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Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

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  • Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic


  • #2
    Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

    Unwise perhaps but Unpatriotic?
    sigpic

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    • #3
      Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

      Seems that even President Obama thinks adding to the national debt was a bad idea way back when. Is it just possibly unwise or absolutely unwise? That's my dilemma.

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      • #4
        Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41Ffz0RU0RA
        "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

        I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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        • #5
          Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

          I guees we willhave to defer to those in the House who approved all the spending that we needto raise the debt ceiling now so that we can honor our commitments already made. I think it more unpatriotic to default or not pay for goods and services which we have already contracted for.

          Raise the ceiling and control future spending.

          What really needs to happen os to get all the corruption, mismanagement, and pork barrel jobs out of government at all levels, right down to your municipal government and school boards.
          ---------------
          Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
          ---------------
          “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
          ---------
          "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
          ---------
          sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

            BobD,

            I couldn't agree more with your "get all the corruption, mismanagement, and pork barrel jobs out of government at all levels, right down to your municipal government and school boards."

            But given the circumstances of 2008, I wouldn't even go near "unpatriotic" for a label. As I said in an earlier post: you get faced with either "abandonment" or "investment". Obama choose "investment" and by all of the numbers, and in spite of some poor choices and failures, and continued right-wing obstuctionism, we are seeing improvement! And, you can't pay down the debt by lowering taxes and continueing to let the middle class worker add to the unemployment.

            I am sure that each and everyone of us can look at our own communities and personal experieces in seeing the absolute "waste" that goes on. I think we need to fire all of the community "grant writers" and start looking at budgets as if they were our own personal monies. Over the last forty years, it seems that there has been an every-present mindset that government money is FREE. It of course is NOT!

            The other part of so-called government spending is ROI (Return on Investment) and simply receiving poor services/product. It's like we don't have anyone in government, at any level, who knows the value of what they are soliciting bids for. I see buildings built, highways and bridges constructed, sidewalks laid, and a myriad of other expenditures for which the quality of product and services is simply NOT there.

            For example, some thirty years ago we spent $Millions in Binghamton, NY to have a governmental plaza built. Right from the start it was full of failures... the fountain on top of the county garage couldn't be used because it leaked into the garage and sheriff's offices. The pedestrian bridge was open only a few days when the city engineer declared it unsafe and it was over a decade before a fix was affordable. The central State building suffered a transformer fire and the enire building was contaminated with PCB, and was closed for almost 20 years to occupancy. The adjoining plaza building, known as Marine Midland Plaza was found to exceed government limits with asbestos contamination and it was closed of over a decade. ALL of these contractors got paid and to my knowledge nobody was sent to jail or even charged with shoddy work.

            In the Corning area, after the 1972 "Agnes" flood, we received all kinds of "government" money. Built a great library; too expensive to properly heat and cool and the ventilation was so poorly done that mildew has always been a problem. The new Senior Center had the sidewalks and entryway cracking before even the first winter. Corning and Painted Post decided to put "pavers" in for the pedestrian walkways in the commercial areas of the city, they were substand, heaved, cracked, and disintegrated over the first decade. Again, the city had to pay for repairs and nobody contracted or purchased from were held accountable.

            Here in Painted Post, we had this really great park with a regulation "Little League" field, picknic area, shade trees, etc. First moving here, my wife and I found it a great place to take "our little guy" after supper and on the weekends, and the ball games were always fun to watch, as well as the occasional music sessions with the local talents.

            But then we went after a "FREE" grant and ripped all that out, replacing it with a huge community swimming pool (before this we could go to the highschool on Friday and Saturday nights for "community swim"). Then they ripped up the picnic area and put in four paved tennis courts and fenced them all in with a lockable gate and added a roofed pavilion on a concrete slab for "picnicking in any weather". At one end of it was new restrooms too.

            Well, it took several years for the regulation "Little League" diamond to be created over across the river (with another grant). The village found it couldn't afford to keep the pool open as we needed to pay several certified lifeguards, and the insurance alone was tremendous, so the pool was only open one month out of a typical summer. Taxes went up sharply to pay for the manpower, the chemicals, electricity and almost constant maintenance. The tennis courts.. well, I've never seen anybody play there and now the blacktop is all busted up, the nets long ago rotted, etc. Oh, and that picknic area... well seems the village can't affor to keep up those restrooms and the smell is so bad that the thing is rarely used. The roof is long overdo for repair and the village just keeps raising our taxes to pay for the dozen "public works guys" and the many pensions of those who retired from it. But hey, IT WAS FREE MONEY from the government!

            In the last two years we've seen major highway work between Waverly and Elmira. Big $$$, but although it was just finished a few months ago the road is bumpier than before, a couple of sections have sagged and have already been "repaved". The entire stretch is "grooved" for "anti-ice" purposes, but you can just hear and feel this chewing away at your tires and already you can see chipping and wear.

            These are all just "civil" projects, so I can't begin to imagine what we're getting on the military and defense side of things. I heard a story a couple of weeks ago about the "cost over-runs" that are doubling and tripling the original quotations and estimates. Much is do to "changes of scope", but also much is simply that we can't "hold their feet to the fire" when it comes to executing the various projects in a cost effective way. The F-35 is one of those, being the more economic choice over the more advanced fighter program that was cancelled a few years ago. The F-35 today has become so expensive that it may well end up being significantly cut.

            On an historic level, this country of ours proved itself superior because during WWII our equipment though less sophisticated than that of Germany, could be produced in such mass numbers that it was easily replaceable and often repairable "in the field". Our guys could canabalize, alter, rig, and fix our stuff to do almost anything demanded, on the spot. The Germans had highly sophistocated machine guns, tanks, and airplanes... in many cases many steps ahead of us. But it was too expensive and too costly in time and materials to manufacture in the great quantities needed, and perhaps more importantly, it was almost impossible to repair in the field. It seems that we have leaned very little from that experience and thus our defense budget is monsterous when compared to even the joint budgets of the next five or six powers.

            CWS
            Last edited by CWSmith; 01-27-2013, 07:24 PM.

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            • #7
              Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

              Here's the thing though. Everybody wants less government spending, they just don't want it to come from their state. I mean, the congressmen and senators that keep getting re-elected get re-elected because they bring home the government dollars which keep folks in their districts working so..........slippery slope. Less govt. spending will lead to higher unemployment. Makes your head spin doesn't it?
              sigpic

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              • #8
                Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                Looks like defense spending is not our biggest problem, percentage wise it's actually getting smaller.
                Is Defense Spending Driving Our Debt? | The Weekly Standard

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                • #9
                  Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                  Interesting, but since the top headline Ad shouted "Republican" to me, I thought maybe I ought to look further.

                  In the linked article it stated: the "Defense Department is on track to go from 47 to 15 percent." Okay, sounds good. But then I looked at Wikipedia and found this: File:U.S. Defense Spending Trends.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                  Now that doesn't look to me like the "Defense Department is on track" It more appears that we are increasing the costs.

                  Time is short at the moment, but obviously we need to look for more data... preferably from an unbiased source.

                  However, I have absolutely NO doubt that "entitlements" as they may be labelled, is a serious and ever growing problem.

                  CWS

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                  • #10
                    Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                    I agree, screwing the hardworking taxpayers and future generations is unpatriotic. Quantitative easing (printing monopoly money) is devaluing our currency and my hard earned savings.

                    We are teaching our children that the government will take care of us instead of learning to be self reliant.

                    Our only hope was Ron Paul.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                      We have been teaching them that since Roosevelt
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                      • #12
                        Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                        Originally posted by CWSmith View Post
                        BobD,

                        I couldn't agree more with your "get all the corruption, mismanagement, and pork barrel jobs out of government at all levels, right down to your municipal government and school boards."

                        But given the circumstances of 2008, I wouldn't even go near "unpatriotic" for a label. As I said in an earlier post: you get faced with either "abandonment" or "investment". Obama choose "investment" and by all of the numbers, and in spite of some poor choices and failures, and continued right-wing obstuctionism, we are seeing improvement!
                        Wait a minute, you're contradicting yourself here.

                        You say you hate pork barrel spending, and mismanagement of money, but yet that is why the Tea party was voted in.

                        Now it's right-wing obstructionism cause they are trying to stop business as usual for the last 30+ years?

                        You're losing me here with your logic.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Adding to the National Debt is unpatriotic

                          Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                          Here's the thing though. Everybody wants less government spending, they just don't want it to come from their state. I mean, the congressmen and senators that keep getting re-elected get re-elected because they bring home the government dollars which keep folks in their districts working so..........slippery slope. Less govt. spending will lead to higher unemployment. Makes your head spin doesn't it?
                          I agree and disagree. I believewe can get all that is asked for now for less. We need to get rid of the waste first. And what's less will be afordable without raising taxes or taking away those benefits that we have promised. Eliminate the waste in the government contract system and you could save over 25% in the military budget alone without mothballing one ship or retiring any planes or reducing the number of bases or the size of our standing army.

                          There is such massive waste in the system that everyone along the way bends to their advantage or profit. I don't know how we would go about it, but itcan't hurt to try. That's one reason i believe a flat tax is to everyone's benefit. Right up front you could cut the IRS down to 1/4 of what it is now, that got to be a few billion savings right there. You eliminate the loopholes that cost the Fed money in lost revenue, somtheres more money coming in. And no ones taxes have gone up, we've just made sure that everyone is paying their share.
                          ---------------
                          Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                          ---------------
                          “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                          ---------
                          "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                          ---------
                          sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                          Comment

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