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  • #31
    Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

    First off if you pump is blowing at 20 psi it was garbage. would have blown with water aswell. I understand you have to respect this energy but i am very surprised that a pump and flange would blow at this pressure.
    I am not saying this was safe but when i was in basic trade school guys were pumping there soldiered copper projects beyond 500 psi. (i was not standing near by that for sure)
    I would have to agree with dog that air is still being used to test. Lately we have been using air to test our dwv systems. This was in a special situation where water leaks could not happen.

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

      Yes you are correct Plumber Jay “Junk” That’s the very reason we
      Hydro test to weed out the junk castings, Some castings that come
      in are junk. Some come in with thin walls mostly caused by core shift
      from at the foundry. Unfortunately some of our castings were coming in
      from foreign sourced foundry’s and they were really junk, We were so
      glad they started buying from American foundries again.

      Snip ..
      “soldiered copper projects beyond 500 psi. (i was not standing near by
      that for sure)”

      Not stand near… Good choice!

      I can see reasons for air testing copper joints is at times needed, but don’t see
      The reason to just test a soldered joint (s) but isn’t 150psi air pressure
      a bit high? or is that the norm in your profession..

      I was told not to long ago that:
      “Plasic pipe of any type should not be tested with air”
      I was under the impression that plastic pipe runs could be pressure
      tested with maximum air pressure of 9psi, Is that correct.
      Last edited by Davet; 03-02-2007, 09:50 AM.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

        Originally posted by Davet View Post
        I can see reasons for air testing copper joints is at times needed, but don’t see
        The reason to just test a soldered joint (s) but isn’t 150psi air pressure
        a bit high? or is that the norm in your profession..

        I was told not to long ago that:
        “Plasic pipe of any type should not be tested with air”
        I was under the impression that plastic pipe runs could be pressure
        tested with maximum air pressure of 9psi, Is that correct.
        just to clear things up and keep the dog from barking and biting

        typically if it's a water line, either plastic, gal, copper, stainless, it needs to be tested to at least the working pressure of the system.
        as far as plastic goes, we use anything from a thin wall plastic, like cpvc, to a heavy wall like sch. 80. you can't test beyond the rated pressure, but typically the smaller diameter pipe is rated at a higher psi than the larger pipe.

        now on the subject of waste lines. in a regular gravity system, found in 99% of construction. a 10' head of water is required to test the waste and vents. a 5# air test can be subsituted instead of water.

        air has both an advantage and a disadvantage. if there is a leak, nothing gets wet. also when testing multiple floors at the same time, the air will be the same pessure on the first floor or the sixth floor. with a water test, you will still need 10' o head on the top floor of the test. therefore you are limited to the floors that can be tested at once. typically 30' of vertical piping is about it with no-hub pipe and bands.

        the real disadvantge with air is locating small leaks. you need to listen, hard on a construction site, and spray all joints and piping with soapy water. a real pain. also you loose all the air in the system when you go to repair the leak. on a big system, it can take a long time to repump to 5#. with water the leak will show up quickly and you only need to drain it to the level of the leak to repair. problem is water can cause damage inside of occupied/ finished buildings.

        gas systems, natural,lp, medical, require an air test only. no liquid.

        hope this stops the he said, i said

        thank's for the intesesting insite on large scale pumps. i thought a 6'' pump was good size.

        rick.
        phoebe it is

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

          Thanks Rick that helps me better understand.
          I think trying to explain one profession to someone in another
          profession is very difficult especially with the written word.
          I have a feeling if Dog and I were having this debate in a verbal discussion
          It would be going much differently.

          Here is one of the bigger verticals we make.
          If I remember right it had a 54" suction inlet
          and a 30" discharge.

          The head on this job "green"
          has 2" welded pipe pipes with #150 class flanges for supplying water th the seal at the shaft.
          It was hydro'd with water pressure to insure the integrity of the welds. the head and piping
          must be hydro'd with the pipes and flanges assembled to the head.
          Attached Files
          Last edited by Davet; 03-02-2007, 06:59 PM.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

            Here is a vtp setup for testing on the test well.

            and another picture of two split case pumps
            currently setup at the same time on the test well.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

              well lets try it again....
              Attached Files

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                and last but not least.

                This is the recent test pump we had sieze up.
                that is a 2-11/16 Dia " stainless shaft.

                It is a wonder it didnt snap instead of bending?

                1500 hp to a dead stop in about 2 or 3 seconds.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                  dang I will get the hang of this some day, Sorry.
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                    dave, very interesting big stuff

                    i'll stick with the little grundfos and zoller pumps.

                    next time katrina hits, i'm sure your pumps will be busy

                    rick.

                    the dog is a ***** cat when you get to know him throw him a bone every now and then and he'll lick you
                    phoebe it is

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                      Originally posted by Davet View Post
                      Thanks Rick that helps me better understand.
                      I think trying to explain one profession to someone in another
                      profession is very difficult especially with the written word.
                      I have a feeling if Dog and I were having this debate in a verbal discussion
                      It would be going much differently.

                      Here is one of the bigger verticals we make.
                      If I remember right it had a 54" suction inlet
                      and a 30" discharge.

                      The head on this job "green"
                      has 2" welded pipe pipes with #150 class flanges for supplying water th the seal at the shaft.
                      It was hydro'd with water pressure to insure the integrity of the welds. the head and piping
                      must be hydro'd with the pipes and flanges assembled to the head.
                      Davet,

                      I've worked extensivly in pipe fitting. I have worked with high pressure, high temp. piping. I have not seen a flange or weld blow at less then 60 psi. If it has for you, you are using crap welders and are producing crap product.

                      A certified pipe weld will easily hold more then 60psi. That is with standard sch.40 pipe and a 150# flange.

                      What pumps do you produce?

                      I'll give you the stats on the pipe and flanges if you want to persue this.

                      You're a fraud. Either you don't know what you are doing (probably), or you're misinformed. Either way, this is a forum where there are people who know what they are talking about. You don't.
                      the dog

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                        I was going to write somthing about the welds but yup Dog pretty much sumed that up. Good for you Dog.
                        Tyler

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                          Originally posted by Tyler S View Post
                          I was going to write somthing about the welds but yup Dog pretty much sumed that up. Good for you Dog.
                          Tyler
                          Thank you for the support Tyler S.

                          I'm wrong sometimes, but I speak my mind. Rarly does anyone support me. I haven't seen your posts much, but I encourage you to get involved, and to argue with me when you feel I'm wrong.

                          Thanks for getting involved.
                          the dog

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                            Originally posted by plumbdog10 View Post
                            Dave,

                            Again I'm asking: what flanges and pipe did you explode with less than 60 psi?

                            I don't see it, and think you were talking our of your ***.
                            You are Missed Brother RIP
                            I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                              Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                              You are Missed Brother RIP
                              Yes, the 'Dog' is missed here.

                              I don't know why I never saw this thread back when it first came up, or I would most likely have opened my big mouth and said something.

                              One thing I noticed it that the whole thread started because the guy wanted to test some hydronic pipe not water pipe so much less pressure in the system and he probably could have stated that in his opening post and that would have got him to an answer sooner.

                              The other is that I recognize a couple of the pumps that Davet posted as ones very similar to ones used at some places I have worked. Except for the colors of the pump casings one looks almost identical to ones they have where I worked back in 2007. And, given the little information that Davet has given about his location and industry, I believe I know who he works for but since he chose not to say neither will I. In the pump manufacturing business they are widely respected as a top of the line manufacturer who produce quality products. I have no idea who Davet is or what he does there, he could still be sweeping floors which he said was his entry level job to the place for all I know, but I have talked to some of their engineers and sales people and they know their stuff. As Davet said trying to convey with words only some aspects of the trade things get lost in the verbiage used and how it is interpreted by the reader.
                              ---------------
                              Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                              ---------------
                              “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                              ---------
                              "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                              ---------
                              sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Testing 3/4" Copper Pipe for Leaks - Dry Test Kit

                                Being from Mass, The plumbers used Air in winter. Otherwise ,You risk a freezup and maybe split copper. I am plumbing a laundry where the copper for the Laundry box has a low run which can't easily be drained ,If I had a leak. So I'll use air and gas leak spray. Thanks Rick And Dog.
                                I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                                Comment

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