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  • #76
    Re: Affordable Care Act

    The only ways to truly lower the cost of healthcare are to change the rules. Let's grandfather in everyone currently 60 and over (coincidence that I fall into that group, please don't be a hater). Everyone else must eat properly, exercise and maintain a healthy mass body index. Absolutely, no smoking, drinking of alcohol or drug use! This does not apply to my group Enact a moratorium of 5 years during which time there will be no chemotherapy, no kidney dialysis, no transplants. Absolutely no nonemergency treatment for illegals, immediate deportation!
    Does all this sound cruel, ridiculous? If so, just accept that healthcare cannot be made "affordable". Healthcare will be provided under the new law, but it will not be affordable. Just as NHM says our economy is faith based, have faith that healthcare will be provided without sufficient funding. "Faith, hope and charity", you can take that to the bank! Oh, wait, you can't !

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    • #77
      Re: Affordable Care Act

      Healthcare is the only business that has not been truly subjected to the rules of Capitalism.

      Healthcare can be made affordable. Know how?

      Outlaw insurance. You do this and you will see everything associated with it's costs drop astronomically. The mistake people make is trying to make an analysis between the two. "Well, if there is no insurance, you can't pay for that $500,000.00 open heart surgery and will die."

      Wrong. The open heart surgery costs will drop to maybe $50,000.00 and a payment plan. Maybe even lower. The reason x operation is $500,000.00 is because insurance is involved.

      Now, I'm not completely stupid. This won't happen because insurance is based on fear. And the majority of people fear dying, especially outside of their own terms, more than anything else. The higher the fear, the higher the costs.

      The only other way to "solve" the healthcare problems in the U.S. seems to be to adopt the model of national healthcare similar to Canada, Australia, etc.

      This current scheme of forcing citizens to purchase from private entities or be penalized by the government just seems like a mess & unconstitutional.

      That or some sort of scheme for more taxes in the form of "medical penalties" to be re-appropriated in the middle of the night.

      Comment


      • #78
        Re: Affordable Care Act

        The current health care system is too far gone with an entire industry devoted to processing claims!
        We are a society of very unhealthy people who do not eat well or exercise. We have more sick people living longer, and more elderly people being kept alive at a tremendous cost. I think it's foolish to ignore all these contributing factors which make healthcare for all, or "affordable" healthcare a farce. People need to take better care of themselves, some must do without costly medical treatment, and unforunately some must die. The money was not there to fund the wars, fund the entitlements, or this healthcare law. There are more people unemployed, more people working part time, low paying jobs, and more people using entitlements. Our economy is not making a comeback, can't make a come back and has no logical process by which to turn this titanic around. Folks who choose to regurgitate history, ignore the perfect storm taking place. We are not seeing a cycle here, we are in uncharted territory.

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        • #79
          Re: Affordable Care Act

          More and more are sick of it.

          Maine doctor cuts prices in half by refusing health insurance - UPI.com
          A Portland, Maine, physician announced on April 1 that he would cut the middle man and deal directly with his patients, no longer accepting insurance in any form."I’ve been able to cut my prices in half because my overhead will be so much less," Dr. Michael Ciampi told the Bangor Daily News. Before, Ciampi charged an existing patient $160 for an office visit addressing one or more complicated health problems. Now, he charges $75.
          Ciampi lost a few hundred of his 2,000 patients who had insurance and didn't want to deal with the hassle of paperwork for reimbursement, but he expects to make up the loss by attracting the self-employed, the young and others without insurance or with prohibitively high deductibles.
          Now that he no longer accepts any form of private or government-sponsored insurance, he posts prices on his website, payable at the end of the visit. Patients with an earache or strep throat could spend $300 at their local hospital emergency room, or promptly get an appointment at his office and pay $50.
          "I’m freed up to do what I think is right for the patients," Ciampi said. That includes making house calls and negotiating lower prices for patients with financial difficulty.
          Gordon Smith, a spokesman for the Maine Medical Association, wasn't so sure, expressing concern for patients who rely on Medicare and Medicaid.
          But Ciampi believes more doctors are likely to follow suit and cut out insurance entirely, even opening “concierge practices” in which patients pay to keep a doctor on retainer.
          “If more doctors were able to do this, that would be real health care reform,” he said. “That’s when we’d see the cost of medicine truly go down.”




          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEeeUPygHY0

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          • #80
            Re: Affordable Care Act

            Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
            The current health care system is too far gone with an entire industry devoted to processing claims!
            We are a society of very unhealthy people who do not eat well or exercise. We have more sick people living longer, and more elderly people being kept alive at a tremendous cost. I think it's foolish to ignore all these contributing factors which make healthcare for all, or "affordable" healthcare a farce. People need to take better care of themselves, some must do without costly medical treatment, and unforunately some must die. The money was not there to fund the wars, fund the entitlements, or this healthcare law. There are more people unemployed, more people working part time, low paying jobs, and more people using entitlements. Our economy is not making a comeback, can't make a come back and has no logical process by which to turn this titanic around. Folks who choose to regurgitate history, ignore the perfect storm taking place. We are not seeing a cycle here, we are in uncharted territory.
            Many good points in there Frank. One example; look at schools letting big business in to push their products like soda and other unhealthy junk.
            "It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?" Bob D. 2006

            https://www.youtube.com/user/PowerToolInstitute

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            • #81
              Re: Affordable Care Act

              I haven't waded through the lengthy responses totally, but I hope someone has mentioned malpractice insurance being a significant reason for high costs. Hospitals are sued constantly. A fair amount being frivolous.

              Comment


              • #82
                Re: Affordable Care Act

                Originally posted by rofl View Post
                I haven't waded through the lengthy responses totally, but I hope someone has mentioned malpractice insurance being a significant reason for high costs. Hospitals are sued constantly. A fair amount being frivolous.
                Good point and yet another thing that has gotten way out of hand. A better system of compensation for legitimate malpractice should have been put in place. The system allowed, encouraged and rewarded frivolous and fradulent lawsuits. Sadly, there needed or needs to be caps on awards and probably stricter monitoring of bad healtchare practicioners and facilities. The system now allows bad doctors and hospitals to keep hurting patients if they can afford the premiums. My use of the word "afford" does not mean incurring more debt to people who have faith they will be paid someday. I mean medical professionals and facilities that pay with real money, to keep making real money!

                Comment


                • #83
                  Re: Affordable Care Act

                  As long as the congress is filled with lawyers you can forget all about torte reform. Ain't gonna happen. Should happen, but won't.
                  sigpic

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Re: Affordable Care Act

                    Originally posted by rofl View Post
                    I haven't waded through the lengthy responses totally, but I hope someone has mentioned malpractice insurance being a significant reason for high costs. Hospitals are sued constantly. A fair amount being frivolous.
                    Its not just medical malpractice, it happens elsewhere too. Another piece of the problem is the juries who make these outrageous awards some times.
                    "It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?" Bob D. 2006

                    https://www.youtube.com/user/PowerToolInstitute

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Re: Affordable Care Act

                      Poor Richard's News - VIDEO: Dave Ramsey lays out the facts of Obamacare for both Democrats and Republicans

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Re: Affordable Care Act

                        Originally posted by BobsPlumbing View Post
                        Healthcare is the only business that has not been truly subjected to the rules of Capitalism.

                        Healthcare can be made affordable. Know how?

                        Outlaw insurance. You do this and you will see everything associated with it's costs drop astronomically. The mistake people make is trying to make an analysis between the two. "Well, if there is no insurance, you can't pay for that $500,000.00 open heart surgery and will die."

                        Wrong. The open heart surgery costs will drop to maybe $50,000.00 and a payment plan. Maybe even lower. The reason x operation is $500,000.00 is because insurance is involved.
                        Like the famous joke of why a dog licks himself, prices are high because they CAN be high. No sane person would pay $500k for heart surgery, but a lot more would pay far less.

                        People also have to get out of their minds the idea that every little ailment they can think of requires a visit to the doctor. It would not surprise me if people watching TV hear about some prescription for joint pain and they pester their doc (which drives up medical costs)...simply at the suggestion from the commercial.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Re: Affordable Care Act

                          Originally posted by JoePolvino View Post
                          Like the famous joke of why a dog licks himself, prices are high because they CAN be high. No sane person would pay $500k for heart surgery, but a lot more would pay far less.

                          People also have to get out of their minds the idea that every little ailment they can think of requires a visit to the doctor. It would not surprise me if people watching TV hear about some prescription for joint pain and they pester their doc (which drives up medical costs)...simply at the suggestion from the commercial.
                          I know this to be true for a fact based on information from my friends' experiences in the medical field.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Re: Affordable Care Act

                            Originally posted by BobsPlumbing View Post
                            I know this to be true for a fact based on information from my friends' experiences in the medical field.
                            Unfortunately, people are not going to get "it" out of their heads because it is constantly drummed into their heads. People are also not going to eat healthy and exercise unless there is some system of punishment and reward. Deny healthcare for folks who abuse themselves and lower costs for those who do the right things. That won't happen, so keep smoking, drinking, over eating and then sitting on your butt.
                            I repeat, we are doomed! Just kidding, according to the President he is back to work fixing the economy.

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                            • #89
                              Re: Affordable Care Act

                              Doomed I tell you doomed.............dooooooooooomed
                              sigpic

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                              • #90
                                Re: Affordable Care Act

                                Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                                Doomed I tell you doomed.............dooooooooooomed
                                Now you're making sense.

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