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Tyrannical executive orders

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  • #61
    Re: Tyrannical executive orders

    Frankie, that is not proof. That is an excuse to do something that was probably planned in the first place.

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    • #62
      Re: Tyrannical executive orders

      Originally posted by Pipestone Kid View Post
      Frankie, that is not proof. That is an excuse to do something that was probably planned in the first place.
      "The tax will change these numbers for the worse. It will be levied at 2.3 percent of sales; on average, profits make up less than 4 percent of sales in the industry. The AdvaMed study concludes, “The new 2.3 percent excise tax will roughly double their total tax bill and raise the average effective corporate income tax rate to one of the highest effective tax rates faced by any industry in the world.” . . .Richard S. Foster, the Medicare chief actuary, has estimated that if the tax is passed on to consumers it will raise national-health costs by $18.2 billion in 2018."

      You must be right Kid, just a coincidence. Since any and all loss of jobs in that industry or any other must be coincidental, I would imagine nothing could serve as proof. How does that saying go, "There are none so blind as those who wil not see".

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Tyrannical executive orders

        Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
        I'm not sure how true that statement is. However, I could see a company with 54 employees deciding to trim 5 employees rather than supply health care. In addition, an up and coming business will have to decide what it will cost to hire that 50th employee. There are a lot of employers out there trying to figure out how this will change things. Who knows, the new norm may be individuals with multiple part time jobs.

        Mark
        This reminded me of something:
        Papa John's, CEO, John Schnatter's mansion. - Imgur

        Keep in mind, the image here does not do the property justice. On top of the private golf course seen, this estate is 40,000 acres, with a castle complete with a draw bridge.

        Yeah, I can see how any healthcare law will bankrupt such a business when forced to pay for a bottle of Amoxacillin to treat an employee's ear infection.
        Last edited by tailgunner; 02-01-2013, 07:34 PM.

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        • #64
          Re: Tyrannical executive orders

          Originally posted by tailgunner View Post
          This reminded me of something:
          Papa John's, CEO, John Schnatter's mansion. - Imgur

          Keep in mind, the image here does not do the property justice. On top of the private golf course seen, this estate is 40,000 acres, with a castle complete with a draw bridge.

          Yeah, I can see how any healthcare law will bankrupt such a business when forced to pay for a bottle of Amoxacillin to treat an employee's ear infection.
          Tailgunner, there's no shortage of very wealthy business owners who could have and should have done more for their workers. Going on strike for months at a time over the years as part of a strong Union fighting a multibillion dollar corporation resulted in better wages and benefits than most. This whole argument is not about what should be done, what's right, what's fair, it's about what businesses in general and working and retired folks can afford.
          The healthcare law most likely won't hurt papa john, but it will hurt plenty, it is already hurting me. I heard that by 2018 the cheapest level of healthcare will cost the average family 20K a year! This law was not the answer. The problem is not the cost of antibiotics and birth control, it's the thousands upon thousands for tests, treatments and other care. In my opinion this will be a huge cluster puck and will get worse as time goes by. We needed a economic recovery and stabilization before we were in a position to save and prolong lives. This law will keep many elderely folks alive at the cost to young people and future generations. I don't dislike the elderely, I dislike dysfunction and stupidity.
          Last edited by Frankiarmz; 02-01-2013, 08:05 PM.

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          • #65
            Re: Tyrannical executive orders

            Yep, I can see it now. Frankie's wife get sick and he says "Can't afford to spend any money--let her die."

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            • #66
              Re: Tyrannical executive orders

              Originally posted by Pipestone Kid View Post
              Yep, I can see it now. Frankie's wife get sick and he says "Can't afford to spend any money--let her die."
              Kid, I love my wife, but neither she nor I will live forever. I've buried a daughter. I know about loss, and I know it's heartbreaking to lose loved ones. I'm only alive today because modern medicine was able to save my life when I was a child, and I spent a long , long time in more than one hospital watching elderely people suffer. We don't respect life and we don't accept a natural death. There is a cost, a price to pay for prolonging life when it's past it's time. Don't fool yourself into thinking you are a better person than me because I am willing to admit our society is screwed up, medicine is far ahead of our ability to properly implement, and pay for it. Our desire to do what we think is good, is corrupting what we can afford to do without risking a worse outcome.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                Tailgunner, there's no shortage of very wealthy business owners who could have and should have done more for their workers. Going on strike for months at a time over the years as part of a strong Union fighting a multibillion dollar corporation resulted in better wages and benefits than most. This whole argument is not about what should be done, what's right, what's fair, it's about what businesses in general and working and retired folks can afford.
                The healthcare law most likely won't hurt papa john, but it will hurt plenty, it is already hurting me. I heard that by 2018 the cheapest level of healthcare will cost the average family 20K a year! This law was not the answer. The problem is not the cost of antibiotics and birth control, it's the thousands upon thousands for tests, treatments and other care. In my opinion this will be a huge cluster puck and will get worse as time goes by. We needed a economic recovery and stabilization before we were in a position to save and prolong lives. This law will keep many elderely folks alive at the cost to young people and future generations. I don't dislike the elderely, I dislike dysfunction and stupidity.
                Well, it is a good thing I can't afford a family I guess. I would end up broke otherwise!

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                  A large piece of the high cost of health care is all the advertising they do. Tell me truthfully, can you get through one day without hearing or seeing at least a dozen ads for some hospital, or drug, or hmo? How many billions do you think they spend a year.
                  "When we build let us think we build forever. Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone. Let it be such work that our descendants will thank us for, and let us think, as we lay stone upon stone, that a time is to come when these stones will be held sacred because our hands have touched them, and that men will say, as they look upon the labor and wrought substance of them, "See! This our fathers did for us."
                  John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

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                  • #69
                    Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                    Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                    A large piece of the high cost of health care is all the advertising they do. Tell me truthfully, can you get through one day without hearing or seeing at least a dozen ads for some hospital, or drug, or hmo? How many billions do you think they spend a year.
                    Folks, just to give an idea about the cost of healthcare, the Gov. of Mass, recently rolled out budget recommandations:

                    Gov. Deval Patrick files $34.8 billion budget, balanced with tax increases that might be rejected | masslive.com

                    Almost half of a $34 billion dollar state budget goes towards health and human services, this is just one state alone. A small one at that. Imagine the full cost accross the country.

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                    • #70
                      Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                      Originally posted by tailgunner View Post
                      Well, it is a good thing I can't afford a family I guess. I would end up broke otherwise!
                      There is never quite enough money Tailgunner, so don't let that stop you from grabbing everything life has to offer. Best I can tell is we only go around once. Make it count because the years will pass. No regrets! Find a decent woman, have some kids and grow old.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                        I stand by what I said; The 2nd amendment was laid out in the bill of rights to give ordinary citizens the ability to protect themselves and stand up against against a tyrannical government. And "a well regulated militia" does not mean Gov. regulated (it would defeat the intent of the amendment)
                        When the people fear the government there is tyranny, when the government fears the people there is liberty.

                        BTW, might want to read this; New Pew Survey Finds Three-Quarters of Americans Don't Trust the Government

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                          Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                          Kid, I love my wife, but neither she nor I will live forever. I've buried a daughter. I know about loss, and I know it's heartbreaking to lose loved ones. I'm only alive today because modern medicine was able to save my life when I was a child, and I spent a long , long time in more than one hospital watching elderely people suffer. We don't respect life and we don't accept a natural death. There is a cost, a price to pay for prolonging life when it's past it's time. Don't fool yourself into thinking you are a better person than me because I am willing to admit our society is screwed up, medicine is far ahead of our ability to properly implement, and pay for it. Our desire to do what we think is good, is corrupting what we can afford to do without risking a worse outcome.
                          Frankie, When did I say anything about being a better person than you? Just cause I don't see eye to eye with your "Chicken Little" thoughts doesn't mean I am a better person or that I even indicated it. Less pessimistic, yes; better? I can't be the judge of that.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                            Originally posted by Pipestone Kid View Post
                            Mark, I agree that could be possible, but I don't think we should be stating as fact that it will happen. IF it happens, then it is time to fix it. It is just like the OP on this thread jumping to conclusions brought about by a bunch of rumors and outright falsehoods.
                            I think one of the biggest problems with Obamacare (Affordable Health Care Act) is the way it was sold to the American People. The only ones it will be affordable to is the 10% of the people who will now hsve it as an entitlement. I was reading an article which showed the projected cost of Heath Care for a family of five, based on the lowest tier coverage and the penalties the IRS would charge:

                            Example 3. Family without minimum essential coverage.
                            “(i) In 2016, Taxpayers H and J are married and file a joint return. H and J have three children: K, age 21, L, age 15, and M, age 10. No member of the family has minimum essential coverage for any month in 2016. H and J’s household income is $120,000. H and J’s applicable filing threshold is $24,000. The annual national average bronze plan premium for a family of 5 (2 adults, 3 children) is $20,000.
                            “(ii) For each month in 2016, under paragraphs (b)(2)(ii) and (b)(2)(iii) of this section, the applicable dollar amount is $2,780 (($695 x 3 adults) + (($695/2) x 2 children)). Under paragraph (b)(2)(i) of this section, the flat dollar amount is $2,085 (the lesser of $2,780 and $2,085 ($695 x 3)). Under paragraph (b)(3) of this section, the excess income amount is $2,400 (($120,000 – $24,000) x 0.025). Therefore, under paragraph (b)(1) of this section, the monthly penalty amount is $200 (the greater of $173.75 ($2,085/12) or $200 ($2,400/12)).
                            “(iii) The sum of the monthly penalty amounts is $2,400 ($200 x 12). The sum of the monthly national average bronze plan premiums is $20,000 ($20,000/12 x 12). Therefore, under paragraph (a) of this section, the shared responsibility payment imposed on H and J for 2016 is $2,400 (the lesser of $2,400 or $20,000)


                            Who in their right mind could have ever called this the Affordable Health Care Act? In my opinion, it was an ill conceived plan which was rushed though to a vote with little to no oversight of the drafters.

                            Matk
                            "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                            I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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                            • #74
                              Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                              Originally posted by johncameron View Post
                              I stand by what I said; The 2nd amendment was laid out in the bill of rights to give ordinary citizens the ability to protect themselves and stand up against against a tyrannical government. And "a well regulated militia" does not mean Gov. regulated (it would defeat the intent of the amendment)
                              When the people fear the government there is tyranny, when the government fears the people there is liberty.

                              BTW, might want to read this; New Pew Survey Finds Three-Quarters of Americans Don't Trust the Government

                              You may stand by what you said but what you sais is wrong and the Supreme Court has verified that on several occasions.
                              sigpic

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Tyrannical executive orders

                                Originally posted by Pipestone Kid View Post
                                Frankie, When did I say anything about being a better person than you? Just cause I don't see eye to eye with your "Chicken Little" thoughts doesn't mean I am a better person or that I even indicated it. Less pessimistic, yes; better? I can't be the judge of that.
                                Kid you see me as a pessimist, I consider myself a realist. I assume you think of yourself as a better person after that comment about what I would do if it was my wife dying, as if I'm a hypocrit or uncaring man. You don't accept any proof I offer, don't have what I consider an open mind to what is happening, but you are not alone in your thinking and neither am I.

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