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  • Geothermal

    I am currently in the process of building a house and I am pricing out a geothermal system. 2 of the systems are the conventional hot air type with the desuperheaters to do the hot water and also some radiant heat int he garage using a 4 ton unit for the first floor and a 2 ton unit for the second. The 3rd system that was priced out uses a 7 ton unit with 2 unico high veolcity air handler units which the person who spec this systme out tells me is more efficient and better. I am not sure which way to go as the conventional hot air type systems are pricier. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

    Marty

  • #2
    Re: Geothermal

    Do you ever get a payback with Geothermal?

    J.C.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Geothermal

      Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
      Do you ever get a payback with Geothermal?

      J.C.
      The last time I figured one the payback was 13 years. This was with natural gas at $1.10 per therm and electricity at 10 cents per KWH.

      LP is a different story though. At over $2.00 per gallon those same conditions would show a payback of about 7 years.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Geothermal

        Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
        Do you ever get a payback with Geothermal?

        J.C.
        im doing a school and im not sure how long the payback will be but it is shorter then a house because there is a lot more equipment being used .
        there will be no cooling tower or boilers so thats a big savings
        Charlie

        My seek the peek fundraiser page
        http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


        http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

        new work pictures 12/09
        http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Geothermal

          Originally posted by HVAC HAWK View Post
          im doing a school and im not sure how long the payback will be but it is shorter then a house because there is a lot more equipment being used .
          there will be no cooling tower or boilers so thats a big savings
          Thanks. We've dug the long trenches for the coils on geothermal systems but that's about it. Hawk, I'd be interested in the final numbers you come up with. You can PM them or whatever. Some suggestions I think you should include in your equation which you may have already thought about. 1)Maintenance of typical vs. Geothermal including replacements over 20-30 years

          2)This is the big one for me that people seem to leave out. The difference in cost if it were invested in normal earning positions over that same amount of time. What I mean is that if a Geothermal system or any other system is $8,000 (random figure) more than one should consider what that $8,000 would earn over the 20-30 year period also. And what if the project were financed through mortgage? $8,000 more at X% interest over 20-30 years + the amount lost in interest earned.

          Does what I'm saying make sense? I just like to get a big picture look at things when looking at all the finances/bottom line. Thanks for all input.

          J.C.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Geothermal

            the cost of the equipment is the same [ water heat pump or ground heat pump ]i will ask some one at work that just put a geo in his house foe what he came up with for the #s
            Charlie

            My seek the peek fundraiser page
            http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


            http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

            new work pictures 12/09
            http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Geothermal

              Originally posted by JCsPlumbing View Post
              Thanks. We've dug the long trenches for the coils on geothermal systems but that's about it. Hawk, I'd be interested in the final numbers you come up with. You can PM them or whatever. Some suggestions I think you should include in your equation which you may have already thought about. 1)Maintenance of typical vs. Geothermal including replacements over 20-30 years

              2)This is the big one for me that people seem to leave out. The difference in cost if it were invested in normal earning positions over that same amount of time. What I mean is that if a Geothermal system or any other system is $8,000 (random figure) more than one should consider what that $8,000 would earn over the 20-30 year period also. And what if the project were financed through mortgage? $8,000 more at X% interest over 20-30 years + the amount lost in interest earned.

              Does what I'm saying make sense? I just like to get a big picture look at things when looking at all the finances/bottom line. Thanks for all input.

              J.C.
              Sorry Hawk, I meant cost differential between Geothermal vs. traditional Forced Air over the longterm with investment differences included. Thanks as I would like to know but go crosseyed trying to calculate.

              J.C.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Geothermal

                From what I understand the cost of the geothermal equipment is about the same as the cost of high end hydoraire equipment using conventional oil or gas. the cost difference is the cost of installing the loop system wether vertical wells or horizontal loop. Yes it does cost more and the payback can be between 5-12 years depending on the cost of oil, gas, etc, which as we all know has gone up significantly. t is hard to compare what your money would earn in a bank if you invested instead. How bout we also look at it from the standpoint of what is the additional impact to the environment which we should all be trying to help out and the way I see it is is much better than the oil and gas and who wants to keep paying the oil and gas men anyway, I sure dont

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Geothermal

                  Originally posted by skkipp View Post
                  From what I understand the cost of the geothermal equipment is about the same as the cost of high end hydoraire equipment using conventional oil or gas. the cost difference is the cost of installing the loop system wether vertical wells or horizontal loop. Yes it does cost more and the payback can be between 5-12 years depending on the cost of oil, gas, etc, which as we all know has gone up significantly. t is hard to compare what your money would earn in a bank if you invested instead. How bout we also look at it from the standpoint of what is the additional impact to the environment which we should all be trying to help out and the way I see it is is much better than the oil and gas and who wants to keep paying the oil and gas men anyway, I sure dont
                  I'm all for that. What I'd love to see is the majority of U.S. harnessing Solar, Wind, and Earth energy for our needs with no pollution. But the U.S. and slowly the rest of the world in the end serves Capitalism. That is the very reason for the extremely slow growth of these alternative resources. They cost too much for the payback. Numbers show that you lose financially over the longterm dramatically when using solar. That's including tax incentives.

                  I look forward to the day of the "tipping point" when it's more financially beneficial for everyone to be super green. And I think we are entering a time when things are going to happen faster than in the past.

                  J.C.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Geothermal

                    J.C., $8000 invested, earning a measly 10% interest annualy would be approx. $54,000 at 20yrs or $140,000 at 30 years. A more probable earning would be 12% percent which would come out to $77,000 and $239,000. If you really invested well, and earned 18%,(not unheard of) you would pocket $220,000 to well over a million.
                    That would pay for a lot of natural gas.

                    I look forward to the day when we drill for and utilize the oil we have here. Improve the technology for cleaner burning. Build some nuclear power plants (or restart the ones we've shut down) and let capitalism work with just enough government intervention to keep it honest and safe.
                    Last edited by SlimTim; 05-05-2008, 10:42 PM.
                    "Man will do many things to get himself loved, he will do all things to get himself envied." Mark Twain

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Geothermal

                      Hey Slim ,where are You getting 10% ?????????????????
                      I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Geothermal

                        Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                        Hey Slim ,where are You getting 10% ?????????????????

                        The casinos, of course!!
                        "Man will do many things to get himself loved, he will do all things to get himself envied." Mark Twain

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