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  • #61
    Re: Affordable Care Act

    Nothing will be solved here except becoming angrier and hate each other!
    The verbal volleyball game needs to cease!

    How about we take this debate back to the folks in DC and send them the stuff we are writing here
    They have no clue..BOTH SIDES are totally out of touch with reality.
    We are fighting over propaganda from the internet and news media..again both sides.
    How can we have a discussion about a 2000 page law with only 30 second sound bites?

    Have you all read it? Have you read all the other crap they are putting out? I suspect
    most of us are too busy trying to feed our families and pay bills [stay within our budget]
    than spend days reading lawyer double speak designed to screw us all!

    When was the last time any of them bought gas or a gallon of milk!
    Did yard work or changed the empty toilet paper roll in the bathroom?

    The political class of today have lost their charge which is service to the country!
    And us poor folks are the country and they are not doing us any service.

    They screwed up our education system!
    They screwed up our energy system!
    They screwed up our lumber industry!
    They screwed up building codes and product quality!
    They put us in danger in countries we should have allowed to destroy themselves!
    The IRS and federal reserve are totally out of control!
    We pay blood money to Syria, Egypt..etc
    We treat illegal aliens better than our military!

    How about we throw the bums out, find some real leaders
    and return to basic constitutional processes

    Let's lock out lobbyists and kick them out too! No where in the constitution are they mentioned!!!

    Will this anger some of you here? absolutely! will some of you yell "atta-boy" probably

    I am a conservative, and proud of it. I am seriously fearful of what's happening
    in Washington...and our country and way of life!

    How dare the president lock out the war memorials!!!! That's just going way too far!
    We the American public own that and he has no authority to keep us citizens from our
    landmarks!

    I can't wait for ob to send the army corps of engineers to fill in the grand canyon
    just to spite us!

    what the hell is wrong with you people?

    Liberal, conservative, We are still all Americans We can find a solution.

    It's the kool aid drinkers, loons, progressives, Marxist, illegals aliens, sol olinsky wanna bees that need
    to be purged from our country and let us regain control

    aarrrgh! Now stop fighting and contact your congressmen

    I have begun to stop doing business with companies that say "for English press one"
    I can't seem to find any business that says for Navaho press three!
    Spanish is not our language nor second language..we have hundreds of wonderful
    people here legally who speak other languages but when they come here they
    strive to speak English..the Spanish speaking folks should learn English!

    When I'm in Mexico I need to speak Spanish

    I dislike Home Depot having Spanish language announcements in their stores
    Arizona is not a Spanish speaking country we speak English
    I have found Lowe's slightly better....and I have not been in a Home Depot for a while now

    I guess that's my silent war!

    Cactus Man
    Last edited by cactusman; 10-11-2013, 11:22 PM.

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: Affordable Care Act

      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
      Looks like the regressives finally got their sit down with the President last night. .
      .
      from your statement I am guessing you think the dems and the moderate republicans are "Progressive".
      two questions,

      can you tell me how as a people, a nation, or an economy, we have "progressed" in the last 5 years, or the last 10 years?

      and why do you call some one who want this country to stand on the constitution of the land, a regressive? they took an oath to protect when sworn in to congress.

      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

      (the budget process has defunded many or reduced spending on many area that are in existence). have you heard of the thing called sequester? for a recent large defunding,

      and if you actually believe that the ACA will benefit the US or it population, in it entirety please inform me how,

      (I have a problem with the government taking control of another 1/7 of the economy and then in control of you life via health care, (from birth to death), is that freedom or truly constructional ( remember if it is a fine it is not constructional but if it is a tax it is), or good?

      the purpose of ACA is not health care, but control of people and the economy.

      If I recall correctly you talked about your insurance costing 22,000 a year, In my area there are many who do not make 22,000 a year,

      and on what I have read is the lower levels of the plans you have some where in the 5 to 10,000 deductible a year, well if you have low income and still have a$ 5 to 10.000 deductible your still broke, and bankrupted.

      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

      First I am not saying we do not need affordable health care, but this is not the way to do it.
      just to require a system of insurance to cover the exploited costs, is not a good way.
      one needs to change the nature of the beast to bring cost in line with other segments of the economy, there should not be 1 to 1000 lopsidededness in the rates, or even a 1 to 100.

      how does that even come in to existence, a person making $25 gets charged $25,000 for a hour of care in an emergency room? for a reasonable simple need.

      why do drugs given a hospital inflated 10 to 20 times over the pharmacy down town,
      or an ace bandage costing $20 in hospital situation instead of the $2 at Walgreens,

      If the system was rebalanced, there would not need to the need for "mandatory health insurance" and your insurance would not be costing $22000 a year, (that money could actually go in to your teaching program or your pocket,

      If you want progress, Then push to get the congress to do the right thing kill this bill and go about it correctly, LOWER THE COST OF HEALTH CARE.
      Last edited by BHD; 10-12-2013, 11:27 AM.
      Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
      attributed to Samuel Johnson
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Affordable Care Act

        Hospitals use creative accounting.

        when medicare and some insurance companies pay pennies on the dollar
        and when hospitals pick up the tab for illegal aliens

        they fudge the billing....to make up the short fall
        If you offer to pay "cash" you get different pricing

        Hospitals even those "non-profits" still need to meet
        their expenses and payroll.

        Years ago the government introduced "DRGs" these were flat rate prices for
        procedures etc. This is similar to what your mechanic uses to estimate labor
        time. [DRG diagnostic related group]

        So..say a hernia has a DRG of $7500.00 that's all the hospital will get.
        If they do it for $5000.00 they have a surplus, If complications occur and
        they spend $9500.00 they lose $2000.00....

        Now they need to make up the $2000.00 loss somewhere!

        Think of this as the $500.00 toilet seat at the pentagon

        Today I'm sure the billing and accounting has become even more convoluted.

        Cactus Man

        Comment


        • #64
          Re: Affordable Care Act

          may be if the government got out of health care,
          It would not be so expensive, our hospital when built in the 60's had about 3 offices for administration and book keeping, now to meet government regulations, they took over one floor of the nursing home care, and use it now for offices, to push government paper work. my guess is a 5 to 6 fold increases in office size and staff,

          and now they want more government intervention.

          when Medicare and some insurance companies pay pennies on the dollar
          and when hospitals pick up the tab for illegal aliens
          then why is not the government paying what it costs? and why are not insurance companies? and it is the responsibility of the lower incomes level people to pick up the losses,
          sure makes sense to me,

          and when you pad the bills at what once was such one could pay for, has risen to such an extent that no one can pay for it,
          ever one need to pay the same, not this mulii tier of billing, next time you clean a drain for a hospital try to recover all your costs for your poor decisions, under billing and non payment, fair is fair, a $23,000 to clear a drain sounds about right, beside you had to use the "reverse auger" and that it a very expensive item,

          a poor person wanting to take care of there own can not because of the frad in the billing practices,

          If there Illegal then bill the government from which they came from, or take it out of there AID packages the Goverment sends them.

          A patient in Illinois was charged $12,712 for cataract surgery. Medicare pays $675 for the same procedure. In California, a patient was charged $20,120 for a knee operation for which Medicare pays $584. And a New Jersey patient was charged $72,000 for a spinal fusion procedure that Medicare covers for $1,629.
          www.medicalcostadvocate.com » outrageous healthcare charges
          a lot more at the article.
          Last edited by BHD; 10-12-2013, 01:31 PM.
          Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
          attributed to Samuel Johnson
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: Affordable Care Act

            Interesting
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: Affordable Care Act

              Originally posted by rofl View Post
              Interesting
              I think I tried to point this out in this discussion.
              Last edited by BHD; 10-13-2013, 12:56 AM.
              Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
              attributed to Samuel Johnson
              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Affordable Care Act

                Wow, excellent posts guys. I wish some of these points would make it to the main stream media.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Affordable Care Act

                  [QUOTE=BHD;406383]from your statement I am guessing you think the dems and the moderate republicans are "Progressive".
                  two questions,

                  can you tell me how as a people, a nation, or an economy, we have "progressed" in the last 5 years, or the last 10 years?

                  and why do you call some one who want this country to stand on the constitution of the land, a regressive? they took an oath to protect when sworn in to congress.

                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                  better to ask how we have progressed in the past hundred years. Women and minorities can vote. Blacks are not segregated, women have the right to choose, monopolies are gone, children aren't working in sweat shops, labor unions fight for fair employment, ...... I could do this all day long LOL

                  They do take an oath. Whether they understand what that oath means or for that matter what the constitution says is open to argument though LOL


                  Maybe though I should stop calling them regressives. Maybe that's not fair. I think I'll call them the chicken little party instead. The whole problem with the chicken littles is that they have painted themselves as the can't be done, party of no, the sky is falling, doom and gloom. Nothing will ever change unless attitudes change. If they want to get back in the game all they have to do is quit their six year whine festival, roll up their sleeves and get something done that isn't politically expedient.
                  sigpic

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Affordable Care Act

                    NHM, have you ever considered that the "regresives" as you like to call them, are doing exactly what the people that voted them in wanted? And if it wasn't for those "regressive" in the past, all your "progressive" achievements never would have happened. If the old school democrats would have gotten their way, minorities would be still seperated. I am sick and tired of bafoons like you and the morons on the left that call us that consider ourselves conservative or libertarian as racist and "regressive" as you like to say. The truth is, we want to be left alone, and allow people the freedom to succeed AND fail. And giving a party that has finally said "no" a hard time is pretty pathetic. They are finally acting like the adult that tells the spoiled brat that enough is enough, and its time for fiscal change. Although I don't think they are going far enough, its a start. Oh, and your comment on the lack of monopolies is laughable at best... open your eyes, they are worse today than they were back in the days of "ma-bell". They just hide in the shadows of the stock market...

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Affordable Care Act

                      Ok, now explain in detail the conservative platform and just exactly how you plan to be "left alone".

                      You want government out of your lives but all hell breaks loose when the government wants to shut down military bases in your back yard or cut back on services and personnel. You want smaller government but you have no problem spending billions to build fences and hire thousands to patrol them along the border. You want smaller government but you don't mind the 40% of your tax dollars being spent to run the military. You want smaller government but you have no problem with the government illegally spending a few billion dollars annually to support religious institutions and personnel in the military.....what a joke your Conservative party is and that's the reason why when you think the few chicken littles that were voted in that there is a mandate for them to do something. Well my friend they certainly have done something. They have showed the majority of the voters in this country what's bunch of hypocritical, self serving ignoramuses they really are.

                      Show me a single time in the history of the world when conservative policies have benefited anyone other than big business which BTW, while you speak of Wall Street monopolies is exactly what your pathetic party is fighting for.

                      conservative, what a joke. Note how many conservative, red states suck the most from the government teat LOL. Texas being at the top of the list BTW. Maybe we should stop providing services and infrastructure for conservatives that want to be left alone.
                      sigpic

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Affordable Care Act

                        at least the military is constitutional responsibility of the federal government, it is what it is suppose to be doing,

                        the basic powere deligated to the federal government via the constution all other items are to be handled by the state.

                        Below are two different explanations, both showing the same thing, and If you do not think what is posted below is correct then get a copy of the constitution and read it for your self,

                        The Constitution’s Preamble says the federal government was established (and the Constitution was adopted) to “form a more perfect union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquillity, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity.”

                        The Constitution’s articles, and the subsequent Amendments, specify the prerogatives of the Feds. They are listed in Article I, Sec. 8; Articles II-V; Amendments XIII-XVI, XIX-XX, XXIII-XXVI. These prerogatives belong to one of the following categories:

                        1) Defense, war prosecution, peace, foreign relations, foreign commerce, and interstate commerce;

                        2) The protection of citizens’ constitutional rights (e.g the right to vote) and ensuring that slavery remains illegal;

                        3) Establishing federal courts inferior to the SCOTUS;

                        4) Copyright protection;

                        5) Coining money;

                        6) Establishing post offices and post roads;

                        7) Establishing a national set of universal weights and measures;

                        8 ) Taxation needed to raise revenue to perform these essential functions.

                        Those are the only prerogatives of the Feds. The Tenth Amendment states that all prerogatives not explicitly given to the Federal Government, nor prohibited of the states, are reserved to the states or to the people (i.e. individual Americans). So the Feds are not allowed to handle any issues not explicitly listed in the Constitution; their prerogatives are limited to what the Constitution explicitly states.

                        James Madison, the principal original author of that document’s original text who also wrote the first 10 Amendments, wrote in the Federalist Papers that “The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite.”
                        Section 8

                        The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

                        To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

                        To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

                        To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

                        To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

                        To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

                        To establish Post Offices and post Roads;

                        To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

                        To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

                        To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;

                        To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

                        To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

                        To provide and maintain a Navy;

                        To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

                        To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

                        To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

                        To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings; — And

                        To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.
                        Last edited by BHD; 10-13-2013, 04:17 PM.
                        Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                        "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                        attributed to Samuel Johnson
                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                        PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Affordable Care Act

                          Ok, now explain in detail the conservative platform and just exactly how you plan to be "left alone".

                          You want government out of your lives but all hell breaks loose when the government wants to shut down military bases in your back yard or cut back on services and personnel.
                          Doesn't bother me if the military complex is reduced.
                          You want smaller government but you have no problem spending billions to build fences and hire thousands to patrol them along the border.
                          Don't know if I want them or not. Probably could be built and patrolled for billions less if the government is not involved though. Too bad we have those pesky borders & immigration laws.
                          You want smaller government but you don't mind the 40% of your tax dollars being spent to run the military.
                          Again, I don't mind a decrease in the military complex.
                          You want smaller government but you have no problem with the government illegally spending a few billion dollars annually to support religious institutions and personnel in the military.....
                          You said it. Illegal spending. Stop it! what a joke your Conservative party is and that's the reason why when you think the few chicken littles that were voted in that there is a mandate for them to do something. Well my friend they certainly have done something. They have showed the majority of the voters in this country what's bunch of hypocritical, self serving ignoramuses they really are.
                          The majority of those in elected & appointed positions could be considered hypocritical & self serving. Both sides.

                          Show me a single time in the history of the world when conservative policies have benefited anyone other than big business which BTW, while you speak of Wall Street monopolies is exactly what your pathetic party is fighting for.
                          All parties & individuals will typically "fight" for their interests. That's why everyone here is communicating. Think about it.

                          conservative, what a joke. Note how many conservative, red states suck the most from the government teat LOL. Texas being at the top of the list BTW. Maybe we should stop providing services and infrastructure for conservatives that want to be left alone.
                          No, we should decrease providing many of the services and infrastructure to all.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Affordable Care Act

                            LOWER THE COST OF HEALTH CARE.
                            But to do as you say, which I agree a wzy needs to be looked for if possible, will probably require some form of price controls. We did away with price controls many years ago for a number of day-to-day expenses, though while not required to live, are pretty hard to do without in todays world. Telephones (not cell phones) are one. You can certaintly survive w/o one, but sure makes life easier. Yet we deregulated the telephone system, and things changed, in mnay ways form the good and in some not so good. If we took free enterprise out of the health care equation, who do you think would be crying the loudest? One thing that has happened as part of the ACA was the requirement that HMOs must put something like 80% of premiums back into health care and not multi-million dollar saleries and bonuses and millions in advertising, both of which benefit no one from a health quality standpoint.

                            I don't understand the need for so many hospitals to do all the advertising that they do. They're so big now that they have bought each other up and merged into the huge regional health systems, at lezst around here, that they have no competition, so why advertise. Around me there used to be 6 hospitals within the 2 counties, 10 years later and they are now all under one name. So you have no choice but to go to one of their hospitals unless you want to travel 40 miles to Philly or 35 miles to Delaware hospitals. They've also signed up many doctors too.

                            Another part of the problem is the VA. Anyone herehow they are pushing drugs at our vets ant really treating their problems. Some have died from being overdosed. I suspect that many vets look at doctors from their military perspective, where doctors are officers and to be obeyed. Hard for some to turn that off when they get home, so they do what ever they are told by the doc. If he says you needs to take all these drugs then you do it, no questions asked. And I think the drug companies and some doctors take advantage of that. Need to follow the money and see how these VA doctors are benefiting from all these unnecessary perscriptions. So what does the VA have to do with you you might ask. You're paying for it as partof the military budgetin your taxes.


                            It might help many to read an overview of what the whole legislation is about, it's more than forcing people to sign up for health care.





                            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient...dable_Care_Act
                            Last edited by Bob D.; 10-13-2013, 05:00 PM.
                            ---------------
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                            ---------------
                            “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                            ---------
                            "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
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                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Affordable Care Act

                              Originally posted by Plumber Punky View Post
                              My last hospital bill was a week's stay for $19,000. It's been paid.

                              No one says you're obligated to take the 'reasonably priced drugs' that are prescribed. I'm not a huge drug fan nor believe that most are really required. I'll sign any waiver as soon as a waiver is required for all the people who have already entitlements such as welfare.

                              What kind of a retard would sue someone else for something he himself caused?

                              I dont ask for anything from anyone nor do I expect to be forced to pay for something I dont want. I pay all my stuff, in full and on time. The gubment should just leave me the hell alone. Maybe I'll just work for $1 a year and then become an entitlement folk. It works for those lazies so why cant it work for me...
                              I recently went through the Blue Cross website and filled out the information they ask for an online quote of plans. One of the lowest offered for myself was $58.00/month with basically a $20,000.00 deductible before anything is paid. Might be for you since you're getting forced to purchase something or pay a fine.

                              A real high deductible before insurance kicks in. Just some info for anyone.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Affordable Care Act

                                Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                                But to do as you say, which I agree a wzy needs to be looked for if possible, will probably require some form of price controls. We did away with price controls many years ago for a number of day-to-day expenses, though while not required to live, are pretty hard to do without in todays world. Telephones (not cell phones) are one. You can certaintly survive w/o one, but sure makes life easier. Yet we deregulated the telephone system, and things changed, in mnay ways form the good and in some not so good. If we took free enterprise out of the health care equation, who do you think would be crying the loudest? One thing that has happened as part of the ACA was the requirement that HMOs must put something like 80% of premiums back into health care and not multi-million dollar saleries and bonuses and millions in advertising, both of which benefit no one from a health quality standpoint.

                                I don't understand the need for so many hospitals to do all the advertising that they do. They're so big now that they have bought each other up and merged into the huge regional health systems, at lezst around here, that they have no competition, so why advertise. Around me there used to be 6 hospitals within the 2 counties, 10 years later and they are now all under one name. So you have no choice but to go to one of their hospitals unless you want to travel 40 miles to Philly or 35 miles to Delaware hospitals. They've also signed up many doctors too.

                                Another part of the problem is the VA. Anyone herehow they are pushing drugs at our vets ant really treating their problems. Some have died from being overdosed. I suspect that many vets look at doctors from their military perspective, where doctors are officers and to be obeyed. Hard for some to turn that off when they get home, so they do what ever they are told by the doc. If he says you needs to take all these drugs then you do it, no questions asked. And I think the drug companies and some doctors take advantage of that. Need to follow the money and see how these VA doctors are benefiting from all these unnecessary perscriptions. So what does the VA have to do with you you might ask. You're paying for it as partof the military budgetin your taxes.
                                I've been to hospitals with different people many times over the last few years. One of my best friends also works with one of the most reknowned doctors of geriatric medicine in the United States. A few things that I've found is:

                                1) Emergency Rooms suck. Their triage can be horrible. Yes I've been to more than one. And not just on a Saturday night at 11:00 p.m. (something magical about those hours in ER's). I've sat for hours with people visibly writhing in pain and moaning. Not just 1 hour. Not just 2 hours. 6, 8, 10+ hours. Almost incoherent and at times begging God to take them. In a chair in the waiting room.

                                2) It is common for an ER to be a operated by a private company not affiliated with the adjoining hospital at all. That's right, all those people in ER do not work for the hospital you are at. There is an inherent miscommunication and conflict of interest that will always occur with this system in my opinion.

                                3) The majority of people should not be in the ER. I dare say 90% should not be allowed to even enter. I know everyone is saying they are going there because it is "free" and that's what causes it. Could be 100% true. I think there should be a doctor, nurse and a couple of security guards right at a front vestibule to determine if you enter or not. Let the lawsuits fall where they may.

                                4) From talking to some nurses, ALL hospitals in my state are supposed to quietly fall under 4 entities in the coming years. It will just be a 20 second snippet on the news here & there while small local hospitals are taken over.

                                5) There is a special place in hell for drug companies. Constantly tweaking patents that run out with one millionth of a gram of sodium. Then beginning a campaign about basically the same drug stating"Ask your doctor about miloxydylx".

                                AND their representatives that are statistically a beautiful model like woman. Couldn't be because the majority of doctors are still men could it? Nah....

                                Paid a high salary and given a German car to push their dope. Always catering lunch too from one of the nicer local places. They are just as culpable in the grand scheme. Either that or so stupid they shouldn't be allowed to sell drugs.
                                Last edited by BobsPlumbing; 10-13-2013, 05:19 PM.

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