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  • Inspector problems

    We installed a Norweco Singulair septic tank like we always do. Everything passed inspection except the electrical. The electrician said it failed for (2) things:

    1) He wants a GFCI breaker , which can not be done because it will trip the breaker & not work.

    The system is wire on a dedicated 15amp circuit w/ 14-2 wire. The wire comes from the panel box to the control panel mounted on the outside of the house then underground to the motor. If for any reason the wire draws more than 8 amps or the circuit becomes broken after the control panel (UL listed). The control panel will shut the electric off.

    2) He does not like the plug assembly on the motor (UL listed). The plug assembly is molded rubber & water-tight. There is no manufacture name on it. He wants the male end cut off & the wire extended so it can be plugged into a outlet above ground next to the riser. If this is done it will void the warranty. Also if the tank were to back up & have sewage over flow the control panel would shut the power off when the water level got within 14" of the plug assembly.

    The inspector did not cite a code #'s he just said he wanted it changed. I have no reason why this is not passing inspection. We have installed over 300 of these tanks to the manufactures specs. & have never had a problem before. My electrician & I have a meeting with the head electrical insp. on Mon.

    Does anybody know why this would not pass? I just want to be prepared for any of their concerns when we have our meeting.

  • #2
    Re: Inspector problems

    I'd ask them if they were prepared to go to court. I remember reading some years back about an inspector who demanded some changes that were in conflict with the manufacturers instructions. Due to the changes he required, the court ruled the City responsible for the disaster it caused.

    I'll try and recall the exact account, however Google may be your best friend.
    AP

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Inspector problems

      I agree with you that a gfic outlet is problematic on a pump and we never use them either. As far as an outlet is concerned, we typically run 1.5" conduit above the pit so the cord end can be pulled in without cutting the cord which would void the warranty. There should be no electrical connections below the cover of the pit.

      Rick.
      phoebe it is

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Inspector problems

        Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
        I agree with you that a gfic outlet is problematic on a pump and we never use them either. As far as an outlet is concerned, we typically run 1.5" conduit above the pit so the cord end can be pulled in without cutting the cord which would void the warranty. There should be no electrical connections below the cover of the pit.

        Rick.
        The problem with the outlet is the aerator comes with a cord already attached that is a foot long with a molded rubber water tight male plug. altering that wire voids the warranty & the UL listing. This is a aerator & it sits above the septic tank inside the riser. It is the not in the water. There are 1,000's of these units installed in the country & how everyone does it is they run conduit from the control panel to the aerator riser. Then pull your 14 ga. wire to the aerator attaching the factory supplied female plug with enough extra wire to extend 36" above the riser. Typical connection is 1-2 ft. below grade. I understand your concern about electrical connections in septic tank risers, because sewer gas is very corrosive. One of the other things we have to do is seal both ends of the conduit ,so the sewer gas cannot get in the conduit.
        We service these units every 6 months & I have never seen any sign of corrosion on either end of the plug assembly. I tried posting a link to what this tank looks like in my 1st post & it would not take I will try again with just the link in the next post.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Inspector problems

          For some reason it will not let me post a link to the tank. If you want to goggle the tank it is a Norweco Singulair TNT septic tank. Just go to Norweco's website & go Singulair TNT in the products section.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Inspector problems

            Lets try this.

            http://www.norweco.com/html/products/TNT.htm#

            Rick.
            phoebe it is

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Inspector problems

              Originally posted by mr.fudd View Post
              for some reason it will not let me post a link to the tank. If you want to goggle the tank it is a norweco singulair tnt septic tank. Just go to norweco's website & go singulair tnt in the products section.
              Nobody can post links !! Ridgid is broken and the lifetime warrantee is useless !
              I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Inspector problems

                Not sure how Rick did it but it seems that if you post the reply w/o links and go back in and edit you can add the links. I was able to do it yesterday. Someone on here commented this was possible and it worked for me. Now if RidgidIT would get busy and check it out maybe they can locate and fix the problem. This stuff always seems to happen on a holiday.

                If the cord and cap were supplied with the aerator and it is listed, it is listed as a complete assembly as supplied by the manufacturer, there is no need for the cord cap to have its own NRTL bug(UL logo).
                Last edited by Bob D.; 07-04-2013, 10:34 PM.
                ---------------
                Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
                ---------------
                “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
                ---------
                "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
                ---------
                sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Inspector problems

                  Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                  Not sure how Rick did it but it seems that if you post the reply w/o links and go back in and edit you can add the links. I was able to do it yesterday..
                  And I thought I was special

                  But you got it. Post everything but the link and go back and edit it in

                  Before the forum, I didn't even know how to post a photo. Come a long way in 9 years of forum activity.

                  Rick.
                  phoebe it is

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Inspector problems

                    Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                    And I thought I was special

                    But you got it. Post everything but the link and go back and edit it in

                    Before the forum, I didn't even know how to post a photo. Come a long way in 9 years of forum activity.

                    Rick.
                    My computer skills are an area that I'm definitely lacking.

                    Maybe in another 2,000 posts I will take the time to learn how to post a picture.

                    I just got a smarter than me phone , so maybe it won't take that long.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Inspector problems

                      The inspector is required to cite a code # for violations. If you ask nicely, I'm sure he will give you specifics without a battle.

                      GFCI protection is required if receptacle is mounted above ground. If the pump is tripping the breaker, the problem is with the pump manufacture, not the breaker.

                      You could cut off the plug and wire it directly into the panel (this may not violate the UL listing ((read what the manufactures instructions say)) provided splices are not made in the tank and a switch is installed to disconnect the pump)
                      If the receptacle eliminated (hard-wired directly), and the uf cable buried deep enough GFCI is not required by code. It is also not required if the pump is 240v.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Inspector problems

                        Originally posted by johncameron View Post
                        The inspector is required to cite a code # for violations. If you ask nicely, I'm sure he will give you specifics without a battle.

                        GFCI protection is required if receptacle is mounted above ground. If the pump is tripping the breaker, the problem is with the pump manufacture, not the breaker.

                        You could cut off the plug and wire it directly into the panel (this may not violate the UL listing ((read what the manufactures instructions say)) provided splices are not made in the tank and a switch is installed to disconnect the pump)
                        If the receptacle eliminated (hard-wired directly), and the uf cable buried deep enough GFCI is not required by code. It is also not required if the pump is 240v.
                        If you cut the male plug on the aerator you void the warranty.

                        This is not a pump it is a aerator. It is like a mixer , but the shaft & mixing fingers are hollow to allow air to be blown in while it mixes the sewage up. Don't ask me why because I don't know enough about electricity to tell you why, but anytime I have plugged a aerator motor into a GFCI receptacle it trips the GFCI.

                        The connection to the aerator is below grade & made with uf cable wired to a factory supplied female plug. The aerator needs a plug assembly, because we service these units every 6 months & the aerator needs to be removed a cleaned.

                        The electrical insp. did not cite any code #'s he just told my electrician what he wanted. I really don't care what he wants ,because I have meeting with his boss

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Inspector problems

                          Like I said, It may or may not void the warranty (some instructions actually tell you it's ok to cut off the cord cap if needed) That aside, you said you want to keep the factory plug. If that the case, you need GFCI protection for the 120v receptacle per NEC (even if instructions say it is not required).

                          The problem with having a receptacle below grade is moisture. It's going to cause the GFCI to trip because of current leakage of >3ma. It would be better for your EC to mount a receptacle 12" to 18" above grade to minimize these nuisance trips. Or, be willing to (possibly) void the warranty and have it hardwired. This would eliminate the headaches of the breaker tripping and still be code compliant without GFCI protection.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Inspector problems

                            The electrical connection is like this

                            http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_B2sz5sEIJz...dExploded3.gif

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Inspector problems

                              Originally posted by johncameron View Post
                              Like I said, It may or may not void the warranty (some instructions actually tell you it's ok to cut off the cord cap if needed) That aside, you said you want to keep the factory plug. If that the case, you need GFCI protection for the 120v receptacle per NEC (even if instructions say it is not required).

                              The problem with having a receptacle below grade is moisture. It's going to cause the GFCI to trip because of current leakage of >3ma. It would be better for your EC to mount a receptacle 12" to 18" above grade to minimize these nuisance trips. Or, be willing to (possibly) void the warranty and have it hardwired. This would eliminate the headaches of the breaker tripping and still be code compliant without GFCI protection.
                              I talked to an electrical inspector at a party last night who has inspected these systems before.

                              He said the new electrical inspector is just trying to impose his personal feelings on how it should be wired.

                              He said because it is a dedicated circuit & below grade it does not need GFCI protection.

                              He also said the reason the GFCI trips is because of the power surge when the motor 1st turns on.

                              The biggest problem with electrical connections in a septic tank riser is sewer gas, because it is very corrosive.

                              On my previous post I posted a link to a picture of a connection that is like the one the manufacture requires us the use.

                              The only difference is the male plug is made onto the wire coming out of the motor. Then we connect our wire the female connector.

                              There is no manufacture name or #'s on the plug or connector ,but it is like a Leviton watertight.

                              I have seen other brand systems that they use a junction box & wire nuts to make the connection in the riser & within a year the connection has failed.

                              Comment

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