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  • PHCC-GLAA

    Rick.

    Plumbdog10 is right so I moved the discussion here as to not ruin the other thread.

    On the surface you are right they seem to all be about flat rating. However, PHCC has a great educational program and I enjoy going to their trade shows/conferences.

    I'd probably should go to more meetings as they have some good speakers but I never have time.

    I have belong to the PHCC for longer than I can remember but have only attended a few dozen meetings. One of my ex-employees was the president of the educational program and another was a first year instructor.

    Mark
    "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

    I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

  • #2
    MARK, AS FAR AS A TRADE SHOW GOES, IT'S GOOD, BUT COULD BE A LOT BETTER. THEY NEED TO RUN IT LIKE THE NATIONAL PUMPER SHOW IN NASHVILLE. CHARGE AN ADMISSION FEE. THIS WILL ELIMINATE ALL THE KIDS RUNNING AROUND AND STEALING EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT BOLTED DOWN. 8,000 PLUS PEOPLE IN 1 DAY IS A LITTLE OVERWHELMING. IF YOU ELIMINATE THE DISTRACTIONS, THEN THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE TO SHOP AND LEARN SOMETHING WILL HAVE THE TIME AND SALES REPS AVAILABLE FOR THEM. I'M ALWAYS THE FIRST THERE AND THE LAST TO LEAVE. THIS LAST SHOW I EVEN MISSED THE TRAM TO THE PARKING LOT. NOT GOOD WHEN YOU HAVE 100# OF MATERIAL AND A NEW PROPRESS TOOL TO CARRY 1/2 MILE. NEEDLESS TO SAY THE WIFE WASN'T THRILLED.
    AS FAR AS THEIR EDUCATIONAL PROGRAM, I WOULD DOUBT THAT THEY CAN HOLD A STICK AGAINST THE UA SCHOOL THAT I WENT TO.
    MY BUDDY IS A MEMBER JUST FOR THE DISCOUNT INSURANCE RATES. HE TOO WAS AT THE SAME DINNER I SPOKE ABOUT. WE WERE BOTH OUTCAST.
    WHY ARE THEY PUSHING SUCH A UNETHICAL PRACTICE OF RUNNING A PLUMBING BUSINESS?
    IF THEY ARE DOING IT RIGHT, THEN WHY DO I ALWAYS HEAR THE HORROR STORIES FROM THE NEW CUSTOMERS I GET. REMEMBER I DON'T ADVERTISE, IT'S ALL REFERRALS. THE MORE I READ IN THE REEVES JOURNAL, THE MORE I GET SICK THINKING ABOUT THEIR WAYS.
    MARK, GIVE ME YOUR SAY.
    RICK.

    Comment


    • #3
      In theory this year's show was suppose to cost $10.00 unless you pre-registered. I'm recouperating from a broken leg after a ladder accident so I paid to park in the hotel and had to drag myself around the show. As it turns out the tram would have got me right to the door where at the hotel I still had a long walk. I guess I'll know for next year.

      As for the flat rating, you're right the leadership is all about flat rating. I think it all started with George Brazil and his involment in the PHCC.

      I met George up in San Francisco at one of the National events. I asked him about the ethics of his rates. At the time he was charging a 50% higher labor rate than anyone else plus charged 4-times the hours it took anyone else to do the work.

      George handed me a card which offered a 10% discount and told me, when you done you give them a discount for the next call. If they're dumb enough to call you again you go back. If they're not you've already made your money.

      That was not the way I wanted to be remembered and I felt it was just wrong. Now George is gone but there are still a few franchises left. However, he started a new way of doing plumbing service.

      The system will work with uneducated residential customers who do not know any better and leave the real customers for the rest of us.

      Mark
      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK:
        MARK, AS FAR AS A TRADE SHOW GOES, IT'S GOOD, BUT COULD BE A LOT BETTER. THEY NEED TO RUN IT LIKE THE NATIONAL PUMPER SHOW IN NASHVILLE. CHARGE AN ADMISSION FEE. THIS WILL ELIMINATE ALL THE KIDS RUNNING AROUND AND STEALING EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT BOLTED DOWN. 8,000 PLUS PEOPLE IN 1 DAY IS A LITTLE OVERWHELMING. IF YOU ELIMINATE THE DISTRACTIONS, THEN THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE TO SHOP AND LEARN SOMETHING WILL HAVE THE TIME AND SALES REPS AVAILABLE FOR THEM. I'M ALWAYS THE FIRST THERE AND THE LAST TO LEAVE. THIS LAST SHOW I EVEN MISSED THE TRAM TO THE PARKING LOT. NOT GOOD WHEN YOU HAVE 100# OF MATERIAL AND A NEW PROPRESS TOOL TO CARRY 1/2 MILE. NEEDLESS TO SAY THE WIFE WASN'T THRILLED.
        AS FAR AS THEIR EDUCATIONAL PROGRAM, I WOULD DOUBT THAT THEY CAN HOLD A STICK AGAINST THE UA SCHOOL THAT I WENT TO.
        MY BUDDY IS A MEMBER JUST FOR THE DISCOUNT INSURANCE RATES. HE TOO WAS AT THE SAME DINNER I SPOKE ABOUT. WE WERE BOTH OUTCAST.
        WHY ARE THEY PUSHING SUCH A UNETHICAL PRACTICE OF RUNNING A PLUMBING BUSINESS?
        IF THEY ARE DOING IT RIGHT, THEN WHY DO I ALWAYS HEAR THE HORROR STORIES FROM THE NEW CUSTOMERS I GET. REMEMBER I DON'T ADVERTISE, IT'S ALL REFERRALS. THE MORE I READ IN THE REEVES JOURNAL, THE MORE I GET SICK THINKING ABOUT THEIR WAYS.
        MARK, GIVE ME YOUR SAY.
        RICK.
        Plumber Rick,

        If you are refering to the NAPHCC show at the Pomona Fair Grounds (which I think you are) I have not gone in the last two years. I don't have any problems with kids going ( I started taking my Godson when he was two.

        My problem with the show is that it became a show for cheap gimmick salesman. As a matter of fact, I enjoy taking my godson, because I see it as a test. When I approach a table, and the salesman is concerned that a 4 year old may damage his product, I know it will not hold up on a construction site.

        When I have approached the Ridgid table, they welcomed Jack (my godson), and allowed him to touch anything he wanted. They had no fear that a small child would harm their equipment.

        I wish there was a show dedicated to the industrial/commercial/institutional end of the business.

        the dog
        the dog

        Comment


        • #5
          DOG, THE PHCC TRADE SHOW IN POMONA YOU'RE REFERRING TO IS TOO KID FRIENDLY. EVERY TABLE HAS CANDY AND GIMMICKS, PROBLEM IS THAT THE PARENTS TYPICALLY LET THE KIDS RUN FREE AND GOBBLE UP EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT BOLTED DOWN. THERE ARE VENDORS THAT NO LONGER RENT A BOOTH. ALSO THE RENT FOR A BOOTH IS SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS TO START WITH. AND THAT'S A SMALL SPACE. THEN IF YOU NEED POWER OR A FORKLIFT TO SET UP, YOU CAN IMAGINE WHAT THE TEAMSTERS GET. DID YOU EVER WAIT IN THE FOOD/ SNACK BAR LINE. 20 MINUTES LATER, 3 TIMES THE COST AND THEY ARE OUT OF EVERYTHING. DOG THIS IS ALL TRUE. I'VE ONLY MISSED 1 TRADE SHOW IN 20+ YEARS. FROM PASADENA- POMONA. THE 1 I MISSED IS BECAUSE I WAS IN NASHVILLE FOR THE PUMPER/ CLEANER SHOW. THIS IS A SHOW. BIGGEST PROBLEM IS, IT'S SO BIG THAT YOU NEED ALL 4 DAYS TO COMPLETE IT. ALSO YOU'RE STUCK IN THE OPRYLAND HOTEL, AND ONCE AGAIN THE COST OF FOOD IS OUTRAGEOUS. IT WAS LESS EXPENSIVE THE LAST DAY TO EAT AT THE AIRPORT. PLENTY OF WELL QUALIFIED SALESPEOPLE. THE NEXT SHOW IN POMONA IS IN JUNE AND WILL NOT OVERLAP WITH THE NASHVILLE SHOW AS IN EVERY YEAR PAST.
          IN MY OPINION, IT'S FINE TO MAKE THE SHOWS OPEN TO ALL, BUT THE VENDORS NEED TO STOP MAKING IT SO KID FRIENDLY. CUT OUT THE FREEBIES AND CANDY. ELIMINATE THE FREE FOR ALL ATMOSPHERE AND GET DOWN TO DEALING WITH THE REAL BUYERS.
          DOG IT WOULD BE NICE TO CATCH BREAKFAST WITH YOU AND MARK(TOUTAHNOW) THE MORNING OF THE TRADE SHOW. WHO KNOWS, I MIGHT EVEN BRING YA A BONE.
          RICK
          PS. I KNOW THAT IT'S A LONG TIME OFF, BUT SOMETHING TELLS ME THAT WE WILL STILL BE IN TOUCH.

          Comment


          • #6
            To show you how long I've been attending the PHCC Trade Show the first one I attended was at their old building on Beverly Boulevard. It had maybe 12 vendors but the only two I remember was Goldak and Quadra-Plex. The only reason I remember them is I bought equipment from both of them during the show. I think the room we were in was around 400 sq. ft.

            I have never been to the Pumper Show but it sounds like the National PHCC show in size.

            Mark
            "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

            I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK:
              DOG, THE PHCC TRADE SHOW IN POMONA YOU'RE REFERRING TO IS TOO KID FRIENDLY. EVERY TABLE HAS CANDY AND GIMMICKS, PROBLEM IS THAT THE PARENTS TYPICALLY LET THE KIDS RUN FREE AND GOBBLE UP EVERYTHING THAT IS NOT BOLTED DOWN. THERE ARE VENDORS THAT NO LONGER RENT A BOOTH. ALSO THE RENT FOR A BOOTH IS SEVERAL THOUSAND DOLLARS TO START WITH. AND THAT'S A SMALL SPACE. THEN IF YOU NEED POWER OR A FORKLIFT TO SET UP, YOU CAN IMAGINE WHAT THE TEAMSTERS GET. DID YOU EVER WAIT IN THE FOOD/ SNACK BAR LINE. 20 MINUTES LATER, 3 TIMES THE COST AND THEY ARE OUT OF EVERYTHING. DOG THIS IS ALL TRUE. I'VE ONLY MISSED 1 TRADE SHOW IN 20+ YEARS. FROM PASADENA- POMONA. THE 1 I MISSED IS BECAUSE I WAS IN NASHVILLE FOR THE PUMPER/ CLEANER SHOW. THIS IS A SHOW. BIGGEST PROBLEM IS, IT'S SO BIG THAT YOU NEED ALL 4 DAYS TO COMPLETE IT. ALSO YOU'RE STUCK IN THE OPRYLAND HOTEL, AND ONCE AGAIN THE COST OF FOOD IS OUTRAGEOUS. IT WAS LESS EXPENSIVE THE LAST DAY TO EAT AT THE AIRPORT. PLENTY OF WELL QUALIFIED SALESPEOPLE. THE NEXT SHOW IN POMONA IS IN JUNE AND WILL NOT OVERLAP WITH THE NASHVILLE SHOW AS IN EVERY YEAR PAST.
              IN MY OPINION, IT'S FINE TO MAKE THE SHOWS OPEN TO ALL, BUT THE VENDORS NEED TO STOP MAKING IT SO KID FRIENDLY. CUT OUT THE FREEBIES AND CANDY. ELIMINATE THE FREE FOR ALL ATMOSPHERE AND GET DOWN TO DEALING WITH THE REAL BUYERS.
              DOG IT WOULD BE NICE TO CATCH BREAKFAST WITH YOU AND MARK(TOUTAHNOW) THE MORNING OF THE TRADE SHOW. WHO KNOWS, I MIGHT EVEN BRING YA A BONE.
              RICK
              PS. I KNOW THAT IT'S A LONG TIME OFF, BUT SOMETHING TELLS ME THAT WE WILL STILL BE IN TOUCH.
              Rick,

              I have respect for your knowledge of service plumbing, and for you as a individual. But I don't see us eating breakfast togather.

              If you read my post, you would realize I like the fact that the Pomona show is kid friendly. My problem is with the a**kissing salesman, pushing worthless products that annoy me. It also annoys me that you have to pay $10.00 if you forgot to register ahead of time.

              Why would I pay $10.00 to see products that I have already tried at mini-shows at Furguson, Todd (excuse me, now Hughes), etc.

              The reason I stopped going two years ago was the above.

              I don't see a problem with kids at a plumbing show. Any show my Godson Jack is not welcome at I can easily bypass.
              the dog

              Comment


              • #8
                I'm with Plumbdog10 to a point related to kids. I see the Pomona show as more of a family event than anything else. I have six grown kids and 11 (soon to be 13) grand kids. As long as the kid is behaving and the parent is responsible I say bring them along.

                That being said while I was at the Metrotech booth this year a 12-ish year old kid walked up and was playing with the headphones of a H-4000 leak locator. When he turned to leave he was still wearing the headphones and dropped a $4,000 locator on the ground.

                The salesman looked at me like he was my kid and I quickly straightened him out. The kids father was a couple of booths down and wasn't even watching the kid. That kid and his father should have stayed at home as far as I am concerned.

                Mark
                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                Comment


                • #9
                  DOG, I WISH THAT EVERYBODY HAD TO PAY $10.00 TO ATTEND. NOT JUST THE ONES THAT WERE TO0 FORGETFULL TO REGISTER IN ADVANCE BY MAIL, FAX, OR ONLINE. THERE IS 2 MONTHS TO DO THIS AND YOU CAN PREREGISTER UP TO THE DAY BEFORE. WHY NOT REGISTER AND JUST NOT COME. IT'S LIKE THE PEOPLE WHO COMPLAIN ABOUT NOT SENDING IN THE UPC FOR A REBATE.
                  I FEEL THAT WE ARE PAYING FOR PARKING, AN OVERPRICED HOTDOG AND COKE. ANOTHER 10 BUCKS IS NOT GOING TO KEEP ME HOME. WHEN I GO TO THESE SHOWS, I GO TO SEE ALL THE NEW ITEMS, TALK TO THE SALESMEN, AND SPEND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS ON NEW EQUIPTMENT. SOME OF WHICH I TAKE HOME WITH ME. IF I HAD TO COMPETE WITH EVERYBODY THERE, THERE JUST WOULDN'T BE ENOUGH TIME AND SALES REPS TO HELP. AS UTAH ALSO STATED ABOUT THE 12 YEAR OLD WHO RAN OFF WITH THE HEADPHONES STILL ATTACHED TO A 4 THOUSAND DOLLAR LOCATOR.
                  THIS SHOW IS FOR PEOPLE IN THE PLUMBING TRADE. A FAIR OR THE DRAG STRIP MUSEUM IS A GOOD PLACE FOR A FAMILY OUTING.
                  IF THIS WAS A MEDICAL TRADE SHOW, LIKE SOME OF MY CLIENTS AND FRIENDS GO TO, THEY DON'T BRING CHILDREN.
                  I BLAME THE PARENTS JUST AS MUCH AS THE KIDS. THIS IS A PROFESSIONAL TRADE SHOW, NOT AN AMUSEMENT PARK. I DON'T HAVE CHILDREN YET, BUT WHEN I DO, THERE WILL BE PLENY OF OPPORTUNITIES TO BRING THEM TO A MINI IN STORE TRADE SHOW. IF THE KIDS WERE WITHIN REACH OF THEIR PARENTS, AND THE PARENTS ALLOWED THIS TO GO ON, THEN THEY SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE. I'VE PERSONALLY SPOKEN TO VENDORS THAT NO LONGER DISPLY AT THIS SHOW. REASON BEING IS THE COST FOR DISPLAY SPACE, AND THE FACT THAT ITEMS ON DISPLAY WERE BEING STOLEN. IN FACT 1 OF MY SUPPLIERS WENT TO GRAB A SLOW, OVERPRICED LUNCH AND CAME BACK TO AN EMPTY BOOTH.
                  I'M SURE THAT WHEN YOU BROUGHT YOUR GODSON, HE WAS IN CLOSE PROXIMITY TO YOU. I ALSO FEEL THAT YOU AND OTHER RESPONSIBLE PARENTS WOULD NOT ALLOW THEIR KIDS TO STEAL. ALL IT TAKES IS A FEW BAD APPLES TO SPOIL IT FOR ALL. I KNOW THIS SOUNDS HARSH, BUT I'VE SEEN THIS YEAR AFTER YEAR.
                  IF ANYONE FROM THE PHCC IS READING THIS, PLEASE DO SOMETHING TO ADDRESS THESE CONCERNS. WHILE YOUR AT IT, MAYBE YOU CAN DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE VERY SLOW SERVICE, OVERPRICED, AND UNDERSTOCKED FOOD VENDORS. YOU WOULD THINK WITH 8000 PEOPLE ATTENDING EACH YEAR, THEY MIGHT BE BETTER PREPARED. IT'S TIME CONSUMING AND TOO EXPENSIVE TO GO OFFSITE TO EAT. SURE I CAN PACK MY OWN LUNCH, BUT I DON'T AND MOST OTHERS DON'T.
                  DOG, I STILL MAKE THE OFFER FOR BREAKFAST AND EXTEND IT TO YOU GODSON TOO.
                  RICK.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Rick,

                    In my opinion I've never seen the show hampered by children. I've went for about fifteen years and never walked away with this impression. What I have seen is this:

                    1) Drunken service plumbers, which at one point I almost had to kick-*** on because of their rude behavior.

                    2) Booths with worthless items hawked by salesman assisted by "Perfect 10" girls,etc. As a single guy, God knows I love a girl in a bathing suit; but, I find it a little insulting as a professional to be thought of as an idiot who will like a product because large breasted women are present.

                    3) Booths which have bogus contests to rope you in. At a show a few years ago a barker was pushing his product with a big wheel you could spin to win a tee-shirt. My buddy happened to walk behind the wheel and say that it was weighted. The guy gave us each a tee shirt to keep us quiet. Which we didn't.

                    4) The item that was dropped by a teenager. Do you really believe that this piece of equipment will be purchased and used by your emplyees, and never dropped? Do you think that the manufacturer was going to sell this item? Find out now how tough this equipment is.

                    5) These people sitting at booths are not doing a favor for you. They are there to sell you on their product. If they don't want to spend the money to sell to this market (Los Angeles) so be it.

                    6) It just got to the point that I felt like a rube in a carnaval. Like I said, I see all the new products through local mini-shows.

                    In my new kinder and gentler mode (and, damn this is hard) I'm leaving this thread. But I will say this: I have been more offended by drunken service plumbers, than I ever had been by children.

                    the dog
                    the dog

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Did someone say beautiful large breasted women? Man I need to make time to go to some of these shows.

                      All kidding aside the local suppliers around here usually offer some very informative material and tool shows on a bi annual basis. Its all professionals on an invitational basis so there is little monkey business, the few idiots who drink themselves stupid usually sit or stand in a corner out of the way. A few have giveaways and snacks. Once won a small vacation. These are the only shows I usually ever take time for, when the manufacturers offer week long training sessions and are willing to pay for expenses then I figure they are going to be serious enough to be worth my lost time and travel. If I have to pay them to sell me something then I have a problem.

                      I also agree that Flat Rate pricing is a total rip off of the customers. The whole attitude of rape the customer once and who cares about later is a huge part of why a lot of American companies are having a problem right now.
                      Work hard, Play hard, Sleep easy.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        PLUMBER, SINCE I CAN'T GET DOG TO BITE FOR THE FREE BREAKFAST, I EXTEND THE OFFER TO YOU. BUT YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE YOUR OWN TRANSPORTATION. I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO SELL. AS FAR AS THE LARGE BREASTED GIRLS GO, THAT WAS THEN, THIS IS NOW. LAST YEAR WAS THE RIDGID CALENDAR COVER GIRL. LONG LINE TO GET A SIGNED CALENDAR. THE ONLY OTHER GIRLS ARE THE CLIPPER GIRLS, AND A WATER CLEAN UP CO. THAT HAS A HAND FULL OF GIRLS TO ATTRACT ATTENTION TO THEIR BOOTH. TRUTHFULLY THE GIRLS ARE NOT A REASON TO TRAVEL TO THE SHOW. THE VAST ASSORTMENT OF NEW AND INNOVATIVE PRODUCTS ARE A GOOD ENOUGH REASON TO ATTEND. AS FAR AS DRUNKEN PLUMBERS GO, I CAN SAY AGAIN THAT WAS THEN, THIS IS NOW. IF A PERSON WANTS TO WAIT 20 MINUTES IN LINE TO BUY AN OVERPRICED BEER, WELL THERE IS 1 IN EVERY CROWD. AS A MATTER OF FACT, THERE WAS A POLICE SOBRIETY CHECK POINT LAST YEAR AT THE PARKING LOT EXIT.
                        DOG ONCE AGAIN, IT'S NOT ALL KIDS, BUT A SMALL # OF KIDS AND DRUNKS THAT CAN SPOIL AN EVENT THAT COMES ONCE A YEAR. 8000 ATTEND AND 20 WRECK HAVOC.
                        I GUESS I'LL HAVE TO WAIT TILL JUNE FOR THE UPDATE.
                        RICK.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I remember a bunch of large breast women at a contest for installing a garbage disposal or something. It was right at the door so it made it hard to get through the crowd.

                          It seems like the shows are starting to try and attract more plumbers and fewer contractors. I think that is a mistake for the manufacturers but a good idea for the supply houses.

                          I think Furegson had people in line all day for the free tool bags but what was with Todd's. All Todd's did was stand around a big truck with their name on it.

                          I think I spent around $4,000 at the show. I was going to buy my SeeSnake there as well because of the 10% discount but I found Toolup.com's prices were better and no sales tax.

                          Mark
                          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                          Comment

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