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  • #31
    Re: The President's Priorities

    Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
    NHM, I had not planned to retire at such an early age leaving myself with a financial deficit. I had not planned for the soccer mom speeding on a snow covered road, who totalled my car and left me with herniated discs and permanent injuries. That aside while some folks gorge and waste gasoline, others have no choice but to drive what they can afford and drive only when necessary.
    I actually agree that there should be a plan, a national effort to move towards alternative fuels, but I am pretty sure the economy cannot support such efforts and the government has no plan. The necessary infrastructure to support electric cars, or other alternative fuels would be massive. If you haven't noticed our legislators are busy accomplishing nothing! The sale of A123 to communist china is another example of lost taxpayer wealth (250million) that will never return to our economy.
    I say we need $2 a gallon gasoline in order to keep working people working, and spending beyond the pump to stimulate the economy. Same goes for folks looking for work. The move to the suburbs was predicated on affordable fuel and lower property taxes. We would trade off the convenience living close to our jobs and sacrifice hours of our lives on the road commuting for the American dream of owning a home. That has proven to be another idea not thought out to it's final conclusion.
    If we had democrats and republicans working together towards a better future, gasoline prices could drop temporarily in order to stabilize the economy, while at the same time plans were put into place to transition to alternative fulel vehicles and the national system to support them. NHM, we agree on what should and must be done. We disagree that it can happen in this economy with this government.
    Frank, I am sorry that you can no longer work through no fault of your own. To me stating "I'm retired" implies a decision on ones part to no longer work and that have accumulated enough time on the job to earn a retirement. Being taken out of the workforce because you can no longer work through no fault of your own is something totally different. If that happened to me I would not refer to it as retirement. I wouldn't be looking for sympathy from everyone just as I am sure you are not and maybe to avoid the stigma I could see saying at times that I am retired. But here among friends (even though we argue or disagree at times) I don't think that would be the case.

    Frank, you ask or propose things here in your post that are best implemented by the government at the federal level, but in other posts you are against government spending to stimulate the economy. You confuse me on where you stand on some of these issues.

    Who should lead this national effort to migrate to alternative fuels if not Uncle Sam? China maybe? All our business will be operating from there the way things are going, and big business is OK with that. Why, because they are no longer for the most part American businesses, they have been merged or aquired by offshore businesses in one way or another, just as happened to A123. But we need less government. Government should stay out of the way of business. These are some of the things you hear from business and politicians who are in the pocket of big business. And that attitude has allowed the demise of companies like A123 for far too long.

    Infusing money into the economy to stimulate the growth of the infrastructure necessary to make alternative fuels viable is what some in Washington have been trying to do for years but have faced stiff opposition to their efforts, and that resistance is funded by those who control the current life blood of our economy, big oil. Why, because they don't want competition so they let the country as a while suffer for their gain.

    I fail to see why some are against spending federal dollars to get the economy moving. If I take one federal dollar and loan it to a company to develop a new product or build a facility to increase their domestic production how is that bad? First off its a loan, if we (the Fed) stick to the contract then they will be paying it back so no money lost. Second, that dollar will be spent on employing someone (hopefully an American), who will pay taxes on that dollar and will in turn spend it somewhere to buy some product or service and the chain will continue. Before it over that one dollar laoned will be respent a dozen times over, generating taxes all along the way. So not only did we (the Fed) get repaid on our original loan, but we created a new taxable spending by the public which will help pay for current and future needs like stealth bombers, drone fighters, and trips to Mars, along with a few dollars for Medicare and Social Security. Speaking of which the ceiling on contributions to both should be raised
    considerably. It should be more like $200k not the $117k or where ever it is now.

    $2/Gallon gas is not going to save the economy and put people back to work, and besides the only way I see to get this would be government price controls, something I am sure you would object to. If we are going to control the price of gas then I vote that health care costs be next. The drug companies and HMOs are just as guilty of abusing the public as the oil companies are.

    Spending beyond the pump; well that could only come from two places as I see it; either the government or big oil. If history has proven anything when it comes to gasoline it's that big oil has no interest in spending any more they have to to get the oil out of the ground and into your tank with maximum profit. If they destroy a tundra or bay or two along the way so be it. If the opposite were the case then bog oil would have suffered along with the rest of the country over the past 6 years, but I don't think that is the case do you? Or were all those reports on the news of their record profits month after month a lie.

    If we had both sides of the isle working together that would be a landmark day compared to recent (last 6 years) history. If your opinions and stands on issues are representative of how your party feels then it would seem to me the two are light-years apart. If you want cooperation then you need to do a little bending of your own principles and positions. To 'meet in the middle' requires both parties to give a little, so far there has been little meaningful movement from the Republicans that I can see.
    They can't even agree to pay the bills they have already incurred. Well, to be more exact, they want to use this potential catastrophic event as a weapon to push their one-sided position through on other issues.
    ---------------
    Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
    ---------------
    “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
    ---------
    "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
    ---------
    sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: The President's Priorities

      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
      In ten years if not sooner, gasoline powered vehicles will be a thing of the past. That aside though, even if we opened up all the oil fields both offshore and onshore in this country and let the oil companies have at it, the price of oil and gas would not drop one single penny. The cost of drilling, developing, engineering, not to mention having to build a whole lot more refineries would guarantee that the price at the pump would not only not go down, it would increase. We need to move our focus away from regressive policies that hold tenaciously to a century old technology.
      What about shale oil your new savour which has been said will make the US self sufficient and an exporter no with new ways of drilling the world has so much oil they don`t know what to do with it I just have to laugh at you complaning about the cost of petrol at $2.00 a gallon here in Australia we are paying one day a $1.40 per litre and the next $1.50 which in your currency is around $6.00 a gallon even though we are awash with oil as a new discovery has been found under South Australia in the billions of barrels and that does not include our shale oil but our oil is priced in Singapore and is the reason it is so high so get used to it as your economy faulters and the US dollar becomes worthless expect to pay your oil barrons more and more as they have a standard of living to keep up which dosen`t include us

      Tony

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: The President's Priorities

        Thanks for the response Bob. I don't have a "party", I vote according to results and neither party has produced the results our country needs in years.Gov't stimulus as seen back in the days of the WPA, lead the way for manufacturing here in the USA. These days gov't stimulus money achieves nothing and has no end game for creating a path for employing millions.
        I agree that the private sector would best coordinate and institute the necessary infrastructure for alternative fuels, that is how all the cell towers necessary for our cell phones got done. Unfortunately for us, agree that big oil will make sure through lobbyists and whatever other methods necesssary, that does not come to pass. In my opinion the only chance we have of seeing a large scale transition to alternative fuels and supporting infrastructure would be some kind of national movement with the cooperation of democrats, republicans, all Americans and big business. ONce again I agree that is very doubtful given the past. The $2 a gallon gas I keep harping on would help during such a transition by allowing folks in crisis the opportunity to commute and still consume. I further agree that healthcare costs need to be controlled. Clearly the results of the healthcare law so far have been skyrocketing costs and job loss, like Mark and others, my costs are up.
        What can we realistically expect going forward? I doubt the folks in washington will come together, same goes for the move towards alternative energy and any hope for lower healthcare costs. I don't like what I am seeing or the direction. I don't like either political party, America deserves better. We needs great legislators, grand ideas and massive efforts. I don't see that, do you?

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: The President's Priorities

          The only way the cost of gasoline will drop to two dollars is if everything else drops with it. Exxon Mobil is not going to decrease their profit expectations unless the government tells them they have too and if they do that we move closer to the socialist government you all fear so much.
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: The President's Priorities

            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
            The only way the cost of gasoline will drop to two dollars is if everything else drops with it. Exxon Mobil is not going to decrease their profit expectations unless the government tells them they have too and if they do that we move closer to the socialist government you all fear so much.
            NHM, I fear a collapse, I fear more of the same dysfunction that fuels inflation and prevents recovery. However you define what is presently in place, I define as broken. I'm fine with the government telling big oil to drop their prices and profits in order for folks to get to work, find work, get needed medicl treatments, and lower prices on goods that are trucked. Just my opinion that we can't stay this course any more than we could stay the ones before. Big changes to business as usual or big problems ahead.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: The President's Priorities

              Slippery slope
              sigpic

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: The President's Priorities

                Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                Slippery slope
                I wouldn't describe what we have as good footing.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: The President's Priorities

                  I wonder if we can order Iraq gasoline from amazon or E-bay?
                  They are paying 50 cents a gallon for gas!

                  Also be aware...Home depot and Harbor freight are out of "dead-blow" hammers

                  I posted a new sign at my front door....

                  "Due to the increasing cost of ammunition there will no longer be a warning shot!"


                  Cactus Man

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: The President's Priorities

                    I see one of his priorities (and maybe more his party than his), not that I agree with it, as getting some immigration reform in place before the next election or at worst before he leaves office, so that the Dems can claim it was all their doing and hopefully gain a big block of votes.
                    ---------------
                    Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                    ---------------
                    “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                    ---------
                    "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                    ---------
                    sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: The President's Priorities

                      Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                      I see one of his priorities (and maybe more his party than his), not that I agree with it, as getting some immigration reform in place before the next election or at worst before he leaves office, so that the Dems can claim it was all their doing and hopefully gain a big block of votes.
                      Bob, whatever the reason behind it, I just hope it gets done and helps resolve a lot of the problems associated with illegal immigration.
                      Wheter or not this is seen as a feather in the President's and democrat's hat, may not be enough to win future elections if progress is not seen on other important issues like unemployment and inflation.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: The President's Priorities

                        Well, if the ten million working here undocumented is true, how many of them are not paying taxes but still taking benefits in one way or another. Are all these people working off the books? If so then between them not paying taxes and their employers not paying their share, the Fed is missing out on a lot of money aren't they.
                        ---------------
                        Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                        ---------------
                        “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                        ---------
                        "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                        ---------
                        sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: The President's Priorities

                          Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                          Well, if the ten million working here undocumented is true, how many of them are not paying taxes but still taking benefits in one way or another. Are all these people working off the books? If so then between them not paying taxes and their employers not paying their share, the Fed is missing out on a lot of money aren't they.
                          Bob, I've been wining about that for years! It's not just the fed, it's local communities, the burden on schools, hospitals and law enforcement. American workers including tradesmen who have lost work due to the subculture of illegal workers. The argument against me is the savings we realize from their cheap labor but I don't think it's worth it in the end. We don't even know the number, could be twn, could be twenty million. I blame the democrats and republicans who over the years allowed the borders to remain open to illegals. Before someone jumps in saying I'm against immigrants, I am against illegals, those who allow their entry, those who employ them. I don't deny that most are very hardworking, that is not the problem! Sure hope once more laws are passed to reform immigration, those illegals take advantage of the opportunity and don't remain undocumented!

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: The President's Priorities

                            Partof any new law ought to include getting tough on those who don't come clean. 'Needed' or not they have to go
                            ---------------
                            Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                            ---------------
                            “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                            ---------
                            "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                            ---------
                            sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: The President's Priorities

                              Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                              Well, if the ten million working here undocumented is true, how many of them are not paying taxes but still taking benefits in one way or another. Are all these people working off the books? If so then between them not paying taxes and their employers not paying their share, the Fed is missing out on a lot of money aren't they.
                              The go-to argument has always been they pay taxes using a fake SS# so do not benefits. It sure seems like the IRS should be able to figure out how many returns go unclaimed.

                              Mark
                              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: The President's Priorities

                                Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                                The go-to argument has always been they pay taxes using a fake SS# so do not benefits. It sure seems like the IRS should be able to figure out how many returns go unclaimed.

                                Mark
                                To go along with that issue of "fake" SS#'s, much has been said about where do they get those. Does the "employer" supply those in some sweat shop or farming business, or do they just come up with them by some other means? IF, the employer is on the level and is just fooled into thinking these "illegals" are bonefide, then they must be pretty stupid or else they just don't care enough to look into it. If they are being fooled, then following the letter or the law, the company then pays into the Social Security System and since the "illegal" can't possibly collect, then those monies must go as uncollected surplus; and is that a good thing? The "illegal" is thus paying into a system from which they cannot collect from.

                                Personally, I believe the fault of illegal workers rests in the hands of those who employ them and I see absolutely no excuse whatsoever for that. It has to be pretty blatently overlooked by any employer and certainly by their fellow workers. I say that based on my personal experience. I've worked in all kinds of environments: from restaurants with only a handfull of employees, to sub-contract places, to large factories. You know who you are hiring and you know who you are working with. Even is a worker looks on the "up-and-up", it doesn't take very long for others to determine if someone is legit. Even in a plant of almost 3,000 workers, it takes only a few days for almost everyone to know who they are and where they might have come from. So I find it a pretty poor excuse (read that as a "lie") for someone to say they "didn't know"!

                                BUT, I do feel for almost any "illegal", from the point of view that I don't know their background and what drove them to cross the border and seek a better life. We all know the muderous conditions south of the border; we all know that there are many "harvesting" jobs, that can't be done without "immigrant" workers; and I've read where many of our trade policies of the past have actually put many Mexican and other "south-of-the-border" workers out of their local jobs. Faced with no work, and an extremely unsafe environment that is fed by the U.S. drug trade and uncontrolled weapons trade into those countries by U.S. merchants, it is very hard for me to blame some family who goes through some risk to get north across the border for a better life. That of course is NOT saying that "illegal" is anything but "illegal", but it does say that in many ways we have promoted this upon ourselves and for far too many there is a definite profit motive to seeing that it continues.

                                Bottom line is that the illegal issue is a very complex one. We need "guest workers", but how do we handle that and not have it be a replacement for an American worker? The current administration has done more to send back "illegals" than previous administration and hopefully will work out a solution to stop the infux of illegals. But, will it "FIX" the problem of all those "reasons" that such immigration exists?

                                CWS

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