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  • #46
    theron, where have you been hiding for the last few days?

    thanks for the support.

    rick.

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    • #47
      Rick, thanks for your detailed reply.

      Far as the Kohlers go, we are in absolute agreement. They stink. Some of them have the strangest valve setups. Some work on a float type mechanism (sorry I don't know the technical name of these type valves) and others are just plain incomprehensible to me why they are so complicated. So many moving parts to go bad. But what really gets me is the fact you cannot simply change out those gadgets in them for a regular old Flushmaster valve because of the way the tank is designed. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. And here there is only one parts supply that carries the replacement valves for them and they are the highest prices supply in town (union shop). I could get them in thru other suppliers but then I have to wait for it to get shipped and that does'nt work when a customer only has one toilet in their condo or small house. And here's the kicker....the Kohler valves cost around 100$. That's about the same price I used to pay for a complete old-style toilet! And it seems the Kohlers don't last all that long either, again due to the fact they simply have too many moving parts and are just way over-engineered to the point of unreliability. I avoid Kohler products l;ike the plague.

      To reply to both Theron's and your posts concerning the frequency of problems with them, I can readily say my experience is totally different and opposite of yours here. 80% of my augering jobs are on the newer water saving closets. At least! And again I'll say that on the larger condo and office complexes I have maintenance contracts with, when an old style toilet breaks or cracks and has to be replaced, almost invariably frequent plug-ups occur after the new water saver is put in to replace the old one, while the rest of the older toilets that are still in place chug along just fine with far fewer problems. So I'm just going by experience. I'm not saying you both are absolutely wrong, it could be maybe the water savers I'm used to dealing with are the cheaper models other than the ones you are recommending, or maybe I'm just unlucky, or maybe waste line plumbing here in Alaska is cursed by the plumbing gods. It's just my experience that the water savers not only are problematic but also practically impossible at times to auger.....I can't tell you how many times I simply had to lift up the toilet and clear the trap from underneath because it got SO plugged up. The older 3.5G toilets almost NEVER give me the same problems. In commercial applications where water savers were installed, like hotels and restaurants, whenever I recommended just yanking the damn things and replacing them again with a large capacity regular toilet, the problems in almost every case simply disappeared. I can't go by anything else but personal experience and observations.

      I charge usually around 90$/hour for an average augering/snake job. Sometimes less if it's a really easy one. That's an hour minimum call-out. Sure, it's alot of money for an average Joe-Homeowner. A couple of these calls and a customer already is up around the same price as a 2 or 300$ toilet like you are recommending. So yes, I see your point there. But that's why I strongly discourage use of water savers in the first place. On average, whenever I have installed a older style 3.5, I have never heard back from those custeomers again. When a water saver is put in, I can count on hearing back from them within a couple months, as soon as one of their kids put just a little too much toilet paper in one, or somebody throws a tampon in it.

      Really, I'm not complaining. They keep me in plenty of business. I just feel sorry for the population at large, having themselves forced by the government to buy these pieces of crap.

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      • #48
        Rick,
        My wife and I just bought a house so i've been really busy gutting it. Also my laptop bit the dust so i have to take it to apple to get it fixed, so i'm down to one computer. I'll be here; just not as frequently for a little while.

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