afford to get one???

    I'll say this in closing, we had gas rationing in the 70's and we learned nothing, did nothing to prepare for today. I think it is too late now when we are paying almost $4.00 a gallon to keep our economy afloat and either develop the new energies or dril for oil. There won't be any escape from foreign goods and chinese junk, no return to American made.

    Forty years or so of American based businesses and jobs leaving our borders and shores and the effects are finally being felt. I am sure there will be a tipping point when the the effects will happen at an exponential speed.
    When enough people cannot afford to drive their cars to work, the cost of trucking food and supplies is too high for consumers or leaves little to no profit for business, the machine we call our economy will grind to a halt.
    I hope I'm wrong, so if someone can convince me our government will act swiftly and do something please respond.
    Frank, we can absolutely agree that the Gov't will not act in time to save our collective butt. The reason is that not that they can't. It's that *they don't want to*.

    I think proper measures really could make a very rapid change. There is nothing that would prevent it. Most private industrial companies, with only a few exceptions, don't have the inertia that we see in Government. Remember that the one thing that no one ever argues against is that US industry is completely consumed with short term results. I've seen how fast things can happen and firmly believe that within 2 years we would see change, within 5-7 years the climate would be entirely different and in 10 years the US could be back on top of the heap.

    The one thing I failed to mention in earlier posts is that the US Gov't also needs to become stable. Business is very leery about investing domestically because the US Gov't changes the rules and adds regulations, taxes and requirements at the drop of a hat. The most recent example is Obamacare. With the looming Social Security & Medicare crisis business is afraid that payroll taxes might double. That would kill them, right there. So Gov't needs to make a serious commitment to stability as part of the needed reform.

    Getting back to your post, I don't feel that the situation with exisitng cars on the road precludes change. It does preclude overnight change. Realistically we will take at least 10 years to wean ourselves off of oil. All the more reason to start now. But, 1/2 our oil is not imported... so it won't take all that time to seriously reduce imported oil dependency. As an example of how quickly the landscape can change, look at the wide market acceptance and impact that hybrids such as the Prius and Civic hybrid have had on the market. Those things really took off in just a few years. Most (not all) cars are on the road for 10 years or less anyway.

    Along the same lines as your point, the fact that the US had a large existing capital investment in factories while the Chinese started from scratch is often cited as an impediment to re-industrialization fo the US. First of all I don't buy it, but it is an argument. I think tax credits could easily overcome this effect. At this time, companies in the US are cash-rich. The money is being held due to uncertainty regarding the economy going forward. It could just as well be spent domestically as compared to in other countries as long as the anticipated return was better. Would the Gov't lose revenue due to the incentivizing? Perhaps in the short term, but the increase in the economy and employment would ultimately generate revenue for the Gov't. Right now, many think the economy is improving but keep in mind that the Gov't has injected trillions via stimulus, huge overspending, off budget expenses to fund the wars, and low interest rates. Those trillions don't appear just once in the calculation of GDP... they circulate around and represent a huge impact. When that dries up - and it has to eventually - gov't revenue will shrink. They're already anticipating this in DC.

    But I do agree with you that all this is unlikely. Gov't doesn't want it. They want to continue to print and spend and lie about it because they know that this will get them through the next election cycle. They aren't stupid (well ok, some are). They know that a lot of what they do makes no sense and is ultimately not just bad for the country but a disaster. They know that entitlements are a ponzi scheme and that the unfunded liabilities are insane, dwarf the current debt and can't be paid. They don't care. They know that the population will vote for them if they give them prescription drug coverage and 99 weeks of unemployment and on and on and on. They also know that most people want cheap gas and are unwilling to give it up, so they go to war to protect access to crude... even though this is even more costly by all measures. I can say on a tool forum that I think some level of pain would be best for the country, and people may get upset with me, but I am also not running for office. We all know that people don't vote for the TRUTH, they vote for those that tell them what they want to hear. Austerity and the suggestion that there needs to be some substantial pain simply never goes over with voters. Always amazed me that we can't accept that, but we'll let numbskulls send our kids off to be shot at.

    And that is why I am almost completely convinced that we are not going to recover, we are not going to grow domestic jobs, and we are not going to reverse our economic decline.

    Would love to be wrong.
    Last edited by Andy_M; 03-02-2011, 09:40 PM.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Gasoline Prices

      "And that is why I am almost completely convinced that we are not going to recover, we are not going to grow domestic jobs, and we are not going to reverse our economic decline.

      Would love to be wrong."

      Andy, athough we have different ideas on specific problems and solutions, sadly we agree on the conclusion. Why is it that our legislators can't see it?
      When I get the opportunity to talk to folks face to face about the economy, I ask them the same questions and no one has come up with a different scenario. I know there are some selfish, narrow minded folks in washington, but there are a lot of smart folks too. Don't they want to avert a disaster? They must know something we do not, some event or plan that will change the outcome for the better?

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Gasoline Prices

        Not angry with you or anyone else on this forum, just angry in general.

        Try explaining all this to a guy like me. For well over a decade, I have been forced to sacrifice much already, just for the single purpose of keeping a roof over my head. For the entire time, I have worked, schooled, enlisted, deployed, and worked while getting schooled some more, all at the cost of a social life, meeting others, and possibling marying, a price NONEONE had EVER had to pay, even during the bad old days of the 70's. To futher drill it in, keep in mind, I have to go to WAR just for the "priviledge" of having affordable health insurance. Yet inspite of my efforts, there is no possible way I can even contemplate the notion of starting a family due to sheer the financial impossiblity of it! I already work long, irregular hours, do not receive any paid vacation, have military commitments, spend my nights on course work STILL, and go off to war for a third time, and probably not my last, all the while prices continue to rise, thus forcing more hours to work and afford less!

        How much more do I must give up to make things better?

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Gasoline Prices

          Originally posted by tailgunner View Post
          Not angry with you or anyone else on this forum, just angry in general.

          Try explaining all this to a guy like me. For well over a decade, I have been forced to sacrifice much already, just for the single purpose of keeping a roof over my head. For the entire time, I have worked, schooled, enlisted, deployed, and worked while getting schooled some more, all at the cost of a social life, meeting others, and possibling marying, a price NONEONE had EVER had to pay, even during the bad old days of the 70's. To futher drill it in, keep in mind, I have to go to WAR just for the "priviledge" of having affordable health insurance. Yet inspite of my efforts, there is no possible way I can even contemplate the notion of starting a family due to sheer the financial impossiblity of it! I already work long, irregular hours, do not receive any paid vacation, have military commitments, spend my nights on course work STILL, and go off to war for a third time, and probably not my last, all the while prices continue to rise, thus forcing more hours to work and afford less!

          How much more do I must give up to make things better?
          Careful talking about your Military record, as we have blowhards here who like to take shots at the Military and say that you're just hiding behind your military record for some type of attention.

          Personally..you have sacrificed enough, and I have a major problem with Politicians making more money than our men and women who serve their country.

          My cousin-in-law is a Union electrician, and he's been on the shelf for 8 months, and he's number 400 some on the list...whatever that all means.

          I fully believe those who work hard in life will eventually reap the benefits.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Gasoline Prices

            Originally posted by Flux View Post
            Careful talking about your Military record, as we have blowhards here who like to take shots at the Military and say that you're just hiding behind your military record for some type of attention.

            Personally..you have sacrificed enough, and I have a major problem with Politicians making more money than our men and women who serve their country.

            My cousin-in-law is a Union electrician, and he's been on the shelf for 8 months, and he's number 400 some on the list...whatever that all means.

            I fully believe those who work hard in life will eventually reap the benefits.
            Yeah, a daily loaf of bread and a thank you note. 401 (k)'s do not look to well and Social Security will have long since ran out by the time I will ever be able to retire (Hopefully those here will realise I'm joking. We all know there is no such thing as retirement.)

            I'm just going to have to work into my grave. That's the bottom line. Well, off to bed for me, got to get up in five hours.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Gasoline Prices

              One last thing before turning in. Just found this little news article on a local website about union membership

              http://www.masslive.com/news/index.s...ines_in_m.html

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Gasoline Prices

                Originally Posted by Andy_M
                I disagree with your point about the economic mess being caused by oil - it wasn't. In fact artificially low oil prices (before you yell at me, consider what the rest of the world pays)
                thank there government and there taxes,
                that is what the commodity trading is ever one buys at the same rates, a lot of the high prices in other countries is do to TAXES.

                UK drivers pay highest fuel taxes in Europe
                British motorists are paying the highest fuel taxes in Europe – and probably the world – a study has disclosed.
                By Robert Winnett, Deputy Political Editor 12:42AM BST 10 May 2008
                About 57p of the cost of a litre of petrol in Britain is tax, compared with 31p in Spain, 45p in Italy, 48p in France and 52p in Germany.

                The Telegraph launched a campaign in May 2008 calling on Gordon Brown to scrap plans to increase road tax and a planned 2p per litre rise in fuel duty.

                The average Briton pays almost £900 in petrol taxes annually.

                The study, by the Association of European Automobile Manufacturers, shows that Britain has the highest fuel taxes of 27 European countries surveyed.

                The tax is also higher than in America, Canada and Australia
                http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...in-Europe.html
                http://www.bts.gov/publications/jour...l/table11.html
                NOTE: info 2000
                Table 11 - Fuel Prices and Percent Taxes in European Countries

                Country .......... Percent.........taxes.......Tax Price per gallon
                United Kingdom,,,,,76.8 ,,,,,,,,,,,3.295 ,,,,,,,,,,, $4.29
                Netherlands ..........68.4...........2.708 .......,,..$3.96
                France .................72.7......... 2.661 ............$3.66
                Italy ....................67.7......... 2.464 ............ $3.64
                Germany ..............70.7 ...........2.418 ...........$3.42
                USA .....................24.1 ..........0.419 ...........$1.74
                just for discusion, gasoline has basically inflated along with most other goods, at about the same rates, (from 1970 to current),

                take food on the other hand, (basic grains, if they would have inflated with other goods) from the 1970 to now).
                wheat would be in the $16 to $22 dollar range
                corn would be in the $14 to $18 range,
                and the other grains would have followed,
                meat cattle would be in the 30 dollar a pound live weight, not the current $1

                so may be the problem is not too cheap of oil maybe it is to cheap of food.
                if people in this country had to spend 75% to 85% of there incomes on food, instead of all the other things we can buy now would that be so much better, we would not need Green jobs as there would not be hardly any pollution or other as there would be a fraction of the manufacturing and no cars and no need for oil, as all there money would be going to food,

                and by the way who need heat in there homes any way?
                Last edited by BHD; 03-02-2011, 10:47 PM.
                Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                attributed to Samuel Johnson
                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Gasoline Prices

                  Originally posted by tailgunner View Post
                  Not angry with you or anyone else on this forum, just angry in general.

                  Try explaining all this to a guy like me. For well over a decade, I have been forced to sacrifice much already, just for the single purpose of keeping a roof over my head. For the entire time, I have worked, schooled, enlisted, deployed, and worked while getting schooled some more, all at the cost of a social life, meeting others, and possibling marying, a price NONEONE had EVER had to pay, even during the bad old days of the 70's. To futher drill it in, keep in mind, I have to go to WAR just for the "priviledge" of having affordable health insurance. Yet inspite of my efforts, there is no possible way I can even contemplate the notion of starting a family due to sheer the financial impossiblity of it! I already work long, irregular hours, do not receive any paid vacation, have military commitments, spend my nights on course work STILL, and go off to war for a third time, and probably not my last, all the while prices continue to rise, thus forcing more hours to work and afford less!

                  How much more do I must give up to make things better?
                  Gunner, in the grand scheme of life your sacrifice for your job, your country, your fellow citizen doesn't make things better. Those things you did and continue to do make you a great man, but the folks in charge call the shots when it comes to making things better. You have a lot, and from what you say too much on your plate and that's not fair or good. You only get one shot at life and it doesn't seem fair or right that you have to sacrifice so much. Marriage is a partnership of sorts, you are not in it alone. Have you dated women such as nurses, or other ladies who make a decent salary? I'm not suggesting you hunt down a meal ticket, it's just that you have a lot to offer and why not get close to a woman who could not only appreciate you but be financially supportive? I can't speak from experience, but there are guys who fall in love, start a family and go off to serve. Could you have more?

                  There are women who work professions that require much of their time and energy leaving them with little time for finding love, marriage and a family. If I was single and overworked like yourself I would consider a different approach to a social life, change things up a bit? I get bummed out to know a hardworking guy like you who has served his country and will do so in the future, can't have more, can't have it all!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Gasoline Prices

                    Originally posted by BHD View Post
                    thank there government and there taxes,
                    that is what the commodity trading is ever one buys at the same rates, a lot of the high prices in other countries is do to TAXES.
                    Yes, of course. It's well known that taxes in other countries on fuel are the primary reason for their higher prices. It doesn't change the fact that those folks pay alot more for fuel that we do. We pay the taxes in other ways, is all - other taxes, not associated with the gasoline. It's a way that gasoline is held lower in the US compared to the rest of the world. But it is held lower, no?

                    Originally posted by BHD View Post
                    just for discusion, gasoline has basically inflated along with most other goods, at about the same rates, (from 1970 to current),

                    take food on the other hand, (basic grains, if they would have inflated with other goods) from the 1970 to now).
                    wheat would be in the $16 to $22 dollar range
                    corn would be in the $14 to $18 range,
                    and the other grains would have followed,
                    meat cattle would be in the 30 dollar a pound live weight, not the current $1

                    so may be the problem is not too cheap of oil maybe it is to cheap of food.
                    if people in this country had to spend 75% to 85% of there incomes on food, instead of all the other things we can buy now would that be so much better, we would not need Green jobs as there would not be hardly any pollution or other as there would be a fraction of the manufacturing and no cars and no need for oil, as all there money would be going to food,

                    and by the way who need heat in there homes any way?
                    I'm not really getting your point. So food has not tracked inflation? Ok, I agree with all that. The US is good at raising food, and we really don't need to free ourselves from the tyranny of imported wheat or corn.

                    I guess I don't see what this has to do with my point that high gas prices will provide economic stimulus to free ourselves from foreign oil.

                    Look, I appreciate that no one wants to see more expense for gasoline. I don't either. Who *wants* to spend more for the same thing. But at $4 are we ever getting off foreign oil? I don't think so. What's worse? Personally I think continuing to be held hostage by Saudis et al, watching our trade balance go down the drain, destroy our economy, and devalue the dollar isn't too appealing. You don't have to agree... but in the end, that gas price *is* going up, no matter what. We're going to pay for it sooner or later... I think sooner is better because then it's over. Choose to pay later and I believe there's a good chance we'll be paying forever. That's all I'm saying.

                    Btw, if the US dollar loses reserve currency status (both China and the IMF have called for this) you will think $10 gasoline is a bargain, because everything - including food - will go off the chart.Massive trade imbalance and reliance on imports - of which oil is a very significant one - is a very large reason that this may actually happen within the next ten years.
                    Last edited by Andy_M; 03-03-2011, 12:55 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Gasoline Prices

                      Originally posted by Andy_M View Post
                      Yes, of course. It's well known that taxes in other countries on fuel are the primary reason for their higher prices. It doesn't change the fact that those folks pay allot more for fuel that we do. We pay the taxes in other ways, is all - other taxes, not associated with the gasoline. It's a way that gasoline is held lower in the US compared to the rest of the world. But it is held lower, no?

                      I'm not really getting your point. So food has not tracked inflation? Ok, I agree with all that. The US is good at raising food, and we really don't need to free ourselves from the tyranny of imported wheat or corn.

                      I guess I don't see what this has to do with my point that high gas prices will provide economic stimulus to free ourselves from foreign oil.

                      Btw, if the US dollar loses reserve currency status (both China and the IMF have called for this) you will think $10 gasoline is a bargain, because everything - including food - will go off the chart.Massive trade imbalance and reliance on imports - of which oil is a very significant one - is a very large reason that this may actually happen within the next ten years.
                      the point is that if you knock any one segment out of whack in the economy, and if that segment is a survival segment, you going to create disaster,

                      the thing is we could be off of imported oil, if the government would have allowed us to use our own, plan and simple, just like your argument for food, (one of the problems is some just think OIL is BAD, and want NO OIL, not just independents form foreign oils)

                      but if a energy or a food or a product can not stand on it own merit then is it right to penalize the product that can so the one that can not be used or afforded,
                      It would be some what like saying Ford is selling more cars than GM, so we will add a Ford tax so GM can be competitive,

                      one thing what would help is a different way of thinking, (MAKE PRODUCTS LAST, AND AFFORDABLE PARTS to repair them),

                      now ever thing is made to be throw away, thus more raw products, energy and oil is used to make replacements, (and the throw away is a problem as well as what do we do with it)

                      I was reading an article on being green in building, and the editor went on to explain on how to cut corners and use less wood and materials to build with, the problem is you end up with a building that no one wants to live in in 30 to 40 years, as it falls down around one, instead of saying build it once and build it right, a building that is enjoyable to live in when it is 100 years old or 200 hundred years old is much greener than one that only lasts one generation,

                      when it come to energy, renewables are coming into there time, windturbins have come from a 6 volt car generator to towering turbines in the sky that one unit can power a community, and are becoming competitive with coal and other forms of generation forms,
                      (but the largest problem is the government will not work with the interstate and intrastate transportation of that power, (there are many proposed wind farms, but they can not get there power from the farm to the markets),
                      people bash ethanol, (some for using corn, as that is bad, but I leave that for another discussion), will biomass ethanol be better, the cost is coming down, I have a friend who is working on lowering the cost of the process on a daily basis,
                      Texas AM have come up with a way of liquefying coal for a very good price,
                      http://www.ultracleanfuels.com/artic...tte_091805.htm

                      things are coming, but if you push it to hard on the oil cost of things all your going to do is destroy the economy and set things back years,
                      broke people and a broke government will not make us energy independent, (I guess it will in that we will no longer need the energy) we will just end up deforesting the land as ever one hunts for wood to cook on and to keep warm,

                      even if electric cars were ready for mass production, and capable of traveling a good distance, First how many can be made in a year? and second, how many can buy them?

                      the thing is oil will and has got more expensive to harvest, the easy oil is gone, and as it gets more expensive, the price will raise, helping bring into line with some other energies that have been dropping in cost for the last 50 years,

                      but forcing it is the wrong way to achieve the goal, or to create a artificial disaster to make it some thing else workable,

                      ~~~~~~~~~~

                      (if the dollar looses it reserve currency standing it is too because of stupid government policy,

                      much like the reason the cost of so many things have inflated in the last 40, years it is printing paper money with any backing, if we want more we just print it,
                      It is the government plan on getting out debt, we pay it off with inflated dollars, we owe 10 dollars, if we inflate the currency then we can pay it off with 5 former dollars worth of goods, that now cost 10 dollars. and as the government borrows from it self and keeps the printing presses flying, (adding 0's on the computer). the government inflates the money and pays with cheaper dollars, all along there is this catch up game that happens to the citizenry, and they loose. and now the world is getitng concerned as well.
                      Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                      "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                      attributed to Samuel Johnson
                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                      PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Gasoline Prices

                        I'm not suggesting forcing anything. It is not possible to do that, we don't control the price other than by demand and of course taxes. I'm only saying that if the price goes up substantially, and it will, that the increase will provide economic pressure to develop alternatives. And if that is what it takes to move us off our dead butts, then it's a good thing in the long run.

                        I appreciate your comments, and Frank's, too, but honestly I don't see $10 gasoline as the catastrophy you do. In 2007 we here in CA had gas topping $4.50. People complained. Life on the planet didn't stop. Prius sales went up. SUV sales went down. This was probably all to the good. In Europe and most of the rest of the world, they pay 3x or more for gasoline, and they're still able to eat and heat their homes.

                        What is true is that in Europe, the pressure of high prices has resulted in more nuclear generation, and fuel efficient vehicles. Meanwhile in the US we have no had any new nuclear plants built in many years. High fuel prices have moved them in a sensible direction. We are not moving in a sensible direction, in fact, we are engaging in wars that, let's face it, we wouldn't be having were it nor for our foreign oil interest. What of the economic catastrophy of war, the most expensive endeavor of Government? Not to mention the loss of life.

                        I am in CA, the most car-dependant state in the union. Here, there are no shortages of large cars, most of which have one person in them and no, the bulk of them are not not work vehicles. This is true even though we have one of the higher levels of unemployment in the country. So I have a hard time accepting that on the whole a rise in fuel will mean the end of the world. I think that reality is that there is room for belt tightening on the whole, although I do recognize that in any scenario where prices rise those squeezed at the bottom will feel the pain the worst. I also understand that everyone will have to rebalance their expenditures to adapt. Will the economy collapse? Maybe you're right, but I just don't think so. The rest of the world hasn't collapsed, and we have many advantages over them.

                        If price increases cause the US to move to develop other sources of energy, such as nuclear, shale gas, natural gas, or solar, and yes, even increased domestic drilling, then in the long run we benefit. I don't see conclusive agreement that domestic oil drilling alone will alleviate our dependence on oil imports, although it will certainly have an effect. We currently import 50-60% of our oil. Perhaps we can double internal production? I don't know. It seems like a tall order.

                        It's interesting that some of the nations having the richest oil reserves are heavily interested in nuclear and natural gas for their own domestic energy needs. I don't think they are all that stupid... it seems to me that there are compelling long term economic reasons to do that.

                        I'm not advocating any action to artificially raise oil prices. I do strongly support an end to oil company subsidies and that will result in a little bit higher prices. But it sounds like you agree that prices are going to rise on their own. So in my view, I prefer them to rise sooner rather than later so we can get on with the solution and put people to work in a new energy industry before others pass us by on this, just like they have passed us by in so many other industries.

                        China and other countries that have central control are already moving on the problem. If China ends up with a domestic energy industry, they become even harder to compete with. That's the real problem, not higher prices at the pump.

                        That's my view, I respect your disagreement.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Gasoline Prices

                          Andy, I won't get into all that other stuff again we've expressed our opinions and simply disagree on some issues. I'm kind of shocked at this point to think we are in competition with communist china. We depend on them for most of our consumer goods and loans to run our government. Our society is dead compared to theirs and I thought we agreed that our government will not take the appropriate action to save us. Competition to me suggests there is a chance either party could win. We are not step up to win anything. Today I paid $3.74 a gallon in CT, things are not looking good. In NYC thousands of teachers are about to be fired, all around the country folks are losing their jobs. Where is the miracle that will change any of this nightmare?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Gasoline Prices

                            Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                            Andy, I won't get into all that other stuff again we've expressed our opinions and simply disagree on some issues. I'm kind of shocked at this point to think we are in competition with communist china. We depend on them for most of our consumer goods and loans to run our government. Our society is dead compared to theirs and I thought we agreed that our government will not take the appropriate action to save us. Competition to me suggests there is a chance either party could win. We are not step up to win anything. Today I paid $3.74 a gallon in CT, things are not looking good. In NYC thousands of teachers are about to be fired, all around the country folks are losing their jobs. Where is the miracle that will change any of this nightmare?
                            I saw that. I went down to Bradley again for the NG, and dropped my jaw right on the pavement when I passed by the gas station on Rt. 20 in E. Grandby. Still, pulled another 12+ hour day, and just gotten home a 1/2 hour ago. To add insult to injury, came home to a $200 electric bill, inspite of the fact I used less power for the month of February than I did in January. Looks like I'm going to have a use for those Big Y gold coins at the Sonoco stations afterall.

                            Oh, to answer your question, WWIII will be that miracle. Hey, it worked back in the 40's.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Gasoline Prices

                              Originally posted by tailgunner View Post
                              I saw that. I went down to Bradley again for the NG, and dropped my jaw right on the pavement when I passed by the gas station on Rt. 20 in E. Grandby. Still, pulled another 12+ hour day, and just gotten home a 1/2 hour ago. To add insult to injury, came home to a $200 electric bill, inspite of the fact I used less power for the month of February than I did in January. Looks like I'm going to have a use for those Big Y gold coins at the Sonoco stations afterall.

                              Oh, to answer your question, WWIII will be that miracle. Hey, it worked back in the 40's.
                              Do you think china will lend us the money we will need for WWIII?

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Gasoline Prices

                                Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                                Do you think china will lend us the money we will need for WWIII?
                                When the ground troops move into my area I will be ready and waiting. How tall is the average chinese man? I need to sight me rifle in for WWIII......

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