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  • HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

    have any of you guys ever seen or done this?

    Vince

  • #2
    Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

    I've installed a few, replaced many. It works for small zones, supplimental heat source or as a temporary measure.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

      Very common here in new housing. The tank is used in combo for domestic and in floor. Here our hydronic code (not law yet) used to state a timer has to be set to cycle radiant water through the domestic system ever 7 days, now they changed it to 24 hours. Almost always does supplemental radiant in floor in basements. Sure does burn a tank out fast.
      West Trail Mechanical Ltd
      Service. Commitment. Expertise.

      www.westtrailmechanical.ca

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

        Horribly inefficient idea.
        sigpic

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        • #5
          Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

          Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
          Horribly inefficient idea.
          this kinda what i was thinking.

          care to share your thoughts NH?

          Vince

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

            From my reasearch I have learned there are many pros for and against the idea. Some prefer it.

            I am from Canada and my question is: are HWH's allowed by code in Canada as the heat source for a closed loop system?

            Here is a good read: http://www.inspectorsjournal.com/for...ersForHeat.pdf

            Cheers

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

              Efficient heating is all about the rapid transfer of the heat source, electric, gas , oil. The trick is to get as much heat (btu's) from the fire to the transfer media whether that be water or air for that matter. Large volumes of water take longer to heat. This is why ultra high efficient boilers use very small water passages and a very small amount of water.
              sigpic

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                [quote=NHMaster3015;203829]Efficient heating is all about the rapid transfer of the heat source, electric, gas , oil. The trick is to get as much heat (btu's) from the fire to the transfer media whether that be water or air for that matter. Large volumes of water take longer to heat. This is why ultra high efficient boilers use very small water passages and a very small amount of water.[/quote]

                how come this practice isn't used on HWH/HWT?

                i've always thought of HWH/HWT as being very wasteful appliances.

                Vince

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                  the only time i have ever done this is when a customers boiler breaks in the middle of the night in the dead of winter to get them some heat until i can get a new boiler installed
                  "Do it so you can go to sleep at night."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                    Originally posted by chrisupnorth View Post
                    From my reasearch I have learned there are many pros for and against the idea. Some prefer it.

                    I am from Canada and my question is: are HWH's allowed by code in Canada as the heat source for a closed loop system?

                    Here is a good read: http://www.inspectorsjournal.com/for...ersForHeat.pdf

                    Cheers
                    Check stan data reports for ont. on line, usually they will have schematic drawings to go along with code. In Alberta they do.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                      Originally posted by NJOY PLBG View Post
                      Check stan data reports for ont. on line, usually they will have schematic drawings to go along with code. In Alberta they do.
                      Hey neighbour, welcome. nice to finally see a local guy on here.
                      West Trail Mechanical Ltd
                      Service. Commitment. Expertise.

                      www.westtrailmechanical.ca

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                        I know for some hot water tanks it says something on some of them about being approved for heating applications, but if you asked me to install one for you for a hydronic application I would RUN, FAR and FAST. Use the right tool for the right job and you'll go far, and a hot water tank is NOT the right tool for the job in my opinion.

                        You are better off installing a seperate electric boiler with one circulator, and zone valves if you are inclined to have more than one zone. For example Thermolec now makes one wth an outdoor reset that is fairly inexpensive, and they can make you one with a stainless tank/internals too (which they don't list on their website). Something like this, with a small circulator, air seperator, and you build your own manifold, that is set up right, will last you a long time, and most electric boilers have pretty decent warranties on the elements, heat exchanger, etc. The beauty part is they (Thermolec) makes an electric boiler that is as small as 5 kilowatts (around 17,000 BTU's), Argo makes one that is 6 Kilowatts too, and these are perfect for small applications, and if that's not small enough for you, Electro Industries makes a "mini-boiler" that comes in 120 Volt models from 1 to 5 KW, and they have a 240 Volt 4.5 KW model. This is a MUCH better option than using a hot water tank in my opinion.

                        To add - if you don't already know, an outdoor reset is a sensor that goes outside that tells the boiler the outside air temperature, which causes the boiler to throttle the water temperature it sends to the floors based on the temperature outside. The just of it is the colder it is outside, the warmer the water it sends to the floors, and vice versa. This control feature alone found on the Thermolecs anyways, can account for some savings, as well as increased comfort.
                        Last edited by Scott K; 05-10-2009, 04:21 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                          Originally posted by Vince the Plumber View Post
                          have any of you guys ever seen or done this?

                          Vince
                          We use them in new construction. It works, and is rather inexpensive - as primary heat for a home, apartment or condo, I sure cannot recommend it. I've even seen the exhaust baffles plug up full. I'm guessing water heaters are not designed for 100% duty cycle, go figure. Just my humble opinion though.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                            would the new condensing water heaters expected out this year be better? or still not as good as a boiler

                            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                            Efficient heating is all about the rapid transfer of the heat source, electric, gas , oil. The trick is to get as much heat (btu's) from the fire to the transfer media whether that be water or air for that matter. Large volumes of water take longer to heat. This is why ultra high efficient boilers use very small water passages and a very small amount of water.
                            No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: HWH/HWT as boiler for heating system

                              Originally posted by MoJourneyman View Post
                              would the new condensing water heaters expected out this year be better? or still not as good as a boiler
                              Good question and I don't know. Have not had time to research them yet. Going to the NEFI trade show tomorrow. There should be a few on the floor so I'll ask the question.
                              sigpic

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