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How would you replace this gas line and valve?

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  • How would you replace this gas line and valve?

    Hi everyone,
    I want to install a gas fireplace insert in my 1985 masonry fireplace. It already has a gas line for the log igniter. The gas line comes up from the crawl space to a 90 then a nipple to a shutoff valve, then another nipple to a T handle valve, then through the firebox into the fireplace.

    The reasons why I would like to replace this short section along with the valves are:

    1. I'd like to have a shorter pipe to the firebox so a 90 can be as close to the side wall of the firebox to allow for installation of the insert. (A clearance concern.)

    2. The lever of the shutoff valve is frozen and cannot be turned by hand. So, I'd like to have a new valve that you can turn by hand. (Haven't used a wrench on this yet.)

    3. The T handle valve... It works, but I'd replace it just because the wall is open and everything else on either side of this valve will be replaced.

    I've worked with gas pipe before, but this setup has some problems.

    Here are my concerns:

    1. The original plumber apparently installed this setup before the exterior siding was installed. So, he had plenty of room to rotate things. Now that the siding is on, the valve bodies cannot be rotated because of the clearance between the valve stem / lever and the siding. So, what is the technique to use here? Any pointers?

    2. The original setup is made up of galvanized pipe and fittings to black iron pipe. The galvanized pipe is mortared into the firebox. I don't see any wrapping where is passes through the mortar. I would like to use black iron wrapped as it passes through into the masonry firebox. Then I would use firecaulk around the pipe to seal it rather than mortar. Mortar is no longer necessary here because this install will be a gas fireplace insert. Does this sound ok?

    I'm hoping to attach some photos here. If you look close enough, you'll see where the framers drove a nail in the hole where the gas pipe passes through. So, that tells me the gas line was installed before the siding.

    Thanks for your comments.
    Rick
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Rick15752; 05-23-2011, 10:40 PM.

  • #2
    Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

    as far as i know, that lever handle gas cock is not allowed in a concealed wall.

    the log lighter valve should be an easy fix to get it to properly work.

    rick.
    phoebe it is

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    • #3
      Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

      Hi Rick,
      Thanks for the review. I neglected to show the before view of the lever handle gas cock. It was not concealed. They placed a double gang mud ring in the drywall and covered it with a blank wall plate with thumb screws. So, it was "accessible." But, good luck trying to turn it by hand. The log lighter valve works fine.

      I guess it is not possible to replace any of these valves now without more demolition of the wall (exterior wall). Unless they make valve bodies with detachable levers. I guess I can leave the lever handle gas cock and log lighter valve alone and just replace the pipe that goes to the firebox.

      I can put a wrench on the lever handle and, hopefully, that will free it up.
      Rick

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

        the lever valve has a nut on the bottom side. it's almost like a cork taper. the valve body and plug has a grease that has hardned/ stiffened. loosen the nut and tap out the wedge a little. it then will pop out and allow you to clean and grease the body and wedge.

        a better way is to eliminate the valve as it's not really needed with the log lighter valve. or replace it with a rated ball valve design. aga/ csa rating.


        rick.
        phoebe it is

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

          Click image for larger version

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ID:	14727Rick,
          I took a few more pics of the two valves. The bottom of the lever valve is resting against the exterior sheathing. So, loosening that nut might be a pain. I guess I can use a pipe wrench to turn the valve slightly so I can access the nut. That way I could apply some grease.

          How would I go about eliminating the valve. The log lighter valve has a long threaded part that doesn't appear to separate from the valve body. So, that particular valve would not have the clearance to rotate. Is there a way to dissasemble this setup without cutting the pipe or demolishing more of the wall?

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          • #6
            Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

            if the valve is not leaking, then just leave it alone. but you will still need to keep it accessible. i don't believe it can be buried and covered,

            of course if you back out the piping, you'll have to open the back wall to spin the log lighter valve.

            rick.
            phoebe it is

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

              Yes. I'm leaning in that direction of not disturbing the valves. I'll check them for leaks while the wall is open. I may replace the pipe that goes from the log lighter valve into the firebox so that I can put an elbow closer against the wall of the firebox. And I'll provide access points, just like the original setup.

              What about the type of pipe and wrapping for that piece? I see what appears to be just galvanized pipe, unwrapped and mortared in place. Should this be black pipe?
              Should it be wrapped?

              Since this will be a fireplace insert, and not a wood burning fireplace, would the penetration need to be mortared?

              Or can I use fire caulking around the pipe?

              I know..... I can get these questions answered by my building inspector.

              Thanks again.
              Rick

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                You could cut the pipe out, then rebuild from that 90 on the right side of the pic. Then you could put a new valve in if it will fit. I'd try what Rick said first, just to see if you could free it up some.
                Last edited by nobackfall; 05-24-2011, 05:20 PM. Reason: fix spelling

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                  Not to be difficult, but That garbage needs to be ripped out and plumbed by a real plumber. From Your questions, it appears You don't have the experience. My people skills may be low but My honesty is not!
                  I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

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                  • #10
                    Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                    As mentioned you need access to those two valves, get a ball valve in place of the blade valve, call it one and done.
                    Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

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                    • #11
                      Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                      Exactly .Personally I would loose the loose key valve..A nice gas cock with a good size access panel and done..
                      Last edited by OLD1; 05-24-2011, 10:10 PM. Reason: sp
                      ''Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" Benjamin Franklin

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                      • #12
                        Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                        Any oneof us would have had the valve out and changed in less time than it takes to read this thread. Call a pro.
                        sigpic

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                        • #13
                          Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                          I wouldn`t touch it if I wasn`t a quallified gas plumber its just to dangerous putting ones family at risk to save a couple of dollars

                          Tony

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                          • #14
                            Re: How would you replace this gas line and valve?

                            Thanks everyone. I called a local plumber who recommended the same thing as Rick. I described the setup and asked if he would come out to bid the job. He suggested that I just leave the setup as is, as long as it is not leaking, and use the log lighter valve as the shutoff. I tested for leaks with LDR All Purpose Gas Leak Detection liquid and found none. So, unless there is another reason to disturb this setup, I'm done with it.
                            Rick

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