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  • Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

    I want to install a sump system in my 40 year old house because I'm getting water in the basement. I watched the 'Ask This Old House' video about installing a sump and they mentioned since there's gravel under the floor, all they need is the sump basin and pump. They broke the concrete, dug a hole and put in the basin & pump etc.

    The waterproofing contractors by me wanted to tear up the floor and install drain tiles to hook into a sump system. I friend told me I don't need the tiles as there's mostlikely 2-3" of gravel under the cement floor. I guy down the street had a sump put in and they dug up the side of his house and put in the drain tiles.

    Can I just install the sump in my attached garage at the lowest corner and will it handle water from the other end of my house or do I need the drain tiles as well? The basement is finished and I can't put the sump in there. The attached garage is the same level as the rest of the house & basement. The drain tiles aren't a good option for me.

    Thanks!!

  • #2
    Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

    In Illinois most areas it is a good idea to install drain tiles leading to the pump pit. This helps direct the water that may pool up on the other side of the house to the sump pit. Putting a sump pit in a gravel bed and relying on the gravel under the home to seep the water to your pump pit can work, but as the gravel gets filled with dirt the seepage processes takes longer, and with larger rains the water may start to pool up in the house before it gets a chance to drain into the pump pit.

    I would recommend you talk to your local building department. They can tell you what is best for your area. They can also help you design a proper system as well. To many times I have been called by home owners that just sunk a sump pit in gravel asking me what is a stronger pump cause they got water during the big rains. When I went and investigated their system, the pump they had was working fine. Trouble was the water was not reaching the pit fast enough and the pit was way undersized as well.
    Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
    A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
    Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
    Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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    • #3
      Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

      Thanks for the insight!!

      Do you know of many that do work without the tiles? With all the structures around the house and being finished inside, the tiles would be a real big deal. Money is real tight right now for that big of an expense.

      Thanks Again!!
      Last edited by bobt; 06-22-2009, 07:17 AM.

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      • #4
        Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

        Originally posted by bobt View Post
        Thanks for the insight!!

        Do you know of many that do work without the tiles? With all the structures around the house and being finished inside, the tiles would be a real big deal. Money is real tight right now for that big of an expense.

        Thanks Again!!
        I would call US Water Proofing, or PermaSeal, and any of the other water proofing companies that offer free estimates. Them guys have it down to a science with as many as they do. I know as a plumber I can not even come close to competing with them in price.
        Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
        A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
        Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
        Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

          Every sump crock I have dug fills up faster than I can dig it...guess it depends on what part of Illinois.

          If it were my house, I would dig the pit and see what happens.

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          • #6
            Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

            I am not doubting it will fill up. The issue is how far the water has to travel under the house. I also seen many of the french drain sump pit set ups fail after being so many years old. The dirt and silt eventually clogs the gravel.
            Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
            A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
            Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
            Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

              Originally posted by NorthernIllinoisPlumber View Post
              Every sump crock I have dug fills up faster than I can dig it...guess it depends on what part of Illinois.

              If it were my house, I would dig the pit and see what happens.
              I'm in a Northwest Chicago suburb.

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              • #8
                Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

                Originally posted by NorthernIllinoisPlumber View Post
                Every sump crock I have dug fills up faster than I can dig it...guess it depends on what part of Illinois.

                If it were my house, I would dig the pit and see what happens.
                How far away from the wall does the hole need to be to avoid the footer with a cinder block foundation? I don't have a really large area to put it in.

                Also, how much larger than the pit basin do I need to make the hole in the floor so I can do a nice cement job? Looks like the really butchered the hole on the "Ask This Old House" video. I think I could do a nicer hole by drilling holes around the circle than just using a jack-hammer as they did.

                Thanks!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

                  Thanks for all the info. Looks like installing a sump without drain tiles is quite common. I found some great "How To's" including one from Popular Mechanics. Alot of doc out there encourages the homeowner to do it if needbe.

                  Looks like the basin or bucket is prety standard, 18"W X 22"H. Make your hole 6" from the wall to clear the footers. Make the hole 6" larger than the width so that would be 24" dia. Dig down 22". Put the bucket in and put 3/8-1/2 size river stone around the bucket up to and past 1" of the beginning of the floor concrete. Fill in the top 3" around the bucket with concrete. Sounds pretty straight forward to me. Lots of bull work but not rocket science.

                  Just hope the water flows/seeps to the pit. Also hope there isn't some type of partition under the floor when they poured it to keep the water on each side of the house one side being the attached garage.

                  I need to do something and I don't have 10K to spend.

                  If anyone has anything to add, I'd appreciate it.
                  Last edited by bobt; 06-24-2009, 06:35 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

                    bobt, you didn't say (or I missed it) where the water is getting in?

                    Through the basement floor? Through the basement walls? Any ideas?

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                    • #11
                      Re: Sump - Do I need drain tiles?

                      Originally posted by lmpg View Post
                      bobt, you didn't say (or I missed it) where the water is getting in?

                      Through the basement floor? Through the basement walls? Any ideas?
                      I know exactly where it's coming in. Finally reached my limit and cut a hole in the drywall. It's coming in where the cinder block meets the floor. No cracks or anything. Seeing there's a footing under all that, it must be coming in from underneath if I understand what's going on correctly.

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