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  • #91
    Re: Affordable Care Act

    Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
    Unfortunately, people are not going to get "it" out of their heads because it is constantly drummed into their heads. People are also not going to eat healthy and exercise unless there is some system of punishment and reward. Deny healthcare for folks who abuse themselves and lower costs for those who do the right things. That won't happen, so keep smoking, drinking, over eating and then sitting on your butt.
    I repeat, we are doomed! Just kidding, according to the President he is back to work fixing the economy.
    So who is going to administer this punishment you speak of? Doesn't smell like a smaller, less invasive government to me.

    And if they did you would be OK with this control over your life style? I'm pretty sure you wouldn't.
    You'd want to control that aspect of your life and your kids for yourself, as we all do and rightly so.

    As long as big business can push their soda pop and other junk food in schools, and thereby program kids (along with repeat ads delivered during kids TV program slots) into the type of adult consumer they desire, we will never win this battle.
    ---------------
    Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
    ---------------
    “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
    ---------
    "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
    ---------
    sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

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    • #92
      Re: Affordable Care Act

      Bob, my point is that government can't and won't push such an agenda and people on their own won't eat healthy and exercise. The result is a drastic situation of illnesses that our society cannot afford to treat. We had big arguments locally to get the junk out of the schools, and we won! Our major adversary was a republican legislator who I won't name, he stood up for big business, not the welfare of the kids!
      I'm not for smaller government, I'm for what works, and healthcare for all in this economy and with this lazy, overweight society is doomed.

      Comment


      • #93
        Re: Affordable Care Act

        Look at the push back Bloomberg got over super sized soda. Then look at where the push back came from. Yep, the usual bunch of suspects lead by their fearless leaders Limbaugh, Beck and Hanity. You see, there is an entire sector of the population that can afford to eat healthy. They have the extra cash to b able to afford range raised, grass fed cattle and poultry. They can shell out the extra for organically grown fruits and vegetables and not only that, they can afford to go to the gym, have life and health coaches and access to information and facilities. Then there is that whole, much larger sector of the population that is not so fortunate. The inner city kids who's mom doesn't have either the money, time or transportation so they wind up eating processed crap that stunts their growth and cognitive function. But hey, it's their own fault for having poor parents.
        sigpic

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        • #94
          Re: Affordable Care Act

          Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
          Look at the push back Bloomberg got over super sized soda. Then look at where the push back came from. Yep, the usual bunch of suspects lead by their fearless leaders Limbaugh, Beck and Hanity. You see, there is an entire sector of the population that can afford to eat healthy. They have the extra cash to b able to afford range raised, grass fed cattle and poultry. They can shell out the extra for organically grown fruits and vegetables and not only that, they can afford to go to the gym, have life and health coaches and access to information and facilities. Then there is that whole, much larger sector of the population that is not so fortunate. The inner city kids who's mom doesn't have either the money, time or transportation so they wind up eating processed crap that stunts their growth and cognitive function. But hey, it's their own fault for having poor parents.
          In the true American way, and since I gave up soft drinks 4-months ago, I believe all soft drinks should be heavily taxed just like cigarettes. When abused they have been proven to be bad for your health.

          Mark
          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

          Comment


          • #95
            Re: Affordable Care Act

            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
            You see, there is an entire sector of the population that can afford to eat healthy. They have the extra cash to b able to afford range raised, grass fed cattle and poultry. They can shell out the extra for organically grown fruits and vegetables and not only that, they can afford to go to the gym, Then there is that whole, much larger sector of the population that is not so fortunate. The inner city kids who's mom doesn't have either the money, time or transportation so they wind up eating processed crap that stunts their growth and cognitive function. .
            I do not think it is a mater of affordability, yes it cost more to buy organic over conventional product, but IMO I do not think there is that much difference from organic and modern produced, product, (I will take some objecting to GMO), if one buys basically base foods, potatoes, beans, meats, and so on, instead of pre/ packaged made foods that are microwavable and are snack type foods, (yes it take time to prepaire), I get they would cut there costs, by 2/3' and improve there diets 100% I am not suggesting vetagerin diets, but there is good protein is in peas, beans, and other legumes, if meats are to costly, but chicken and pork are not that expensive, and to get your meat protein one does not need a 12 to 16 ounce steak, a smaller amount and other balanced foods to make up your meal,
            a lot is going back to eating and preparing food like grandma made not, soda and chips, and some microwave able packed stuff,

            eating healthy is not really a mater of cost, but more of a desire, and some effort, timing and planning,

            my wife works or helps at the local food bank, and if they get basic food products in, (Beans in bags, rice, fruits, and any bulk type foods, ) or similar, they can not even get people to take it. (my wife has brought home boxes of product so they would not be dumpstered), on the semi spoiled food the chickens and other animals get it, and they will not take the "Organic" products, that are at the food bank.

            (one product they got in was "Vegetarian beans", exactly the same a "pork and beans" but with out the cube of fat in the can, they had the hardest time to get them given out. I guess they did not realize that beans were a plant product and were vegetarian by there nature).

            It is not that they need more money to eat healthy, as most like eating healthy would save them money,

            I would bet they could by pure organic and save if they did there own preparation of the food, as the preprocessed foods,

            one family we had contact with was buying "lean cuisine meals" out of the frozen food section for $5 a meal
            and wondered why there food bill was so high,

            ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

            and you do not need a GYM to exercise,
            walking is a good exercise, and last I knew you do not need a tread mill to walk on, if you want more of a challenge to stairs, and jogging is a good work out.
            Many do not even take advantage of the everyday needs that one could get exercise in the process of doing,
            walking down to the corner to get the mail, etc. taking the stairs instead of the elevator,

            (I was reading on a home steading board once and read a thread, on how they hired people to dig post holes and then hired a trainer to help them exercise).
            Last edited by BHD; 10-26-2013, 10:44 AM.
            Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
            ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
            attributed to Samuel Johnson
            ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

            Comment


            • #96
              Re: Affordable Care Act

              I'll give you the all too common example of a single mother with a kid or two and an absentee husband. She works an 8 hour day and maybe even picks up a few hours part time too to make ends meet. She just doesn't have the time to prepare three healthy meals, seven days a week so she makes compromises. We all do. Pre-packaged foods are a convenience no doubt about it and even the best of us fall prey occasionally. Eating right, excersizing and taking care of yourself takes time. For many folks they have made the choice between time spend doing healthy things and just plain surviving. BTW, while there may still be a few schools peddling junk food, for the most part. They no longer do.
              sigpic

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              • #97
                Re: Affordable Care Act

                Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                In the true American way, and since I gave up soft drinks 4-months ago, I believe all soft drinks should be heavily taxed just like cigarettes. When abused they have been proven to be bad for your health.

                Mark
                I see no reason to tax but I do see a reason to actively promote healthy eating. That said though, poor health due to bad eating habits and the cost of health insurance go hand in hand. Diabetes is running rampant in this country and you better believe that it costs the rest of us so you can indeed engag in the philisophical argument that folks engaging in bad and dangerous habits should be punished in some way (other than they die earlier lol) for costing the taxpayer money. Some say that they shouldn't be allowed to have health insurance. In short, "screw them, let them crawl into a dumpster and die". But that's not the American way and I doubt there are many folks that want it to be either.

                So many tough issues with no black and white answers and the only thing left to do is blame someone else.
                sigpic

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                • #98
                  Re: Affordable Care Act

                  NHM, eating right and exercising take planning and commitment. Convenience foods are not just unhealthy, they are more costly. I can cook and serve hamburgers, grilled chicken breast, a baked potato and salad for less than half of what it cost at any fast food joint. I find this argument as pointless as explaining to a child, "If you don't want cavities, stop eating so much sugary food, and brush your teeth and floss, twice a day"! Adults need to take responsibility for what they eat, and must set an example to the children in their lives by exercising regularly. Soda, chips, candy and all the other junk is unhealthy and expensive. Personal responsibility is hold yourself responsible, a trait we as a society are sorely lacking in.
                  I just wanted to add, just what is your idea of, "The American Way"? What happened to eating right and exercising? I remember the Presidents pushing fitness, that to me is the American way. We either get tough (which will not happen), or watch more and more young people die far too soon. So much of bad health is preventable, and yet people are looking for a pill or procedure to fix what they themselves caused.
                  Last edited by Frankiarmz; 10-26-2013, 12:19 PM.

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                  • #99
                    Re: Affordable Care Act

                    Originally posted by Frankiarmz View Post
                    NHM, eating right and exercising take planning and commitment. Convenience foods are not just unhealthy, they are more costly. I can cook and serve hamburgers, grilled chicken breast, a baked potato and salad for less than half of what it cost at any fast food joint. I find this argument as pointless as explaining to a child, "If you don't want cavities, stop eating so much sugary food, and brush your teeth and floss, twice a day"! Adults need to take responsibility for what they eat, and must set an example to the children in their lives by exercising regularly. Soda, chips, candy and all the other junk is unhealthy and expensive. Personal responsibility is hold yourself responsible, a trait we as a society are sorely lacking in.
                    I just wanted to add, just what is your idea of, "The American Way"? What happened to eating right and exercising? I remember the Presidents pushing fitness, that to me is the American way. We either get tough (which will not happen), or watch more and more young people die far too soon. So much of bad health is preventable, and yet people are looking for a pill or procedure to fix what they themselves caused.

                    And just exactly what are you going to do if they don't? You always want to deal in absolutes as though merely telling folks what they should do in enough. Well, it ain't and it never has been. We are all so damned proud of the American culture. We go where we want, do what we want, eat what we want and to hell with anyone that tells us we can't.
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • Re: Affordable Care Act

                      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                      I'll give you the all too common example of a single mother with a kid or two and an absentee husband. She works an 8 hour day and maybe even picks up a few hours part time too to make ends meet. She just doesn't have the time to prepare three healthy meals, seven days a week so she makes compromises. We all do. Pre-packaged foods are a convenience no doubt about it and even the best of us fall prey occasionally. Eating right, excersizing and taking care of yourself takes time. For many folks they have made the choice between time spend doing healthy things and just plain surviving. BTW, while there may still be a few schools peddling junk food, for the most part. They no longer do.
                      This is more about convenience then it is about time. It is just as easy to prepare a healthy meal as it is to throw an overly processed meal into the oven or microwave. It's the same way with fast food. People go there because it is fast and convenient. Even when there is real home cooking, too much of it is things like fried chicken and macaroni and cheese. I was working with an Asian Architect one day who I noticed was crazy healthy. When I said something to him he said " I eat to live, I do not live to eat". I felt that was pretty profound.

                      Mark
                      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                      Comment


                      • Re: Affordable Care Act

                        Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                        And just exactly what are you going to do if they don't? You always want to deal in absolutes as though merely telling folks what they should do in enough. Well, it ain't and it never has been. We are all so damned proud of the American culture. We go where we want, do what we want, eat what we want and to hell with anyone that tells us we can't.
                        I want to deal in absolutes and you want to avoid the issues. I wrote about how it is cheaper and healthier to cook at home. I wrote how a diet of junk food is costly and not exercising is a prescription for serious health problems. You avoid all that and the personal responsibility that adults should take to lead by example. NHM, "I" won't be doing anything to stop folks from eating junk and sitting on a couch. I will be listening to the news and hearing stories about how sick adults and children are becoming. Taxpayers like myself will see their costs go up to pay for the unnecessary lifestyles of others in our free society. God forbid we as a society even encourage different behavior. NHM, I'll give you absolutes, our government is broke and operating on "faith" according to you, more and more free Americans are getting sick and dying young because of unhealthy lifestyles. Try giving me a sensible answer to those absolutes that includes pride. I have a feeling you will go off in another direction because you don't get paid to think.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Affordable Care Act

                          Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                          I'll give you the all too common example of a single mother with a kid or two and an absentee husband. She works an 8 hour day and maybe even picks up a few hours part time too to make ends meet. She just doesn't have the time to prepare three healthy meals, seven days a week so she makes compromises. We all do. Pre-packaged foods are a convenience no doubt about it and even the best of us fall prey occasionally. Eating right, excersizing and taking care of yourself takes time. For many folks they have made the choice between time spend doing healthy things and just plain surviving. BTW, while there may still be a few schools peddling junk food, for the most part. They no longer do.
                          when my kids were home my wife bought a book called "once a month cooking", Once-A-Month Cooking: A Proven System for Spending Less Time in the Kitchen and Enjoying Delicious, Homemade Meals Every Day: Mary Beth Lagerborg, Mimi Wilson: 9780312366254: Amazon.com: Books
                          basically it was a set of recopies and sets of food groups that could be prepared ahead and separated in to meal size portions and froze, one day a month you made your own convince foods, for your family,. thus cutting prep time to minimal, usually no more than the time it would take to warm up or microwave some thin. and there were many time when would only spend one day that month cooking for the family and we ate real food for every meal, ,
                          the exception was breakfast, as eggs cook up nice fresh, and pancakes and th e like are easy and quick and make,

                          even yet to day my wife will fix a large main dish, and it will be packaged away what is left over, for future meals, that may be used for the next few weeks, some is frozen, but a large roast can be used in many a way, so can ham, and so on, a chicken can be used for many meals, some things may turn into a cassoral in time,

                          and there are thing like crock pots, that make a good meal with little prep work, (and before you say they can't afford a crock pot), you can do the same in the oven at lower temperatures,

                          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                          MH, I know it cannot be done, by some who is hanging off the rafters, by there toes, all those people have to buy soda and chips to feed there family's,
                          there is just no way to take responsibility for them self and there lives.

                          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                          what it come down to is if there is a will there is a way,
                          Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                          "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                          attributed to Samuel Johnson
                          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                          PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Affordable Care Act

                            If

                            If everybody did the right thing

                            If teenagers didn't get pregnant out of wedlock
                            If people only had kids they could afford
                            If everybody ate the right foods
                            If the folks that processed food made it healthy too
                            If people didn't drink or take drugs
                            If people didn't rob banks
                            If everyone paid their own way in life
                            If corporations played fair
                            If nobody ever engaged in risky behavior

                            In short if everyone acted in a responsible manner all our money problems would go away.
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • Re: Affordable Care Act

                              Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                              If

                              If everybody did the right thing

                              If teenagers didn't get pregnant out of wedlock
                              If people only had kids they could afford
                              If everybody ate the right foods
                              If the folks that processed food made it healthy too
                              If people didn't drink or take drugs
                              If people didn't rob banks
                              If everyone paid their own way in life
                              If corporations played fair
                              If nobody ever engaged in risky behavior

                              In short if everyone acted in a responsible manner all our money problems would go away.
                              Short answer, YES! There was a time not too long ago when more people did act in a responsible manner. If you were disrespectful to an adult wheter in school or in the street you got your butt kicked! If you were lazy and got bad grades, didn't wash and had body odor, didn't brush your teeth and got cavities, over ate and got fat...Family, friends, or even strangers made you aware that you were screwing up. Now people like you want to reward the lazy, those who over indulge, those who take no responsibility for themselves or their children.
                              I'm all for lending a hand to help people pull themselves up, but I'm not for being pulled down.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Affordable Care Act

                                So....how long until my taxes pay for life coaches for the poor?

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