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Question on lateral replacement

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  • Question on lateral replacement

    Hi guys,

    I apologize if this is the wrong forum, but with guys like Plumber rick and all you other experts I am hoping to get an answer for my dilema.

    I have a belly in my lateral out to the city main. It is approx a 46 foot straight run from my cleanout in the basement to the center of the street.

    The bad part is when I had it cameraed, and measured the belly is believed to be @ 33 foot mark which is smack under the sidewalk.

    I would love to have the lateral replaced and was wondering what options I have. I was reading about pipe bursting where I wouldn't have to dig up everything but my concern is if there is a belly will the pipe bursting just recreate the existing belly? From what I understand it just goes in and contours to your existing pipe kind of like an inner sleeve?

    Is there another option that isn't evasive as digging/trenching up the pipe?

    As a side note, the basement is pretty low with high ceilings, in otherwords to dig down from the lawn we are talking 8 or maybe 9 foot to get to the sewer lateral.

    any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated. Although I am not a plumber I enjoy reading this forum and have the utmost respect for you guys and what you do.

    Thx in advance,
    Harvey

  • #2
    Re: Question on lateral replacement

    First thing: is the pipe sag 13 feet long? How bad is the sag, did it submerge the camera head and for how long was it under water? Did the tech use a skid to keep the camera up off the floor of the pipe or just push it on the bottom? And very importantly did the camera while being pushed in the belly near the end hit a bump that the tech had to force the camera over? I ask this because some sags are really off set joints in the pipe making it dam the water back a bit and are corrected during replacement. Sometimes even a build up of debris can make it seem like a belly. Then the severity of the sag and length count, a short sag under 10 feet and minimal amount of water when pipe bursted may turn out ok as HDPE is seamless and a slippery material and may not hold debris like a concrete or clay pipe would. No pipe should have a belly but some small sags are acceptable if the cost to excavate would be too high. Really need to go over the camera data or do another camera job paying close attention to what I have said, a good camera guy can tell things that bad camera guys don't even notice.
    Seattle Drain Service

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Question on lateral replacement

      Thx for the info Cuda. I am not sure of the severity of the sag/belly I don't think it is 13 feet long.

      I do recall the camera tech showing me the camera was going under water I believe @ 33 ft in and he had trouble getting it to push forward.

      BAsically every 6 months or so my lateral backs up and I need to snake it. Once I do this it is fine for another ~ 6 months or so. There has never been any roots found in the pipe either.

      I believe when it was cameraed it was fairly dry until we got in 33 or 34 ft at which point the camera was under water.

      Is bursting the only option aside from digging and replacing the pipe itself?

      Would you have a general idea of the cost of a bursting job like this one? I know it eould be signifigently cheaper then replacing but not sure how muc.

      as always thx for your input and suggestions.

      regards,
      harvey

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Question on lateral replacement

        harvey, a liner will just duplicate the contour of the original pipe. but in return you get a seamless slick pipe that has only lost approx 3/8'' of diameter. now to do a good job, the line needs to be properly jetted clean. if there are offsets, then those will be duplicated but in a smoother transition.

        if you can post a link to the video on you tube, then we can give you our expert advise.

        pipe bursting is actually a better process as the entire pipe is replaced with hdpe/ high density polyethylene that is pretty much bullet proof. you can smack it all day long with a sledge hammer and wear yourself out. the pipe bursting method will eliminate your offsets and with some planning can also even out the sag. but as cuda has mentioned the pipe is so slick that a little sag is not going to really cause an issue. only problem with pipe bursting is you need an access pit to put the puller in and it has to be dug slightly deeper than the bottom of the pipe. you also need an entry hole, but your basement can usually work out if there is a straight shot to line up the pipe.

        some pictures would help to determine if bursting is going to work.

        between the 2 methods, bursting is a better process and typically less money as the material is less costly. but the labor to expose the line is the factor in your case.

        the liner method is only as good as the proper prep and good installer. i prefer bursting, but your depth might be an issue.

        rick.
        phoebe it is

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Question on lateral replacement

          Thank you Rick. I currently have 4 inch cast iron. So if I was to go with bursting the CI is actually replaced? How is this done? Where does the CI pipe end up in the end, is it actually removed? I didn't realize this.

          Sorry I don't have the video to post. The town came out and camered the line for me. I didn't get a copy of the video. I have a 4" CI clean out plug on my basement floor almost up against the front wall. It is a straight run 46 feet out that runs under front lawn, out to the street. This is where I snake when it backs up. (thx to you I use a drill with 10 foot 1.25 electric eel cables to clear the clogs when it happens.

          By any chance is there someone you can reccommend in the NJ area to do this type of work?

          thx again for your help Rick.

          regards,
          HArvey

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Question on lateral replacement

            pipe bursting fractures the pipe and forces it into the surrounding ground. there should be some pretty good you tube videos of this process.

            truthfully, you own a sectional snake. why not just snake on a preventative basis before it clogs. or invest in a good pressure washer/ jetter.

            don't know anyone in n.j. but it sounds like you're good with the drill and snake. that's what i would continue to do 2x a year.

            rick.
            phoebe it is

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Question on lateral replacement

              Here You go. Gotti pipe bursting,and leg breaking . 1-800- EIEI-OOOO
              I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Question on lateral replacement

                Harveymasons, I ran into this problem recently. I just bought a house and ran my camera down all the lines before purchasing. Right under the sidewalk I found what I thought was a belly. Was not happy because i did not want to have to fix a sewer line after I moved in.(and my wife loved the house) I was talking about it with a couple of guys at work and one of the older guys mentioned a running trap. I double checked my video and If you watch close enough you can see that the camera drops down into water and then comes back up... Never heard of a running trap before so I just assumed it was a belly. Double check before you start tearing it up....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Question on lateral replacement

                  good suggestion bp.

                  i rarely see traps in the sewer main. only the county of los angeles required them. not the city or surrounding cities. the few times i've encountered them, they were the problem. in fact a very large shopping mall built in the early 80's was having issues with back pressure in the sewer and my inspection determined they needed jetting and the contractor also cut out the traps under the sidewalk. nothing like seeing the valet parking persons toilet on the ground floor with waste and paper on the ceiling from 10 stories of food court waste from above

                  ps. welcome to the forum

                  rick.
                  phoebe it is

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Question on lateral replacement

                    Thanks Rick.....

                    Comment

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