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  • #16
    Re: Poor excuse for a member!

    I'm like you Rich.

    I prefer the Huskys but will put a pair of opened up 2" no-hub bands around a 4" fernco in a pinch.


    Also, I jetted roots out of a 4" clay service today on a pm basis. No problem atm but know they are there from prior experience. Told the HO I needed to camera to do a good thorough job, but HO didn't want to pay for it. 'Just run a snake through it.' 'No, you don't need to pull the toilet, you can do it from the (2") c/o on the closet wall.' I pulled the toilet and jetted and camera'd to make sure I'd got them all. Didn't charge for the camera, recommended on invoice every 2-3 years, no camera fee this time only.

    I tell that story because, like the huskys, if you are going to half-*** it, why show up at all?
    Last edited by Ace Sewer; 11-15-2011, 05:44 PM.
    This is my reminder to myself that no good will ever come from discussing politics or religion with anyone, ever.

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    • #17
      Re: Poor excuse for a member!

      Originally posted by richinflorida View Post
      Just to be clear: The sentiment that no plumber in his right mind would spend big $$$ on band over Ferncos isn't mine; I'm the one looking to buy them. Rather, it's the mindset I observe from many peers and the guys at some supply counters. "You do realize these are $18 a piece, right?"
      "Uh huh". "Still want 'em?" "Yes". "You know you could buy these Ferncos for $4.50... Most guys use Ferncos; I hardly ever sell these. Too damn expensive."
      It's sad. $12-$18 is a lot of money for something that's going to be buried for years and hopefully not give a homeowner any trouble or failure. It's battle just keeping stocked up on certain products here, especially if they aren't the cheapest junk made. The cost of those bands gets passed to the customer just like every other expense. If a 4 clamp band is too much $$, I'm not your plumber. Times are tough, been so for a while, I've been as poor as anyone in my life, best of luck with your plumbing issues. The bands are far superior to Ferncos whether they meet code or not. Ferguson told me the got more 3" heavy bands in. I do pay top $$ at that supplier, but they'll also get anything you want.
      Oh, I wasn't implying that those were your thoughts, I just don't understand the mind set sometimes of other Plumbers. I think we've all seen fernco's that failed underground...I know I've seen my fair share of them. But I blame a lot of that on improper back filling, with improper installation being a close second.

      Here in Pennsylvania, most sewers I see are 4' - 8' deep. We are also required to have a bed of modified stone down on each sewer installation, that also covers the top of the pipe as well. Back filling and tamping in 6" lifts...makes it a tedious process for us. I've seen guys just back fill with out tamping, and they are just begging for major problems down the road when that ground settles. 8' of dirt is a lot of weight...compared to 2' in some of your area's and around the country. We have to be below the frost line here @ 36" to even start with a sewer installation.

      Ferguson will definitely carry these steel banded couplings....at least they should. I don't know...for me I just don't play around putting in fernco's when a pipe is buried that deep. I want peace of mind at night when I lay my head down to sleep knowing that connection is fine. But again..we live in 2 different area's where we have more to do on our sewers than most.
      Last edited by Flux; 11-15-2011, 06:37 PM.

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      • #18
        Re: Poor excuse for a member!

        Doesn't anyone use MG couplings?

        David

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        • #19
          Re: Poor excuse for a member!

          Originally posted by Dhal22 View Post
          Doesn't anyone use MG couplings?

          David
          Those are cast Iron for concrete pipe ,I believe. What other pipe do You use them for? What do You pay for a 4" + 6" please ?
          I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

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          • #20
            Re: Poor excuse for a member!

            Did camera inspections and seen lots of deflection in Fernco couplings, it only makes sense there's going to be movement as the ground settles. I been using Fernco's underground for 30 years and never had a problem with them, but then again every one i put in, I dig underneath the pipe to the undisturbed ground (at least 6"), bed around the pipe leaving an area of about 12" on the sides and pour cement around it. Never had to go back on one that I've done, doesn't matter how deep it was underground.

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            • #21
              Re: Poor excuse for a member!

              ferncos are legal here for outdoor work. nothing indoor.

              the biggest issue i see with any sewer repair is proper compaction. if you overdig and don't properly compact the soil under the line/ connection, you will get shear. seen it on probably 50% of my sewer inspections that people did.

              rick.
              phoebe it is

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              • #22
                Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                Flux, I hear you on the frostline. I tell friends from up north I don't just live in Florida, I live in South Florida. It's a very tropical climate. I'm running my AC as we speak to maintain 75-76 inside the house. No frostline... That said, potable waterlines are supposed to be 12" below grade by code. It's not strictly enforced. Some guys carry it too far; it's annoying when your shovel is barely 4" into the dirt and it's hitting a line. The sewer repair I showed was only about 2' down if that. I worked for a company where these guys would do build-outs(custom) for already poured "shell" buildings. Cut up the concrete floor, put in as much or little plumbing as you like. Anyway, they always hacked in the additions with sloppy cuts, poorly fit pipes, and Ferncos! I was actually called to a building they did where a pro drain cleaner was hired to figure out why it was backed up. After jetting a few minutes, the line let go and drained. Then, we started seeing dirt coming back to the cleanout. Hmmm. Guy used his Ridgid camera, but it came to a dead end. He did a locate from inside the building and left. Next day, the guys jackhammered the floor and dug it up. I wasn't there to see exactly what happened, but I heard one of their multiple Fernco hack jobs gave up the ghost. Yeah, the shear ring with a Fernco is OK by me.

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                • #23
                  Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                  Originally posted by richinflorida View Post
                  Flux, I hear you on the frostline. I tell friends from up north I don't just live in Florida, I live in South Florida. It's a very tropical climate. I'm running my AC as we speak to maintain 75-76 inside the house. No frostline... That said, potable waterlines are supposed to be 12" below grade by code. It's not strictly enforced. Some guys carry it too far; it's annoying when your shovel is barely 4" into the dirt and it's hitting a line. The sewer repair I showed was only about 2' down if that. I worked for a company where these guys would do build-outs(custom) for already poured "shell" buildings. Cut up the concrete floor, put in as much or little plumbing as you like. Anyway, they always hacked in the additions with sloppy cuts, poorly fit pipes, and Ferncos! I was actually called to a building they did where a pro drain cleaner was hired to figure out why it was backed up. After jetting a few minutes, the line let go and drained. Then, we started seeing dirt coming back to the cleanout. Hmmm. Guy used his Ridgid camera, but it came to a dead end. He did a locate from inside the building and left. Next day, the guys jackhammered the floor and dug it up. I wasn't there to see exactly what happened, but I heard one of their multiple Fernco hack jobs gave up the ghost. Yeah, the shear ring with a Fernco is OK by me.
                  It must be a dream to only have to dig down 4 - 12" to repair or replace a line. My mom lives in Fort Myers, and it's weird seeing water meters exposed outside, and she also confirms that her A/C is on as well.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                    Rich I have been super busy this year too and havn't posted much as well, I hope everyone is doing well it was good to see many of you at the phcc show in Cali and have a great Thanksgiving everyone!

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                    • #25
                      Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                      Hey Dan! Glad to hear things are going well for you. Flux, Ft. Myers? I live right across the river and do quite a bit of work in Ft. Myers and Ft. Myers Beach. Actually, all the good suppliers are in Ft. Myers as well. There is only one real plumbing supplier in my town and we don't do business with them, so everything comes from Ft. Myers. Yeah, I realize it's easy to get spoiled down here, things are relatively easy. Sweating and dealing with a little rain has got to be easier than trying to clear frozen lines under snow when the outside temp is well below 30.. In Ft. Myers, many exposed backflows exposed also. A few months back, some genius decided to ram into some RPZ's at a few commercial locations to steal them. The next morning, suppliers were scrambling to get 2" rpzs..
                      I wonder if these idiots realized they would cause the flooding and waste of good water that they did... Hopefully, Sheriff kept a close eye on the scrapyards for those units. If they didn't scrap them, they probably sold them for $10 or something along those lines...

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                      • #26
                        Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                        Originally posted by richinflorida View Post
                        Hey Dan! Glad to hear things are going well for you. Flux, Ft. Myers? I live right across the river and do quite a bit of work in Ft. Myers and Ft. Myers Beach. Actually, all the good suppliers are in Ft. Myers as well. There is only one real plumbing supplier in my town and we don't do business with them, so everything comes from Ft. Myers. Yeah, I realize it's easy to get spoiled down here, things are relatively easy. Sweating and dealing with a little rain has got to be easier than trying to clear frozen lines under snow when the outside temp is well below 30.. In Ft. Myers, many exposed backflows exposed also. A few months back, some genius decided to ram into some RPZ's at a few commercial locations to steal them. The next morning, suppliers were scrambling to get 2" rpzs..
                        I wonder if these idiots realized they would cause the flooding and waste of good water that they did... Hopefully, Sheriff kept a close eye on the scrapyards for those units. If they didn't scrap them, they probably sold them for $10 or something along those lines...
                        Yea, my mother has been living in North Fort Myers for like 8-9 years now. I try to go down at least once a year, as I do enjoy the area down there, except when it's "love bug" season. (wtf is a love bug?) A couple of years ago I visited during love bug season, and it was the weirdest thing I ever seen in my life. Trying to scrape those bad boys off my moms car windshield was a chore in itself.

                        I got to try Joe's crab shack while I was down there, and we finally just got one up here near me. I also like the many cigar shops you guys have down there, as I'm pretty big into cigars. I usually take a trip up to the Punta Gorda area for a cigar shop (forget the name) and to eat at this place on the water.(forget that name as well).

                        But somewhere down there you guys have a Ferguson, and when my mother moved down there, I used my account to get her a few things. My mother lives in Buccaneer estates if you know where that is, and personally I like the development, but hate the surrounding area. It seems as though that small area there has some rift raft around, and I worry for my mom's safety at times, even though she's in a gated community.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                          Is this what you guys are talking about?
                          Husky SD 4000
                          If so I actually failed an inspection this year for using them in the ground on PVC, inspector wanted Ferncos. He said that they are NOT rated for PVC. I did some research, he was right. Even called Husky R&D they havent applied for the patent for the testing on PVC, too much cost involved. I called inspector back told him he was right and he let it go, I explained that I thought these were better and stronger than Ferncos and he agreed but "technically" not rated for it.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                            Originally posted by MEP View Post
                            Is this what you guys are talking about?
                            Husky SD 4000
                            If so I actually failed an inspection this year for using them in the ground on PVC, inspector wanted Ferncos. He said that they are NOT rated for PVC. I did some research, he was right. Even called Husky R&D they havent applied for the patent for the testing on PVC, too much cost involved. I called inspector back told him he was right and he let it go, I explained that I thought these were better and stronger than Ferncos and he agreed but "technically" not rated for it.
                            Never saw that brand before, and "No" that's not the shielded type of coupling I'm talking about. We use "Mission" products, and they make a specific type of banded shield coupling designed for underground sewers. The connection is much much stronger than a standard Fernco, and your inspector wouldn't turn this down.
                            Attached Files

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                            • #29
                              Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                              Thanks for the info I will see if I can get them locally

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                              • #30
                                Re: Poor excuse for a member!

                                Hey Flux. Not sure what a love bug is as far as species goes.. its just another bug to me. You don't see them unless it's their mating season. Then, around every fourth year or so, they go crazy! I mean they're everywhere! I remember working outside roughing in some custom homes around 5-6 years ago when they were swarming. You almost had to be careful everytime you took a drink or opened your mouth. They coated the front of every vehicle on the road.(They're soft and squish easily). When the inspector showed up we had the system filled with water, which was black with dead love bugs. Your mom's development sounds familiar, if she's in a gated community, she's probably safe. Some of those age restricted communities are nice, without the restrictions... Joe's crab shack good eating. You might be going to Fisherman's village in Punta Gorda.. I think there's a Ferguson in Port Charlotte. Ft. Myers 2 locations and Naples.

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