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3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

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  • 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

    Hello all : Great forum, I have received good advice here previously!

    I have a small 3.2 Kw Powermate Gen with pull (recoil starter)I read some(long b-4 internet) that with addition of some small low cost components relays , voltage isolator and switch etc; it's possible ?.

    I have very little knowledge of a lot of things including electricity, and would like to make gen start-able for an elderly person in emergency. I don't think it is practical to add (cost wise some of elec/start kits that I see on web.

    Any help/advise would be appreciated.
    Thanks

  • #2
    Re: 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

    no you could not use a car alternator for a starter.

    possibly a car generator, from the pre 65 era, and later in the post, a little more info,

    if there is a factory kit it would most likely mean taking off the fly wheel and replacing it and the engine shied possibly, here is s some possibilities How to Add an Electric Starter

    first there is no place for a pulley or an area for the starter to connect to,easily, on some one my be able to use the fly wheel is there is a smooth place all the way around the fly wheel, but this would mean taking off the engine shroud and a cooling problem, ( at one time they made belt starters and the starters would work as a generator to charge the battery,
    the old john deere 110 lawn tractor had a combination starter generator belt drive unit on it. the unit was simular to these http://alternatorparts.com/small_sta...generators.htm

    if there a way to mount a pully on the fly wheel side that does not interfer with the air flow for cooling then one of the units above in the link would work.

    about the only DIY starter that I know could be adapted would be a drill starter, (which is not that safe and you would loose the pull starter rope,) I would think a good 18 cordless would turn one over the engine.

    and the problem withe generators and starters on emergency units is the battery will be found dead most of the time and the starter will not work any way,

    If you want to explore the drill starter idea do a search for drill starter mower on a good search engine, but you proceed at your own risk, YOUR RESPONSIBLE for any problems.

    the main reason why there is dangerous is they do not disengage when the engine starts. the have to be pulled off the motor, and if you screw up the drill will flopping around at the engine speed, because all they are is a socket on a shaft(bolt) that the drill can chuck up, and the socket fits the engine crankshaft nut but there is not a one way clutch built into it for safety.

    ( it may be better to mount the generator on a platform up some off the ground where it is easer to work on and to pull the start rope,


    your probably best off to trade or sell the generator and buy one with electric start built in,
    Last edited by BHD; 04-20-2013, 05:09 PM.
    Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
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    • #3
      Re: 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

      Originally posted by utah1 View Post
      ...... would like to make gen start-able for an elderly person in emergency. I don't think it is practical to add (cost wise some of elec/start kits that I see on web.
      Without the starter kit how do you propose to start the genny? All the alt will really do is charge a battery.

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      • #4
        Re: 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

        You could parallel the output of two of these power supplies which would give you 150amps to drive a starter.

        IOTA Engineering DLS-75 12VDC Battery Charger and Power Converter - 75 Amps

        Seem like the better solution would be to come up with a crank or pull start for the engine.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

          Thanks to all for replies. I apologize for not being clearer in my orig. post. What I meant to ask is my generator works by the gas engine starting & then turning the shaft of the generator's alternator component which in turn provides usable electric 120 AC voltage. I do not want to add or integrate a 12 volt starter motor to start the generator , or add a separate alternator to use as starter motor.


          What I am trying to find out is based on the fact that the shaft of the alternator being connected to the gas engine shaft is a definitive given; or the alternator shaft would not turn when gas engine is started.
          Normal operation is start the gas engine by pull start or any other method and engine shaft in turn spins alternator shaft. As stated above I am interested in spinning alternator shaft first which in turn starts gas engine.


          The same alternator if spun by the addition of a 12 volt DC battery power would in turn spin the shaft of the gas engine and start the gas engine . It's possible that a clutch & other components probably are included that allow one shaft to lock up to the other. It is also my understanding (which is obliviously very limited) that an alternator is a motor and can be used to supply rotational power output.


          That to save on cost and limit component failure (separate starter motors) and avoid additional weight that a company I think may have been named Continental Co.,supplied portable generators having up to 15hp motors and and 8 Kw alternators that were started using the method I am trying to describe.


          I also know that a question could be asked “ if this was or is a viable method to start the engine why are the current overseas manufacturers of portable gens not using it ? My answer is : Maybe it does not work ; but I hope by asking on this forum I may find out.

          Thanks again to all.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: 3.2KW Port Gen . Can alternator be wired to use to starter for 208 cc enginge ?

            Originally posted by utah1 View Post
            The same alternator if spun by the addition of a 12 volt DC battery power would in turn spin the shaft of the gas engine and start the gas engine . It's possible that a clutch & other components probably are included that allow one shaft to lock up to the other. It is also my understanding (which is obliviously very limited) that an alternator is a motor and can be used to supply rotational power output.
            most small generators are direct coupled, most use a tapered shaft on the engine and the alternator actually slips on the the engine shaft and is bolted on. thus elimination one bearing on the alternator.

            Originally posted by utah1 View Post
            The same alternator if spun by the addition of a 12 volt DC battery power would in turn spin the shaft of the gas engine and start the gas engine . It's possible that a clutch & other components probably are included that allow one shaft to lock up to the other. It is also my understanding (which is obliviously very limited) that an alternator is a motor and can be used to supply rotational power output.


            That to save on cost and limit component failure (separate starter motors) and avoid additional weight that a company I think may have been named Continental Co.,supplied portable generators having up to 15hp motors and and 8 Kw alternators that were started using the method I am trying to describe.

            Thanks again to all.
            I think what your asking is could a alternator have a starter winding in it for starting the generator,
            I would guess it is possible, but the cost would not be cost effective most likely. one most likely could not use the existing windings for starting,

            most alternators are not motors, old DC generators could motor, many DC motors had magnets in them most alternators use elector magnets that induce the currents internally in the unit.

            and you have few more problems a unit that is producing 120/240 volts and 12 volts one is AC and one DC.

            you talked about clutches and so on,

            one time I did see a emergency UPS constant supply (alternator) that was tied into grid that the alternator was spun by a ac motor, that ran the alternator under normal conditions and also had a big cast fly wheel if power was lost a electric clutch would shut off, engage and starting the gas motor thus never losing power, and was started by the momentum of the spinning fly wheel and alternator.
            (I never saw it operate only setting there)
            it was some what on this idea Rotary Diesel UPS

            It is my under standing a machine machine that makes DC current is called a generator, and a machine that makes AC is called an alternator, yes in a modern car the alternator makes three phase AC power that is then rectified to DC.

            most likely the reason it is not done is cost,

            using the small engine starter is probly the most econimical method,
            Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
            ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
            attributed to Samuel Johnson
            ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

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