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  • Gryhnd
    started a topic Running water lines from house to barn

    Running water lines from house to barn

    Hello all,
    We need to get running water from our house to our barn, which is about 300 ft away (shortest route). We were going to hire someone, but having difficulty finding anyone so thinking we will tackle it ourselves (I would say my husband has basic handyman plumbing skills). We need to go across a seasonal creek which has 30' span (no water in it most of the time). We are having a bridge built of steel H beams and wood walkway and plan to run the water line under the bridge, attached to underside (would be way too difficult to get lines dug under the creek bed we think). At the barn, we plan to have a couple of those frost free spigots, one outside, one inside, for filling water buckets, giving horse a bath, etc. No sink/toilet there. We have city water. We are in Middle TN (new to this area), so believe there is not too much frost but we would plan on putting the lines 2' below ground level, I think that should be okay for winter.
    Can anyone tell us what type of material we should use for the piping? I assume PVC or I have read of something called CPVC also, but how large in diameter? Also, would it be the same material running under the bridge or should that be metal pipe? Assume we need some type of insulation wrap around it under the bridge.
    Thanks so much for any help you can provide!

  • wrench spinner
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Schd 40 is fine, a little bit more $$ but overall a fine way to go. It'll Prob take a littlewith glueing it up and all. Just make sure you keep your joints clean and you will do fine!

    Leave a comment:


  • Gryhnd
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Thanks, how does that compare to the PVC Sched 40 then (which we had decided to use). I know our lines from the road to the house (which previous owner installed - it is probably at least 1/4 mile) are PVC. When I called the plumbing supply places around here and originally asked for "polyethlene pipe", they just directed me to PEX, and I understand there is a difference - regular PE, and then PEX is crosslinked PE, correct? One guy at each plumbing place said he'd use Sched 40 over the PEX.

    Leave a comment:


  • NHMaster3015
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    There's nothing wrong with it. Probably 90% of all domestic well's have black polyethelyne run from the pump to the house. Our city water department uses it from the main to the house also.

    Leave a comment:


  • wrench spinner
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    It is thinner and oly rated for i want to say 100 psi, they have that pipe in blue that is rated up to 200 psi, it is thicker, you are better off with that, pricewaise is VERY sililiar, not that much of an increase for a better product, try a pump supplier in your area they should have the pipe to use!

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  • Gryhnd
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
    PEX is a different material from Polyethylene Pipe. (Black Pipe) The colors have nothing to do with the size. Just for easy ID and some UV protection depending on product. There are problems with Zurn PEX that some of the homecenters carry that has yet to be ironed out last I read. DO NOT PUT IN THIN BLACK PIPE. I know you want to DIY, but from what I've read you might come out just as well hiring a licensed plumber or a licensed well contractor. I'm a plumber but I think you're best answer is the well contractor. Good luck.

    J.C.
    Just curious, what is wrong with the black pipe Lowes has? I didn't get to see the label on it so I dont know what it is called at Lowes, but a friend in KY told me that is all they use around there for water lines - some black flexible pipe that comes in 100' section. Thanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gryhnd
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Originally posted by Gryhnd View Post
    Thank you. No one has mentioned that, they've only mentioned shut-off valves at either end.
    Okay, I take that back. My husband says he was planning to put that valve in - guess he knows a little more about plumbing than I give him credit for

    Leave a comment:


  • Gryhnd
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Originally posted by wrench spinner View Post
    you SHOULD install a backflow preventer on the line prior to going out to the barn to prevent contamination of your water supply. I would recommend a Watts 909 RPZ just to be on the safe side. The last thing you need is fecal coliform in your drinking water!!
    Thank you. No one has mentioned that, they've only mentioned shut-off valves at either end.

    Leave a comment:


  • wrench spinner
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
    Last comment. Well drillers like rock.

    J.C.
    The more rock the shallower you ahve to go with your casing and chances are the shallower you have to go with a well. If you only need to go 100 feet dow to get water and only 10 feet to rock we are looking at really quite an affordable number! maybe less than 4k!

    Leave a comment:


  • wrench spinner
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    you SHOULD install a backflow preventer on the line prior to going out to the barn to prevent contamination of your water supply. I would recommend a Watts 909 RPZ just to be on the safe side. The last thing you need is fecal coliform in your drinking water!!

    Leave a comment:


  • BobsPlumbing
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Last comment. Well drillers like rock.

    J.C.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gryhnd
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Thanks for all the advice. We have decided to go with 1" PVC Schedule 40. The guy building the bridge will dig the trench for us at a reduced rate since his equipment will already be here, and we will see about laying the pipe and making the connections to the house ourselves; if we feel uncomfortable with the cnx, we will try to have a plumber come out. We just don't feel it is a good idea to try to get under the creek, given what we have seen occur with it, and we do not want to cause any erosion of the bank. I don't know if I'd even call it a creek, it is completely dry 99% of the time, except if we have had rain for a week it may build up, or a flash flood in which we had heavy rain overnight and the creek was dry by morning. As to a well, no, we didn't look into it so I can't really say whether that would be a better option, we are concerned about the somewhat rocky soil and also the quality of the water, but of course we wouldn't know for sure unless we looked into it. I think our only issue may be the pipe under the bridge freezing, but we will do our best to insulate it and deal with it. If we have water 99% of the time and it is just frozen a few days a years, we can live with that as opposed to not having water at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • toolaholic
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Pex is junk! Why does My son in law buy about 20'000 ft. a month to install in concrete slabs for radiant heat ,by Geo? www.earthheat.com

    They use to use copper,No more doesn't like cement,pin holes. Pex has worked over 30 years in Europe! Same bunch that gave us Viessmann with stainless heat exchangers.
    What does He know! N.Y. times just flew out to Duvall Wash. last month ,and has since
    done an article on His Buss. Oh, I do still use copper ,But pex .abs pvc. arn't going away
    Get use to it!

    Leave a comment:


  • NHMaster3015
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    PROPERTY
    TEST
    ASTM SI
    ENGLISH

    METHOD
    UNITS
    UNITS
    Density (Natural)
    D1505
    0.944g/cc

    Density (Black)
    D1505
    0.955g/cc

    Flow Rate(190/21.6)
    D1238
    8.75 g/10 min.

    Tensile Strength @ Ultimate
    D638
    31.0 MPa
    5000psi
    Tensile Strength @ Yield
    D638
    22.8 MPa
    3500psi
    Ultimate Elongation
    D638
    >800%
    >800%
    Flexural Modulus (2% secant)
    D790
    827MPa
    120,000psi
    Environmental Stress Crack Resistance



    (ESCR) Condition C
    D1693
    >5,000 hrs.
    >5,000 hrs.
    Brittleness Temperature
    D746
    <-117 C
    <-180 F
    Vicat Softening Temperature
    D1525
    126 C
    259 F
    Hardness, Shore D
    D2240
    66
    66
    Thermal Expansion Coefficient
    D696
    1.8x10(-4) cm/cm/C
    1.0x10(-4) in/in/F
    HYDROSTATIC DESIGN BASIS
    D2837
    11.0MPa @ 23 C
    1600psi @ 73.4F
    CELL CLASSIFICATION
    D3350
    345464C**
    345464B**
    MATERIAL CLASSIFICATION
    D1248
    Type III
    Grade P34


    Category 5
    Class C or B


    Material:
    Crosslinked polyethylene PEX-a Engel Method
    Standard Grade Hydrostatic Ratings (PPI):
    200°F (93°C) at 80 psi 180°F (82°C) at 100 psi 73.4°F (23°C) at 160 psi ½" Wirsbo AQUAPEX
    ®plus tubing only: 120°F (49°C) at130 psi
    Linear Expansion Rate:
    1.10"/10°F (12°C)/100'

    Leave a comment:


  • NHMaster3015
    replied
    Re: Running water lines from house to barn

    Originally posted by plumberjr View Post
    Do not use pex---it is junk junk junk-----if using plasic, use polyethylene rated for the pressure--dont go with pex--i cant stress how crappy it is--after expanding and contracting so much, dont u think it will finally give out????yes!!!! If someone could drop a price 3k that quick--forget about them---call a local excavater---a small outfit could use this as filler work to keep them going--you will get a much better price, and they lay pipe and dig for a living--or do the directional boring--then the creek is not an issue b/c they go real deep if necessary---you still need to make more calls---you will find a good price for good work

    also-----do not use pex-----it is junk
    So how do you really feel about Pex?

    BTW poly pipe expands also.

    Leave a comment:

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