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  • Live in new york ???

    If You replace an existing bath receptacle, You don't have to upgrade to a GFCI ! I couldn't sleep at night doing that !
    I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

  • #2
    Re: Live in new york ???

    Really? (I'm not questioning you, as I'm not an electrician... but I'm surprised by that.)

    I've always been under the impression that any receptacle in the bathroom HAD to be a GFCI. Likewise, anything within two or three ft (I don't remember exactly without grabbing a book) of the kitchen sink (or any sink) had to be GFCI, as well as any receptacle on an unfinished floor, as in a basement or garage area. I even use GFCI breakers for the outdoor receptacles (not sure what the code there requires, as I'm NOT an electrician).

    Basic thought I've always had was that if it were possible to "ground" ones self, you need a GFCI. And, I thought that NY and all of it's communities followed the NEC, but might have "additional" codes.

    CWS
    Last edited by CWSmith; 03-09-2013, 12:20 PM.

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    • #3
      Re: Live in new york ???

      Originally posted by CWSmith View Post
      Really? (I'm not questioning you, as I'm not an electrician... but I'm surprised by that.)

      I've always been under the impression that any receptacle in the bathroom HAD to be a GFCI. Likewise, anything within two or three ft (I don't remember exactly without grabbing a book) of the kitchen sink (or any sink) had to be GFCI, as well as any receptacle on an unfinished floor, as in a basement or garage area. I even use GFCI breakers for the outdoor receptacles (not sure what the code there requires, as I'm NOT an electrician).

      Basic thought I've always had was that if it were possible to "ground" ones self, you need a GFCI. And, I thought that NY and all of it's communities followed the NEC, but might have "additional" codes.

      CWS
      This came from an old post on Electrician talk By Speedy Pety
      I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

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      • #4
        Re: Live in new york ???

        Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
        If You replace an existing bath receptacle, You don't have to upgrade to a GFCI ! I couldn't sleep at night doing that !
        Keep in mind this is only for one and two family resi work. And that is because there is no wording yet in the NYSRC requiring it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Live in new york ???

          Petey,

          I don't know what the NYSRC refers to (but again, I'm not in the trade), but isn't there some general wording regarding "NEC" code requirements in general, except where otherwise stated?

          Again, it's been a long time since I've "boned-up" on this kind of thing.

          (I had the electrical contractor stand me up and thus put in my own service back in 1990, as I had other contractors waiting, as well as the electrical inspector scheduled. At that time I bought the NEC manual as well as a few references from the local code inforcement folks. Since then, I just try to keep up to date and generally confine myself to fixing circuits and adding the occasional circuit. My service here was upgraded by a certified Master, and a few months ago, he ran me a 100 amp service to my detached garage. I'll do most of the rest of the wiring required there.... BUT, I do try to keep up, so "code" is very important to me!... so, I follow this forums "electrical" posts quite regularly [and do a lot of reading for specifics too])

          Thanks,

          CWS

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          • #6
            Re: Live in new york ???

            Sorry, the NYSRC is the New York State Residential Code. [ 2010 Residential Code of New York State ]

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            • #7
              Re: Live in new york ???

              I don't know NY local codes either, but The NEC code requires any outlet that has been altered to be brought up to code.

              Where ever you are and Codes aside, I think it is just stupid not to have GFCI protection especially in a bathroom.

              For a few dollars you save it is not worth it. GFCI's save lives!

              Make sure any outlet within 6ft of a sink is ground fault protected by either a GFCI circuit breaker or a GFCI outlet. They are also required in unfinished basements, garages and outdoors.

              I would not sleep at night either, knowing my bathroom outlets were a potential hazard.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Live in new york ???

                Originally posted by johncameron View Post
                I don't know NY local codes either, but The NEC code requires any outlet that has been altered to be brought up to code.

                Where ever you are and Codes aside, I think it is just stupid not to have GFCI protection especially in a bathroom.

                For a few dollars you save it is not worth it. GFCI's save lives!

                Make sure any outlet within 6ft of a sink is ground fault protected by either a GFCI circuit breaker or a GFCI outlet. They are also required in unfinished basements, garages and outdoors.

                I would not sleep at night either, knowing my bathroom outlets were a potential hazard.
                I do the same
                I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Live in new york ???

                  I do try to keep up, so "code" is very important to me!...
                  Code? Why keep up; the FCC eliminated the code requirement years ago.

                  Maybe that's where NY got screwed up, they thought it applied to everything with codes.

                  ... _._
                  ---------------
                  Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                  ---------------
                  “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                  ---------
                  "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
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                  sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

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                  • #10
                    Re: Live in new york ???

                    Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                    Code? Why keep up; the FCC eliminated the code requirement years ago.
                    And than goodness. It's the only way I got in.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Live in new york ???

                      Doing some work on an old home in My Hood. I've done over $140. 000 , Mostly Landscape, concrete , retaining walls, new paver drive. Awesome lady.One day I'm clearing a kitchen drain blockage, use the hallway bath. There's the teen daughters hair dryer on edge of sink next to bath Tub. 60 year old Eichler like ours No GFCI, All ungrounded outlets ! I explained why I added a clamp W ground wire to cold in wall and GFCI. Never a problem selling that one !
                      I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Live in new york ???

                        Hey, I got in with the 5 wpm, but found it excruciating. Then after spending most of my first month "on the air" (working 87 countries), I felt guilty and asked my totally non-tech wife if she'd be interested. I worked with her on a couple of Sunday afternoons to understand the theory, and she went from Zip to "Extra" in a short five month.... acing the Novice, Tech, and 5 wpm in one sitting... then two months later took the General, Advanced, and the 13 wpm and in the same manner, didn't miss a single question. A month after that, she took her 20 wpm and the Extra, missing only one question on the code exam!

                        I tried to keep up with her but she left me behind as and "Advanced" licensee (I did manage through the 13 wpm), and I never could pass the 20 wpm and had to wait to they dropped the code requirement.

                        CWS

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                        • #13
                          Re: Live in new york ???

                          Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                          Doing some work on an old home..... I explained why I added a clamp W ground wire to cold in wall and GFCI. Never a problem selling that one !
                          Not allowed by electric code

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                          • #14
                            Re: Live in new york ???

                            Originally posted by johncameron View Post
                            Not allowed by electric code
                            Can You explain John ? We are in a 1958 Eichler Hood . I live in one and work on Many. Post N beam slab on grade Lots of plate Glass. The plumbing ,along with the Hydronics is copper. The copper cold Water pipe from all sinks ,tubs , showers goes to earth ,out to street , and the old services are grounded to it. I believe a GFCI won't set If improperly wired . Thanks Tool
                            Last edited by toolaholic; 03-10-2013, 01:47 PM.
                            I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Live in new york ???

                              Refer to article 250 of the NEC for details. If you want to add an "equipment ground wire" it must be ran all the way to the service panel, or if you want to use the water line, it must be landed within 5ft of where it enters the building. Furthermore, it has to be done within acceptable wiring methods from chapter 3 (eg....Can't run wires smaller than #8 along bottom of joists, must be green wire, fittings must be listed for use......)

                              There is an exception that allows a GFCI outlet to be used without an equipment ground,(old 2 wire outlet) but outlets must be clearly labeled with ( it comes with GFCI) the sticker that says "No equipment ground"

                              A GFCI does not need a equipment ground to set.....Or work for that mater.
                              Last edited by johncameron; 03-10-2013, 10:36 PM.

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