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  • Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

    I have three wall hung Case 1000 toilets in my house with the #50 ballcock regulator in them. Wow! When I bought the house the previous owner had two of them shut off. Now I now why.

    Over the last couple of years I have been repairing/adjusting the cantankerous beasts myself, as the plumbers I called didn't really know what to do with these things and several times the "repair" didn't last.

    The most reoccuring problem is that after a flush, the water won't completely shutoff and will continue to trickle. Ugghh! Second biggest problem is the handle will not trip after a flush, thus not reseating the "flapper" and the water will run at full blast until someone "jiggles the handle."

    I have a few questions and here are a few links to help look at something. The first is a regulator repair kit. The regulator is the screw with the washer on the end of it that obvioulsy regulates the flow of water thru the body to the vent asssembly. Here is a link to the part.
    http://www.briggsplumbing.com/produc...rts/parts-5123

    When the plastic washer on the end wears out, you have to buy this whole dang kit, which is about thirty bucks! I really don't understand why all the other brass parts come in this kit. I really don't think they wear out, do they?

    Next is a picture of the plunger kit.Just as aggravating is having to buy the whole plunger kit when all you want is the seat.

    http://www.briggsplumbing.com/produc...ody-parts-5121

    So what is the function of the regulator? Yes, I know it regulates the flow of water. But to what purpose? By experimenting with different setttings by screwing it either in or out of the body, I can't tell it does anything except when you screw it all the way in at which point it will drive the float arm all the way down.

    I have beat the Internet to death trying to find some sort of info on how this Rube Goldberg thing works. This is the only place I could find that had a link to some kinda discussion about these things, but the thread didn't go into much detail. Just some pictures and few comments about how hard they were to work on, etc. Any info will be appreciated.
    TIA,
    Mark

    P.S. I tried to enclose a picture of the ballcock, but alas, I was unable to get it to transfer to this page. Sorry

  • #2
    Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

    mark, you're in a catch 22

    you have a wall mount tank toilet that doesn't exist anymore

    i have a few customers with these. i have a special seat wrench that my buddy steve made it removes the plastic seats without stripping.

    what you need is a monel seat that will last pretty much a lifetime.

    the flow regulator is typically not an issue. it diverts the water to the bowl for the flush and refill.

    tell you what

    fly me out there and i'll fix you right up

    post the photos either as an attachment or a copy and paste.

    rick.
    phoebe it is

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

      Rick,

      What is a monel seat? I have used a screwdriver pretty effectively getting the old ones out.

      I can't get the photo to attach. Keep getting message that "upload failed" and I guess I don't know how to copy and paste a photo because I can't seem to accomplish this either. I'll keep trying.

      What if I wanted to replace those things with something with modern plumbing in them. Any idea what brands would use same bolt pattern to attach to wall?

      Thanks,
      Mark

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

        mark, a monel seat is made of monel/ stainless steel compaired to the nylon one you're wearing out.

        as far as i know, there are no wall hung tank toilets still being made. the flush valve/ flushometer toilets are the ones you see in public bathrooms/ commercial applications. problem is they require a 1'' water stub up on the wall.

        make sure you keep the jpeg. mb. below the max. of 488.3 kb.

        here are the formats and mb limits we use for attachments.

        rick.





        Close this window Manage Attachments
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        Uploading File(s) - Please Wait

        Attachment Key FiletypeMax FilesizeMax WidthMax Height bmp97.7 KB600600 doc195.3 KB-- gif146.5 KB-- jpe97.7 KB600600 jpeg488.3 KB-- jpg488.3 KB-- mp3732.4 KB-- pdf8.58 MB-- png97.7 KB600600 pps976.6 KB-- psd146.5 KB-- txt19.5 KB-- zip4.77 MB--
        Last edited by PLUMBER RICK; 03-22-2010, 10:27 AM.
        phoebe it is

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

          At one time I had about 100 customers with the case 50 fill valve so I have a lot of experience with them. Most of the "running on" issues are either seat or tank ball related but it is not too uncommon to see a bad flush valve in a toilet that has been turned off and left in a dry state for some period of time. I do believe that the nylon seat that comes in the fill valve is the best but special tools are needed for it's removal and installation. Having given Plumber Rick one of these tools I'm a little surprised that he is endorsing the monel seat but it's possible that he has no idea where to find it in his truck. If you want a detailed play by play description on how to properly rebuild this unit along with tips that will save you some grief send me a private message request.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

            Rick,

            Where can I get a seat made of monel? And how about info on this special tool? What is curious to me is that the seats don't real appear too worn when I remove them. (Seems like I bought a large allen wrench to do this, but I can't remember if it worked and I resorted to a screwdriver. Can't believe how senile I'm getting.) On the other hand, the rubber on the bottom of the plunger seems a litttle soft. I thought that was worth replacing.

            What is funny, or maybe not so funny, is that I was seriously concerned about maintaining these toilets when we first looked at he house. I questioned the owner about where to get parts for them and he said, "oh you can get those at Lowes. Total BS of course.

            I'm checking now on the size of my picture. Not sure how to control the mb's to keep it under 433. But I'll check.

            Thanks,
            Mark

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

              Originally posted by rookie plumber View Post
              At one time I had about 100 customers with the case 50 fill valve so I have a lot of experience with them. Most of the "running on" issues are either seat or tank ball related but it is not too uncommon to see a bad flush valve in a toilet that has been turned off and left in a dry state for some period of time. I do believe that the nylon seat that comes in the fill valve is the best but special tools are needed for it's removal and installation. Having given Plumber Rick one of these tools I'm a little surprised that he is endorsing the monel seat but it's possible that he has no idea where to find it in his truck. If you want a detailed play by play description on how to properly rebuild this unit along with tips that will save you some grief send me a private message request.
              it was my buddy steve that gave me the seat removal tool easy to remove new seats that are teflon taped in. it's the old ones that were difficult.

              the monel seat is pretty much a lifetime seat. the plastic/ nylon ones wear out due to the water jetting past them. since the washer doesn't close in a flat position as it pivots, the 60-65# of pressure slowly eats the plastic, just like it does brass. monel is pretty much bullet proof.

              and yes rookie, i know exactly where the tool is and what project i use it on. joey likes it stored in my buddy box

              rick.
              phoebe it is

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                Ha Ha Rick, very bunny......oops I mean funny. Sorry, the monel seat will not last forever and I have seen fill valves that are cavitated from where the seat threads into the valve body. Anyways I heard that you took your wife to a cheap taco place for dinner, remember that baby is yours too!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                  Originally posted by rookie plumber View Post
                  Ha Ha Rick, very bunny......oops I mean funny. Sorry, the monel seat will not last forever and I have seen fill valves that are cavitated from where the seat threads into the valve body. Anyways I heard that you took your wife to a cheap taco place for dinner, remember that baby is yours too!
                  well it was suppose to be a nice pizza place she wanted, but it was closed. remember anything beats what she was having the last week

                  iv fluids

                  plus i was suppose to be in vegas

                  didn't you pay off all your bets with the same taco stand

                  dah, what's up doc

                  rick.
                  phoebe it is

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                    Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                    it was my buddy steve that gave me the seat removal tool easy to remove new seats that are teflon taped in. it's the old ones that were difficult.

                    the monel seat is pretty much a lifetime seat. the plastic/ nylon ones wear out due to the water jetting past them. since the washer doesn't close in a flat position as it pivots, the 60-65# of pressure slowly eats the plastic, just like it does brass. monel is pretty much bullet proof.

                    and yes rookie, i know exactly where the tool is and what project i use it on. joey likes it stored in my buddy box

                    rick.
                    It looks to me that the plunger moves pretty much straight up and down in the regulator body. The botttom of the plunger sits down onto the seat. But what do I know.

                    Anyhow, question still stands. Where can I get seat made of monel and the "special tool"

                    I can't figure out how to manipulate my picture. It is 3.21 MBs. I guess that is too big. Apparently, size does matter.

                    Thanks,
                    Mark

                    Thanks,
                    Mark

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                      the special tool is only required if you can't get the old seat out. you're fine since you have gotten them out.


                      the monel seat is a specialty part. there was a company called p & m that sold them. check with a good local hardware store. mine use to carry them.

                      the top of the nylon seat wears due to the water jetting between the seat and the washer. of course any grit in the water will also eat the seat. brass seats wear out too. monel is the longest lasting seat made.

                      rick.
                      phoebe it is

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                        That was over 100 tacos.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Qusetion about Case #50 Ballcock

                          Fellas,

                          Im just googled "wall mounted toilets" and found out that American Standard and Duravit make wall mounted toilets! I just asumed that no one made wall hangers for residential use. Does anyone know if I could get one of these toilets to fit my existing mounting brackets for my Case 3000? I will call American Standard and Duriavit tomorrow and find out from them, I hope. Just curious if anyone has changed them out. I really am getting tired of dorking around with these #50 ballcocks in these Cases.

                          Also, somewhere in the last couple of days, I know I saw some kinda trolley or dolly for moving those toilets around. Anybody know where I saw that or where I can get one. I think I am gonna have to lift one off of the wall to replace the water supply shutoff valve. There is not enough room to get to it otherwise. Either that, or I will have to cut thru the sheetrock on the backside. Really bad building/planning.

                          Steve: tested my flush valve today and it seems to be fine. A little plumbers grease as recommended seemed to help the fill valve plunger. thanks.

                          Tailwinds,
                          Mark

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