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  • Seasoned vs Training Workers

    I hate training new guys, yea they're cheaper, but in the long run a seasoned/older tradesman/person is going to make me more money and this is why. All of these are from my opinion and past experiences. This does not profile every person out there. What I'm looking at, is someone in their late 30's to early 60's vs 18 and up. Does not mean I will discriminate against the future young workers, I do try to use both.

    More then likely, he/she is not a thief.

    More then likely, you don't have to teach him/her anything.

    More then likely, you can go do bids and not have to worry.

    More then likely, he/she won't be goofing around and wasting your time.

    More then likely, they won't blame someone else for something that went wrong.

    More then likely, his/her work will look awesome.

    More then likely, they will respect your tools and not abuse them.

    More then likely, he/she will put in extra time and doesn't complain to meet a deadline.

    More then likely, he/she is a problem solver.

    More then likely, he/she is dependable.

    More then likely, he/she will never ask for an early draw on his pay.

    More then likely, his/her vehicle runs.

    More then likely, he/she won't be there half tanked and hung over.

    More then likely, he/she is not on drugs.

    More then likely, he/she is a legal US citizen.

    More then likely, you won't be hearing about his/her problems at home.

    More then likely, he'll/she'll be truthful to you.

    More then likely, he/she will measure twice and cut once.

    More then likely, they won't lose your tools, because of self awareness.

    More then likely, they will respect the Home Owner, when on the job.

    More then likely, injury risk is a lot lower (another self awareness).

    More then likely, a seasoned tradeperson will respect you and your decisions.

    More then likely, they won't leave me after a year.

    So lets see if you can add to my list.
    Last edited by garager; 03-28-2008, 08:21 PM.
    Great Link for a Construction Owner/Tradesmen, and just say Garager sent you....

    http://www.contractorspub.com

    A good climbing rope will last you 3 to 5 years, a bad climbing rope will last you a life time !!!

  • #2
    Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

    Dang, so far I must of covered everything, not one addition to this post.
    Great Link for a Construction Owner/Tradesmen, and just say Garager sent you....

    http://www.contractorspub.com

    A good climbing rope will last you 3 to 5 years, a bad climbing rope will last you a life time !!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

      Mark,
      I've ran crews for years.Burned through them all.Laborers who know absolutely no english to a contractor that just got into town and was trying to make a name for himself.

      I do appreciate your frustration with the ignorant.But for me it is harder to find a qualified tradesman with minimal baggage than to go through 10 kids.The kids I can usually figure out in a few days.Many of the pros still have issues and disseptive ways out here.A real tradesman for hire is vertually non existant under $35.00 an hour in these parts.When I find a good person to groom I would like to think I could get him self reliant and hanging pipe with minimal supervision in 4-6 mo's for less than half the price.

      Again I'm sorry for your frustration on the state attitude of our up-and-comings.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

        I'm in a constant state of training new guys and I like it this way. Young guys have no bad habits to undo and they're more receptive to learning new things. They do mess up now and then but I kick them in the a$$ and get them back on track. I set their work tempo and ethics. You just can't leave them alone and you have to work less and supervise more. Older guys are set in their ways and not likely to change their work habits. Just because someone has been doing a trade for 10 years doesn't always means he has 10 years of experience. He might have learned the wrong way the first year and continued the wrong way for the next nine years.
        Buy cheap, buy twice.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

          Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
          Mark,
          I've ran crews for years.Burned through them all.Laborers who know absolutely no english to a contractor that just got into town and was trying to make a name for himself.

          I do appreciate your frustration with the ignorant.But for me it is harder to find a qualified tradesman with minimal baggage than to go through 10 kids.The kids I can usually figure out in a few days.Many of the pros still have issues and disseptive ways out here.A real tradesman for hire is vertually non existant under $35.00 an hour in these parts.When I find a good person to groom I would like to think I could get him self reliant and hanging pipe with minimal supervision in 4-6 mo's for less than half the price.

          Again I'm sorry for your frustration on the state attitude of our up-and-comings.
          No biggie Adam, I too have to pay high wages to have a pro with me. But then they stay with me for years. My experiences with the young bucks are, I spend a lot of time with them and teach everything I can. I try to make each day a day to look forward for them. In less then a year or around a year time, they leave, mainly due to, not liking the type of work. Maybe its a Minnesota thing, but I really thought they were workers up here. I had one kid, falling a sleep on a ladder one day, and I fired him for this, duhhh.

          Ya, I guess I posted what I did, out of frustration, but I swear, I can make more money with a pro vs a rookie. Of course my bids will go up, for the compensation of hiring a seasoned worker...
          Great Link for a Construction Owner/Tradesmen, and just say Garager sent you....

          http://www.contractorspub.com

          A good climbing rope will last you 3 to 5 years, a bad climbing rope will last you a life time !!!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

            Garager,
            I've got a couple for you.

            -- They can come onto a jobsite and work quickly and consistently with your other skilled workers.

            -- They can ANTICIPATE what the other workers need and be there to assist without being asked or told.

            Reminds me of a job that I helped a friend with two years ago. Five different guys came together -- all skilled -- to help him frame his cabin in the woods.
            Within about a day, all five worked together like they had been raised in the same household. Anticipated what went on, and what needed to be done. Minimum of talking to get the job done. Not that we didn't yak it up during break time, but work time, everybody pulled together. One guy I worked closely with, could just point and people knew what was going on. Was like magic. Some of the best, and quickest days I can ever remember. They just flew by. House looks like a million bucks. I ended up wiring the place not long after with another guy. Not a cross word at all, no problems, and everything passed inspection with flying colors. Do that with a rookie crew.
            Jim Don

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

              Originally posted by JimDon View Post
              Garager,
              I've got a couple for you.

              -- They can come onto a jobsite and work quickly and consistently with your other skilled workers.

              -- They can ANTICIPATE what the other workers need and be there to assist without being asked or told.

              Reminds me of a job that I helped a friend with two years ago. Five different guys came together -- all skilled -- to help him frame his cabin in the woods.
              Within about a day, all five worked together like they had been raised in the same household. Anticipated what went on, and what needed to be done. Minimum of talking to get the job done. Not that we didn't yak it up during break time, but work time, everybody pulled together. One guy I worked closely with, could just point and people knew what was going on. Was like magic. Some of the best, and quickest days I can ever remember. They just flew by. House looks like a million bucks. I ended up wiring the place not long after with another guy. Not a cross word at all, no problems, and everything passed inspection with flying colors. Do that with a rookie crew.
              Jim Don
              So then I'm not, the only one who feels this way, you do know what I mean...

              Thanks for the add ons.....
              Great Link for a Construction Owner/Tradesmen, and just say Garager sent you....

              http://www.contractorspub.com

              A good climbing rope will last you 3 to 5 years, a bad climbing rope will last you a life time !!!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                Been reading the responses and think that being in the military give you an unrealistic view on the subject. I'll leave my previous post but think that when I become a civilian again my attitude will change.
                Buy cheap, buy twice.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                  a year ago i had a new helper start and they put him with me and said dont make him quit ,i will tell you the way it is and some dont like it . well after a week they were surprised that he was still around .he was 22 yrs old and he had a work attitude and wanted to learn .a year later he is helping me on a big job and is taking care ok all the duct work and doing it with out my help much .

                  i have another new helper and he is going to be the same .there is another new helper that started with some one else and now is on my job .if he was giving to me first he may have work out to be a good worker but he is slow working and walking ,thats because the other foreman dont push like i do .

                  i tell them when they start that i will teach them what i know and i will take your ideas into consideration but it is up to you to do the rest . then about a month after they start they are working by there self and im not hard on them as much
                  Charlie

                  My seek the peek fundraiser page
                  http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                  http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                  new work pictures 12/09
                  http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                    It's just my personal bias, but I'm in the business of training young men and women to be competent plumbing and HVAC technicians. The trades (all of them) are experiancing a staffing crisis. Most young people either have no clue or no desire to enter the trades. As a group we have done an absolutly horrible job in the past 30 years of marketing and extolling our trades. In New Hampshire the ratio of master's to journeymen is 3 to 1 (masters) It should be the other way around.
                    I have no problem with hiring experianced tech's but I get a much greater sense of accomplishment and pride in training a young person to competently ply his or her trade.
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                      It's just my personal bias, but I'm in the business of training young men and women to be competent plumbing and HVAC technicians. The trades (all of them) are experiancing a staffing crisis. Most young people either have no clue or no desire to enter the trades. As a group we have done an absolutly horrible job in the past 30 years of marketing and extolling our trades. In New Hampshire the ratio of master's to journeymen is 3 to 1 (masters) It should be the other way around.
                      I have no problem with hiring experianced tech's but I get a much greater sense of accomplishment and pride in training a young person to competently ply his or her trade.
                      well when i can convince my wife to move to NH then i will look you up for a job
                      you can see my resume here http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/
                      and i will be up in July for the mt Washington seek the peak and i will have to stop and say hi
                      Charlie

                      My seek the peek fundraiser page
                      http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                      http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                      new work pictures 12/09
                      http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                        Hawk, I like you, you're a good guy but, If you end up putting one of those damn "This car climbed MT. Washington" bumpah stickahs (Mainer speak for bumper sticker) on your car, then your out of the will.
                        INSIGHT PIPE is now Maine Drain Serving most of ME with no charge for travel! 207-431-6232 is nolonger a working # our NEW # is 207-355-1476
                        Sewer main snaking (roto rooting). Sink clogs. Sewer backup. Pipe inspection/locating. No Dig trenchless repair. Root clog removal.We are NOT to replace your local Plumber, as we do not do plumbing. WE ARE YOUR DRAIN CLEANING EXPERTS!!! www.sewermaine.com waterville winslow bangor augusta skowhegan fairfield pittsfield oakland

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                          Originally posted by Gene Bickford View Post
                          Hawk, I like you, you're a good guy but, If you end up putting one of those damn "This car climbed MT. Washington" bumpah stickahs (Mainer speak for bumper sticker) on your car, then your out of the will.
                          i'm walking up
                          Charlie

                          My seek the peek fundraiser page
                          http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                          http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                          new work pictures 12/09
                          http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                            I've had a fair amount of jobs in my days and one thing I've learned is it doesn't pay to train with the nice guy. I prefer the type "A" personality, The old school sour bastard or, former Military men. They all tell it like it is. They don't mess around and worry about my "feelings" and ***** foot around. Once I have gained their respect they start to open up and once they do they have more experience/knowledge to offer.
                            INSIGHT PIPE is now Maine Drain Serving most of ME with no charge for travel! 207-431-6232 is nolonger a working # our NEW # is 207-355-1476
                            Sewer main snaking (roto rooting). Sink clogs. Sewer backup. Pipe inspection/locating. No Dig trenchless repair. Root clog removal.We are NOT to replace your local Plumber, as we do not do plumbing. WE ARE YOUR DRAIN CLEANING EXPERTS!!! www.sewermaine.com waterville winslow bangor augusta skowhegan fairfield pittsfield oakland

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Seasoned vs Training Workers

                              Originally posted by HVAC HAWK View Post
                              i'm walking up
                              OH.. So your getting the "I was rescued atop MT. Washington and all I got was this lousy T-shirt" T-Shirt......
                              INSIGHT PIPE is now Maine Drain Serving most of ME with no charge for travel! 207-431-6232 is nolonger a working # our NEW # is 207-355-1476
                              Sewer main snaking (roto rooting). Sink clogs. Sewer backup. Pipe inspection/locating. No Dig trenchless repair. Root clog removal.We are NOT to replace your local Plumber, as we do not do plumbing. WE ARE YOUR DRAIN CLEANING EXPERTS!!! www.sewermaine.com waterville winslow bangor augusta skowhegan fairfield pittsfield oakland

                              Comment

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