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  • Re: Affordable Care Act

    I would like to see a society where the people that work hard and live within their means will reap what they sow and prosper. There is no incentive for the hard workers to work hard and save money because what savings they have toiled for is squandered on socialist leaches. If you are able to work and choose not to; you deserve to starve. I would have no problem working for peanuts if it means putting food on the table. I am quite generous with my personal donations to charity every year, but that is my decision. The government should not mandate me to do so.

    The Republicans spend too much on military expenses and foreign wars. They also are complicit with immigration reform because illegals translate into cheap labor which big business profit. Do not call them undocumented workers, they are illegal law breakers. Most other countries that have people sneak across the border are shot. What do we do? Sign them up for free stuff that we taxpayers pay for.

    The libertarian party is the only thing that will reel in big government waste and corruption. The government is supposed to be accountable to us not the other way around.

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    • Re: Affordable Care Act

      Yep, it's hard to be more hypocritical than the Republican Party. Defend illegal immigration or at the least look the other way so you can keep on making the big bucks off their labors. And the. They scratch their heads and wonder why their party is dying.

      I think every sane American would like to see a higher level of personal responsibility but people are people and as the population blooms the percentage of irresponsible becomes a defining factor in our economy and our society. Frustrated folks like Frankie are prone to throwing their hands up in despair and bemoaning the fate of the world but most folks keep on, keeping on and living their lives as best they know how. Fortunately the number of responsible folks will most likely always outweigh the others by s wide margin. The pessimist says "we have 17% unemployment". The optimists says we have 83% employment. Not bad but we can do better.
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      • Re: Affordable Care Act

        As I expected, no answers, no solutions, no plan, no ideas. I am a realist, only a delusional person would look at the numbers and imagine things working out well.

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        • Re: Affordable Care Act

          Somebody is laboring under the assumption that all radical ideas are good.

          Being radical is not enough to resemble the founders of this nation.

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          • Re: Affordable Care Act

            Republicans are hypocritical I agree, but Democrats are delusional. I agree it would be great to feed all the poor, house them, school them, pay for their insurance, heck pay for them to sit home and do nothing. But Can we afford to do so? If so who is paying for it?

            Continually raising the deb ceiling on the backs of our kids, raising taxes and entitlements and thinking its good for our economy or our country is simply delusional.

            Democrats seem to be the party of what can the government(other peoples money) do for me now and to hell with what happens down the road.

            The biggest dichotomy of the whole two party system is pitting Left vs Right or Red vs Blue instead of standing united as citizens (Both sides have good ideas) against government corruption and career politicians. No, It is all about posturing for political strength for my party and discrediting yours.

            Sadly, The reason most politicians run for congress is to get rich from insider information and helping their country is a distant second.

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            • Re: Affordable Care Act

              Both parties are hypocritical.

              It's almost comical that someone can be pro-choice in ending the life of a fetus but not pro-choice in allowing me to pick what size slurpy I want.

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              • Re: Affordable Care Act

                Well, I'm trying to do more and more homework on the ACA. Trying to prepare a Ridgidforum summary/report.

                It's interesting the formula created by what I assume are actuaries. However, it's very common for those creating these or government programs to not factor in the behaviors of humans and how they will react to things.

                Example: Watch and see people in lower wage occupations refuse a "normal" raise because it may bump them out of Medicaid.

                I look for that to happen a lot.

                Still reading and calculating......

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                • Re: Affordable Care Act

                  Bob, same thing happens when there is an amnesty program for illegals. There are plenty of illegals who have no interest in becoming citizens because it would negatively affect their finances.

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                  • Re: Affordable Care Act

                    BobsPlumbing,

                    I'm looking forward to your analysis.

                    You know there are a lot of us who don't see ourselves as "liberals", and I am one of those. I have always thought of myself as a "Conservative" up untill the last decade or go, when the "Conservative" label seemed to be brandished by those on, what I would call, the extreme right. I guess these are the "teapartiers" or those who have come to see themselves being taken advantage of. Sort of like "white supremists" feel about their race, or someone who sees themselves as really being better than others, but not being treated as such.

                    No question we are in debt and we are so in debt that it is scarey. But as I have pointed out before, historically we are far less in debt today, than we were in the late 1940's. I say that, because I consider debt in the light of 'ability to pay' it off. For example, a multi-millionair (or billionaire can sustain a much greater debt for a much larger time than someone making only $50K a year. In other words, it is all relative.

                    Today we have a debt of somewhere around 70% of GDP; and in the late 1940's, that debt was something in excess of 113% of GDP. Yet, we were able to work ourselves out of that debt, prosper considerably, and all but erase that debt by the late 1970's. It was only when Reagan, followed by Bush I and Bush II, that lowered the debt on corporate profits and those making considerable monies, did the debt reduction reverse itself. And it was at that time, that the middle class lost and the upper classes dramatically increase their incomes. It was at that time, that the middle class not only lost growth, but actually started to dwindle, with many sliding into being poor.

                    We cannot continue along that path and we certainly can't continue to greed that allows us to produce overseas as a means of increasing profits to those who control this nations future.

                    It isn't purely a matter of Red or Blue, or Right or Left or even Liberal and Conservative. It's a matter of recognizing what is good for the average citizens, the working class, of this country. We can't blame the poor with their hands out, because all too often it is the powerful who made them poor.

                    We need to think of that.

                    CWS

                    Comment


                    • Re: Affordable Care Act

                      Originally posted by CWSmith View Post
                      BobsPlumbing,

                      I'm looking forward to your analysis.

                      You know there are a lot of us who don't see ourselves as "liberals", and I am one of those. I have always thought of myself as a "Conservative" up untill the last decade or go, when the "Conservative" label seemed to be brandished by those on, what I would call, the extreme right. I guess these are the "teapartiers" or those who have come to see themselves being taken advantage of. Sort of like "white supremists" feel about their race, or someone who sees themselves as really being better than others, but not being treated as such.

                      No question we are in debt and we are so in debt that it is scarey. But as I have pointed out before, historically we are far less in debt today, than we were in the late 1940's. I say that, because I consider debt in the light of 'ability to pay' it off. For example, a multi-millionair (or billionaire can sustain a much greater debt for a much larger time than someone making only $50K a year. In other words, it is all relative.

                      Today we have a debt of somewhere around 70% of GDP; and in the late 1940's, that debt was something in excess of 113% of GDP. Yet, we were able to work ourselves out of that debt, prosper considerably, and all but erase that debt by the late 1970's. It was only when Reagan, followed by Bush I and Bush II, that lowered the debt on corporate profits and those making considerable monies, did the debt reduction reverse itself. And it was at that time, that the middle class lost and the upper classes dramatically increase their incomes. It was at that time, that the middle class not only lost growth, but actually started to dwindle, with many sliding into being poor.

                      We cannot continue along that path and we certainly can't continue to greed that allows us to produce overseas as a means of increasing profits to those who control this nations future.

                      It isn't purely a matter of Red or Blue, or Right or Left or even Liberal and Conservative. It's a matter of recognizing what is good for the average citizens, the working class, of this country. We can't blame the poor with their hands out, because all too often it is the powerful who made them poor.

                      We need to think of that.

                      CWS
                      CWS, intersting post with a lot of good points with which I agree. I still have not heard a single response to the question, "by what vehicle will we turn this economy around and employ the masses?". In the 40's we had manufacturing and supplied the world, today most of our consumer goods are made in communist china, mexico, etc. Unless there is some legislation to force punishing tarrifs, and trade limits we have no chance to bring manufacturing back. In my opinion at the moment there is no magic bullet as there was years ago, our economy is doomed as our consumer dollars leave never to return. There are plenty of folks who want to work, plenty who were good workers and had no control over their jobs leaving. The workers who lost their jobs were not "greedy" and they could not compete with the slave wages and lack of gov't oversight (EPA, OSHA), present in third world countries and communist countries. How do you or anyone propose we employ millions of Americans? Please don't embarrass yourself by saying green jobs, or clean burning coal! President Obama took care of those two options

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                      • Re: Affordable Care Act

                        I knew I had seen it somewhere else
                        Attached Files

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                        • Re: Affordable Care Act

                          Originally posted by rofl View Post
                          Both parties are hypocritical.

                          It's almost comical that someone can be pro-choice in ending the life of a fetus but not pro-choice in allowing me to pick what size slurpy I want.
                          You can only see your personal freedom in jeopardy but you never ask what the cost of your freedom is? Look into diabetes, the causes and the current epidemic. Then consider the cost of diabetes to the medical community, the insurance companies and finally, those that pay for insurance. Then let me know how you feel about the super sized slurpee.

                          If you think deeply about it you will come to realize that nothing is free. Your and my freedoms come at a real and tangible cost to everyone else. In short, as a society we have agreed to share the risk and we do it for the thousands of things we do and eat that may not be in our or our fellow citizens best interests. The question is "how much freedom and at what cost?"

                          Do you want to be safe or do you want to be free? You can't have either absolutely and you can't have both.

                          Btw for Frankie, abortion should be a no brainier. In fact it should be mandatory because it saves the taxpayer millions in welfare payments.
                          Last edited by NHMaster3015; 11-17-2013, 07:44 PM.
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                          • Re: Affordable Care Act

                            Nanny State.

                            Let's write tickets if people don't wear sunscreen....skin cancer risk.
                            How about kids staring at the sun. We should take them away from their parents.
                            Skateboards? Deathboards!

                            Where does it stop? It doesn't.

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                            • Re: Affordable Care Act

                              You're right, it doesn't, the list is pretty much endless but again, at what cost? And you have to ask that because there is always a cost. So you might be willing to let joe drink himself to death in his own house but you damn sure don't want him on the roads. But if you discourage folks from drinking, alcohol production drops, bars and restaurants suffer, folks are out of jobs. See why the answers Frankie is so desperately searching for just are not there. Too many variables. Freedom will always be a balance between what we want and what we are willing to risk for it.
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                              • Re: Affordable Care Act

                                Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                                You can only see your personal freedom in jeopardy but you never ask what the cost of your freedom is? Look into diabetes, the causes and the current epidemic. Then consider the cost of diabetes to the medical community, the insurance companies and finally, those that pay for insurance. Then let me know how you feel about the super sized slurpee.

                                If you think deeply about it you will come to realize that nothing is free. Your and my freedoms come at a real and tangible cost to everyone else. In short, as a society we have agreed to share the risk and we do it for the thousands of things we do and eat that may not be in our or our fellow citizens best interests. The question is "how much freedom and at what cost?"

                                Do you want to be safe or do you want to be free? You can't have either absolutely and you can't have both.

                                Btw for Frankie, abortion should be a no brainier. In fact it should be mandatory because it saves the taxpayer millions in welfare payments.
                                NHM, you are still incapable of a response to my post(s). When you are not insulting, you are changing the subject as seen above. Not only should abortion be mandatory in some cases, so should birth control in the form of sterilization and vasectomy. A national DNA database to find the men who impregnate the women who can't support the children to whom they give birth. Find the fathers and render them harmless There you go NHM, you can now have the discussion you want rather than the one you can't answer. You can relax, no one will ask you to figure things out, offer solutions, or plans. You don't have to do the math and describe how we can pay for the entitlements, you won't have to deal with the 17 trillion dollar debt you seem to think is a none issue. What's next to avoid the doom?

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