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  • #16
    Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

    The people involved in the decisions are engineers and inspectors, which in this case is a good thing. The people doing the testing are in the testing business, also a good thing.
    Last edited by Plumbus; 12-27-2013, 09:40 PM.

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    • #17
      Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

      Why run 3/4far on the hot side if you don't have too? Just takes it that much longer to get hot water. I run 1/2 inch for 1 regular bath with a w/c, tub/shower,and up to 2 no flow problems. I will run 3/4 on a master shower with multiple heads and rain heads.

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      • #18
        Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

        Originally posted by pipedope30 View Post
        Why run 3/4far on the hot side if you don't have too? Just takes it that much longer to get hot water. I run 1/2 inch for 1 regular bath with a w/c, tub/shower,and up to 2 no flow problems. I will run 3/4 on a master shower with multiple heads and rain heads.
        I like to run hot recirc. line , that's why !
        I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

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        • #19
          Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

          It depends on the size of the building and how far the fixtures are. I have been in many homes that only had the 3/4" line run from the meter to the cold side of the water heater. It then teed off from there with 1/2" to the bathroom, kitchen, and laundry room and 1/2" coming out the hot side doing the same. The water heater was 5' from the bathroom/kitchen area (mechanical room between the two) so the run was not that far, and the laundry was about 15' away. The key is to see if you get the minimum pressure at each fixture when all the other fixtures are running. These homes I described above never had any water pressure issues.
          Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
          A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
          Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
          Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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          • #20
            Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

            Originally posted by Plumber Punky View Post
            i do it as tool does. get the max volume to each location and reduce down where convenient. you never know what changes will take place in the future and having that line already there makes life that much easier.

            when i build my new house im taking 1" to all the areas... but most customers wont pay for this.

            Punky, just started reading this thread and you hit it right on the nail. Nowadays it comes down to what the Customer will pay for. Lets face it, if they really knew what we know and why we do things as suggested here things would more than likely be different. Downunder here we are "supposed" to work to what is known as Australian Standards 3500. This has different sections but the water supply is supposed to be calculated for "flow rate" to fixtures. With all of this BS GREENPLUMBER hype where the unscrupulous manufacturers(not all mind you but many) have managed to get compliance(god knows how) for their tap-sets and other it is basically open for abuse. We have dodgey so called Licensed Plumbers who do main replacements with 1/2" all the way.
            Back to the original I grew up with 3/4" as close to the fixture and then reduce to 1/2". Rarely do we find ring-mains except in commercial. We are supposed to calculate out as said previously but the true unknown and greatest variable is the town main pressure. I don't know what your systems are but I can guarantee that our mains vary, sometimes considerably too. Finally we don't have regulators here who do their jobs. Mind you they couldn't go toe to toe with many of us to prove one way or other. Then it comes back to cost of proving such for what fine or penalty.
            As we have progressed in many ways I personally feel we have regressed. We should be smarter but .......!!!!!
            Some accountants sat down and worked out that if you use exactly x amount of 3/4" and y amount of 1/2" the savings, minimal as we all know, extrapolated over lets say 20 houses(new ones that is) will boost their bottom line by a percentage in their minds huge but in reality the opposite.
            I am a fan of ring mains but cost always dictates the system. Pity we aren't all conscientious enough to buck the system and negotiate on performance over budget.

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            • #21
              Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

              Originally posted by thedcdude View Post
              I'm not actually running pipe. I inspect homes for a property management company. In one house the plumber, probably the owner of the house, adapted down to 1/2" coming out of the water heater. I knew this wasn't right and I just wondered how far the 3/4" pipe had to go before changing to 1/2". I see now that there's no simple answer to the question. Thanks

              Speaking only for downunder here it is rare to find 3/4' out of a hot water service. I cant say exactly what everyone thinks but we generally run our HWS at around 65deg C and pressure is generally over 500kpa. Our houses generally were smaller in size, old school 15 - 20 squares. Main bathroom and ensuite.
              This really gets thrown out the window mind you when retrofitting with Rinnai continuous flow units. Main line should be replaced/upsized to 3/4" but I reckon I could wait for years to see that happen.

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              • #22
                Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

                Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                Well if you are inspecting then what are the standards you inspect to if not the applicable codes.

                Its not a difficult answer, just look it up in the code book.

                Your answer would be that the pipe appears to be undersized for the number of fixtures units served.

                If you were insepcting as a plumbing inspector you do not have to tell them what is wrong, why? They are supposed to know, and, if you tell them and they address that infraction and YOU, the inspector are wrong or incomplete in your identification of the problem then you might cause the agency to be responsible for costs associated with making it right on the second fix. When I took the plumbing inspectors class that is how it was explained to me by the long time inspector teaching the class. It had often wondered why they never would go into detail on plan reviews and such, only marking up the drawing gs and telling you the section you were not in compliance with and leaving it for you to figure out where all the infractions were, because if they ID'd them and missed one then you have a problem.

                So short story, look it up and know what it should be.

                Bob, should have read this thread completely instead of commenting as I go. You are spot-on. In todays society there are too many looking for exact and precise or commonly known as PERFECT. What is lost in the translation is reality. What we have is the disease known as the Legal Fraternity sponsoring litigation at every turn. I forgot to mention an important point. Our Australian Standards are a "GUIDE" only. It is a reference point which is supposed to be the minimum we ware to work to. We do have the option of "performance" based where if we prove that it works appropriately and to or above the Aus Standard it can be accepted. However if we sway from the AS to performance based we then enter back into the realm of accepting liability for life of system. Where is common sense in all of this.
                Bob has said it perfectly here in that no one wants to put their name on anything for fear of repercussions aka litigation.

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                • #23
                  Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

                  Originally posted by thedcdude View Post
                  OK. I'm not a plumbing or code enforcement inspector. I do turnover inspections on rental properties. I just make a list of what the place needs to be ready for the next tenant. Many places will need to meet Section 8 requirements but the Section 8 inspector has no clue about building codes. They just go off a check list they're given. If water comes out of the faucet with a decent flow, they're satisfied. I was just curious what the rules were about pipe sizing. I though there may be some basic rules on it, but now I've learned that's not the case. Thanks

                  DC I reckon you are getting information overload. I think one of the most important things to do is respect that we are all generally trained well and do our jobs conscientiously with honesty and pride. There are rules which are generally minimum requirement and they vary with different states, countries and conditions. Speaking from experience with guys here similar to you we have found that there is questionable qualifications judging us. Good luck in your ventures.

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                  • #24
                    Re: What point do you go from 3/4" to 1/2" supply

                    Originally posted by Plumbus View Post
                    The people involved in the decisions are engineers and inspectors, which in this case is a good thing. The people doing the testing are in the testing business, also a good thing.


                    PLUMBUS I personally would be careful endorsing these guys as such. Engineers are part of the reason we are in this messy discussion as such. We have Inspectors coming from Engineering Degrees with absolutely no hands on background, theory only, dictating to us. Unfortunately the Judge likes Engineers because they went to University and speak similar words to the judge. We just went to tradeschool to learn how to do it right. As far as testing businesses, well there will always be variables. We all hope, even downunder, that these guys are realistic and not just theorists.

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