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  • #31
    Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

    funny how he hasnt posted yet---just when he thought he was pullin a fast one and foolin those STUPID plumbers----busted---there is nothing more satisfying than going to a home of a diy'er and ripping apart his hack job and telling him his plumber that did this is terrible and shouldnt be plumbing, then noticing the diy'er wont make eye contact and suddenly starts agreeing with me and telling me he's gonna get his $ back from this hack plumber he hired.
    then as i go make the bill, the wife pulls in the drive and says "did u fix it????"
    and i explain and she says she told her husband not to do it and to call me---so then i make him understand why he shouldnt have when i give him a healthy bill and his eyes suddenly bulge----betcha he wont even plunge his toilets anymore

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

      How do studors fail?
      Do they get clogged with bugs?
      Does a gasket dry out or something?

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

        Wow, you guys are rough, aren't you?

        I haven't posted anything recently because I had a busy weekend working on framing the kitchenette.

        I am hiring a plumber to do the work, you can choose to believe me or not. No, I do not intend to list his name, address, phone number, license number, social security number or waste size here on the forum, and I frankly can't understand why you care that much anyway.

        Why am I asking questions? I'd like to get a feel for the scope of the job, understand potential pitfalls and problem areas, know what questions I should ask when I have different vendors in to bid on the project and well, just out of curiosity. I don't think an informed consumer is a bad thing at all, but then again, I am not a shady plumber trying to get over on a customer, right?

        As for hack jobs, unfortunately the work done previously is just that. The house was flipped, we thought they did a good job, but after tearing apart the walls, we have found some problems, including the plumbing. We'll have whoever we hire fix it all.

        As for Studor Vents, I know they are suboptimal, but I think we are going to end up using one here anyway. Why? Because it is a 75 year old home and sometimes things are just suboptimal as you try and fit modern day conveniences in an older home. Just out of curiosity, which would cost me more in labor, the installation of studor vent or having one of you guys runs a traditional vent? Any chance this might bias your opinion? Hey, we all have to put food on the table, right?

        To those who answered sincerely, thanks a ton, you've helped me to understand the situation and I'll be able to make a much more informed decision with who I hire. P-Crack, how do I go about getting in touch with you outside of this, would love to have you over for an estimate. To the rest of you, not really sure why you hang out on this thing, isn't there a bar somewhere for disgruntled tradesmen to go and complain about their customers?

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

          do your ever get that feeling of Deja Vu?

          Anyway I hope you do follow through and get an experianced plumber. I also recommend you get a few prices and check references. As for the AAV, it's going to be up to who ever you hire so I won't bother offering my opinion again.

          Just so Everyone knows where I am coming from and why I seem to be a crotchity old bat, I'm gonna post this from another thread. And though some may find it hard to believe, I and many other plumbers do care about you, your family and your neighborhood. We don't want to see anybody get hurt, sick, ripped off or sued.

          Who are we?

          Well a good deal on this part of the forum are mostly licensed plumbers but I'm sure some no pro's read here also and that's great.
          We don't take any kind of oath to uphold public trust or safety. No hand on the bible. No swearing to god. We answer only to ourselves and the public we serve. We have had a motto for about a hundred years now. Plumbers Protect the Health of the Nation. It's a good motto, short and to the point. It doesn't say we give the public a good deal or great service. It doesn't say we give the public quality products or free advice either. It just says we protect their health. In my opinion, giving certain plumbing advice to people that do not have the schooling, license or experiance to to the job correctly and thouroughly is irresponsible as best and dangerous at worst. So who decides the level of experiance and knowledge? In our state the Plumbers Board does. If you are qualified, you get a license. A man who judges himself is always qualified in his own mind. I want all of you to really think about the dilemma next time a homeowner wants to know how to pipe the water or dwv for his new addition or bath remodel. Is this guy going to follow the code? Will the piping be properly supported and protected. Will he know how to recognize a potential cross connection or backflow situation that could effect the entire neighborhood? Does he really know enough about proper trhreading and assembly procedures as well as testing of gas piping? Worse and most likley of all, will he pull a permit and have the job inspected. Pleas do not assume that he will just because he assured you that he would on the forum. I don't know about you, but if I spend several days replying to him and advising and fine tuning and then he screwed it up and blew the house and his family up in the process I would feel somewhat responsible.
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

            NHMaster:

            I found your comments to be helpful, but you'll admit that some of your peers seem more intent on being incendiary, than illuminating. Rampant and frankly mean spirited accusations are not particularly helpful in my opinion and are certainly not indicative of people who care.

            You know, better than I do, that there are good plumbers, mediocre plumbers and bad plumbers out there, all with licenses, nice vans and tool belts. It is VERY easy for an uninformed homeowner to get completely screwed by a tradesman, either with unfair pricing, poor workmanship or some combination thereof. The easiest way, at least in my opinion, to avoid that is for the homeowner to take charge a little, get to know his/her home and get to know, even just a little, about the various issues involved.

            I think this discussion will make me a more informed consumer, better able to choose the right plumber, but able to make sure his work is what it should be.

            Again,thank you for your help.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

              I sent you a private message Stubits

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                Wow, stubits, nice replies.

                I apologize for the rough way in which this thread was handled. You seem to know what you are talking about when it comes to the fact that the previous home-flippers messed some stuff up and now you'll get it fixed right.

                There have been many previous questions on this forum from people who were simply looking to do illegal plumbing, not pull permits and get free information from us Pro plumbers. One poster recently "navysuit" was extremely rude, argumentative, insulting and deceptive while asking questions about installing his own water heater even though all of us recommended he have a licensed plumber do it.

                That kind of thing has gotten so common, that many of us are defensive and cynical when strangers ask plumbing questions...especially on large projects which they shouldn't be doing anyway.

                Hopefully plumberscrack can help you out, he's a great plumber and I would bet he would give you a good deal on the work, while doing it all right!
                Good luck.
                Water Heater Reviews & Water Heater Information

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                  Without a doubt an uninformed home owner has a target on his back. That's why 3 estimates are good and so is a good reference. Ask around, you will soon find out who the hacks and the pro's are.
                  sigpic

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                    So who's the mean spirited jerk your talking about, stubs????????????

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                      Ok, so I finally selected a plumber (PC, sorry for not calling you in, the guy I selected came well recommended and is the husband of a woman I work with). He has done a great job so far of adding a trap and a AAV to our washer stack. He also seems to have done a great job with the kitchenette rough in.

                      So, I started to tear apart the basement bathroom a bit, just to get his opinion on the plumbing and it doesn't look good at all. He is coming back on Wednesday to fix those problems, but I was hoping to get the opinions of you folks on what you would do in this instance. Here are the myriad of problems...

                      1) The kitchen sink basically drains into the basement lavatory sink train by way if an S-trap. Please see the picture below. Effectively, after what you see in the photo, it drops down a couple of feet, connects to a horizontal pipe with a 90, runs a couple of feet more and then heads down vertically by way of another 90, ultimately connecting into the drain line of the basement lavatory sink. It is not vented.

                      2) In the right corner of the basement bathroom, there are two cast iron pipes going into the cement slab, one is the vent stack that goes up through the roof, it is a dry vent as there are no fixtures draining into it above and a small "stub," perhaps 4"-6" high. The drain line running from the lavatory sink (and connected to the drain from the kitchen sink) connect into this stub. At the point where the PVC joins up with the cast iron, there is some wetness at the connection/joint. This whole deal is ONLY connected to the drain stub, not to the vent stack.

                      3) Finally, the tub. I cut an access panel out from behind the tub and it is evident that there is no trap. It looks like what they did was run 3" PVC from the washer stack, tied it into the tub drain and then onto the main drain. The plumber plans to rip up the concrete enough to replace the 3" running from the washer stack to the tub with 2", thereby making room for him to add in an appropriate trap to the tub. This does not appear to be directly vented, but the drain does likely tie into either the stub where the lavatory sink drains, or perhaps the toilet drain (which is more likely? does it matter?).

                      So, not really sure what to make of all of this. I am sure my plumber is coming up with a plan of attack right now, but as I stated earlier, I would really appreciate your collective wisdom, as this seems relatively complicated. I am including a couple of photos/diagrams that might be helpful.

                      1) Photo of kitchen sink drain, looks like an S-trap, no?

                      2) Photo of where kitchen sink drain connects to lavatory sink drain (lavatory sink is to the left, drain is to the right). My plumber is planning to replace the connector with one that directs water in the proper direction.

                      3)Rudimentary diagram of basement plumbing. The black square in the right corner is the vent stack, the red square is the cast iron stub and the little yellow piece is where the kitchen drain connects into everything.

                      4) Finally, here is my musings on how to repair the venting problem. Would it be sufficient just to add the one vent pipe (light blue) to vent both the kitchen sink and the lavatory sink? Is it necessary to add two vents, the light blue and the green in order to vent both the kitchen sink and the lavatory sink? Am I totally off base? What about the tub, assuming it ties into the toilet drain, is it therefore properly wet vented already? If it ties into the same drain as the stub for the lavatory sink, will it be properly wet vented as soon as we properly vent the sink?

                      Again, to quell any nastiness, I have indeed hired a licensed plumber and he has begun working on the job. He will be returning tomorrow and I just want to have some idea of what needs to be done in my head before he arrives.

                      Thanks everyone!
                      Attached Files

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                        Looks pretty bad, Stu

                        Actually glad I'm not involved in that mess

                        The best thing to do would be open all plumbing walls and camera any piping under the floor. My guess is the more you expose the more you will find not to code. So far looks like a complete repipe of the waste and vent system.

                        It's always easier to do it right than do it halfass.

                        Good luck

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                          Originally posted by CCusson View Post
                          I've got the same situation with a vent- how do the studor or oatey vents hold-up? Is there any maintenance required for them?

                          Thanks!
                          -Chris
                          Missed this post.

                          Chris, here in MA you CANNOT use AAV's, they're illegal.

                          It'll come back to bite you when you try to sell the home.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                            Stubits...
                            I hate to tell ya, but those diagrams won't float, the vents (I think they're vents) are no good.

                            This is what I was referring to when customers outline the way I should do my job.

                            Save yourself and him some time, let him walk through and outline what he thinks is best.
                            It might come off as a little insulting if you put those in front of him, this guy is a "friendly" plumber, trust him..I do work for my wives co-workers on occasion, I go well out of my way to keep it reasonable on price and do as good a job as possible.
                            She has to work with them.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                              A plumber would be out of His Mind to get involved with this mess!
                              I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Basement Plumbing Issues

                                too many hacks have hit this house--you need a plumber to start over--if you just bought home, did this pass a inspection-????i guess if it was all covered up, no home inspector would camera it, anyway. because of hack and wack, recently we have been doing video and piping inspections before homes closeto let buyer know how much they are or are not going to spend to get things correct. nothing against home inspectors, but i have seen these guys tell someone the house is excellent and plumbing is perfect and i found multiple major issues---u own the house now so u have to deal with it, but if u ever move, be cautious

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