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pro press vs sharkbite

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  • #16
    Re: pro press vs sharkbite

    Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
    I'll tackle this also from a mechanical perspective...look at what happens to a 20 year old gate valve...the rubber seal goes and you have to tighten the packing nut to compensate...after a few times the packing nut won't tighten any more so you have to replace it.
    Propress's seal is rubber...I imagine an entire water main put together with rubber for the seals...an issue of mechanical integrity comes to mind.
    Duck, great counterperspective to Rick's train of thought. Good points from both sides. Let add my two cents. Installed a 12" waterline in Spain. The pipe was push pipe and the gaskets were rubber. Installed a ballfield bathroom in Okinawa. The drain lines were bell and spigot cast iron with rubber gaskets. I'm a project supervisor right now installing storm drains, the pipe is joined by? You guessed it, rubber gaskets. No hub coupling all involve a rubber gasket. Flanged fitting and pipe, the list goes on and on. Rubber come a long way and has proven its dependability.

    Your gate valve example has one problem-moving parts. With propress, sharkbite, whatever, there are no moving parts to wear down. I'm not saying one is better than the other but each has it's place. I solder whenever it's feasible and safe. I know you've had a time or two where you wished you had a sharkbite.
    Buy cheap, buy twice.

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    • #17
      Re: pro press vs sharkbite

      Originally posted by gear junkie View Post
      Duck, great counterperspective to Rick's train of thought. Good points from both sides. Let add my two cents. Installed a 12" waterline in Spain. The pipe was push pipe and the gaskets were rubber. Installed a ballfield bathroom in Okinawa. The drain lines were bell and spigot cast iron with rubber gaskets. I'm a project supervisor right now installing storm drains, the pipe is joined by? You guessed it, rubber gaskets. No hub coupling all involve a rubber gasket. Flanged fitting and pipe, the list goes on and on. Rubber come a long way and has proven its dependability.
      I've done countless bell & spigot resilient gasket seals on commercial undergrounds all the way up to 12"...they're excellent...but drainage isn't high pressure..and, it's underground.
      Originally posted by gear junkie View Post
      Your gate valve example has one problem-moving parts. With propress, sharkbite, whatever, there are no moving parts to wear down. I'm not saying one is better than the other but each has it's place. I solder whenever it's feasible and safe. I know you've had a time or two where you wished you had a sharkbite.
      Absolutely without question there have been many, many times working overhead inside a joist bay with the copper barely reachable stuck right against wood, hands burnt and space too tight for gloves, flux everywhere, suddenly finding religion and praying to god I don't start a fire...yup, but it still doesn't stop me from wondering how effective a rubber O-ring is over the long term on a high pressure system in a consealed space.
      You are right about the moving parts scenario, but rubber does dry & crack over time...and unfortunately time will be the only test for this debate.
      This discussion is good...I might be wrong...one of you guys might pull out a study example that will convince me...and THAT is why I'm here!
      I have a question...not to twist the topic any, but...what about CPVC in those "scary" area's when soldering makes you wanna take up a new career?

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      • #18
        Re: pro press vs sharkbite

        show me a fire main that is not installed by victaulic?

        i even have a vic tool for copper. i use this on greater than 4'' copper now up to 6''.

        the gate valve is a packing nut. much different than an o-ring seal that doesn't rely on a friction seal. infact new hose bibbs are now coming with non adjustable packing nuts that use an o-ring to seal.

        rick.
        phoebe it is

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        • #19
          Re: pro press vs sharkbite

          DB,

          I believe what you may be missing is although they seem to be regular old rubber seals they are not. They are elastomer which has been designed to last the life of the tubing.

          Mark
          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: pro press vs sharkbite

            Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
            show me a fire main that is not installed by victaulic?

            i even have a vic tool for copper. i use this on greater than 4'' copper now up to 6''.

            the gate valve is a packing nut. much different than an o-ring seal that doesn't rely on a friction seal. infact new hose bibbs are now coming with non adjustable packing nuts that use an o-ring to seal.

            rick.
            Sipped my mind...and I've done victaulic on both sprinklers and commercial heat, but...the joint is held by bolts.

            Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
            DB,

            I believe what you may be missing is although they seem to be regular old rubber seals they are not. They are elastomer which has been designed to last the life of the tubing.

            Mark
            NOW you get my attention...hit me with the science and my ears perk.
            I think I'll read up on it...find out what the chemical difference is...and how it's been tested...but the crimp thing still bugs me though.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: pro press vs sharkbite

              DB,

              I'm like you in that I am hard to convince the easy way is better but I have been proven wrong too many times.

              Mark
              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                This thread has certainly evolved. It went from "Should I buy a ProPress?" to "what is the composition of the elastomer seals we commonly refer to as rubber and how long will they last?"

                The first Q needed an accountant, the second an engineer (well, maybe, see my post in the jokes thread)
                "It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?" Bob D. 2006

                https://www.youtube.com/user/PowerToolInstitute

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                  Originally posted by Bob D. View Post
                  This thread has certainly evolved. It went from "Should I buy a ProPress?" to "what is the composition of the elastomer seals we commonly refer to as rubber and how long will they last?"

                  The first Q needed an accountant, the second an engineer (well, maybe, see my post in the jokes thread)
                  All relative to a decision prior to purchasing sharkbite or propress & it's accessories.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                    These both take all the fun and hard work out of plumbing. I would never use sharkbite, I use propress only when time calls for it.

                    I had a 4" water main, 150' long to the left, and 100' long to the right, no way to move the pipe up and down, it was on a trac supported 16' in the air, over a dock at a hospital.

                    It was 2 am when I cut into it, I lined everything up, made my depth marks, sized up my pipe and crimped it, with water coming out. Never could have brazed it, unless I used a jet sweat in 4" and 2 ball valves.

                    Sharkbite, we'll let the homeowners use them.
                    sigpic

                    Robert

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                      Originally posted by westcoastplumber View Post
                      Sharkbite, we'll let the homeowners use them.

                      Exactly what I say.
                      I've tried 'em for baseboard...but would just as soon stick with Wirsbo

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                        Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
                        Exactly what I say.
                        I've tried 'em for baseboard...but would just as soon stick with Wirsbo

                        In my opinion, I think wirsbo, reahau and propress is where it should have stopped.

                        Now they have compression ball valves plastic push on fittings (I can't remember the name, saw them at the supply house) and sharkbite

                        I am only 28, but still an "old timer", I believe solder is the best way, on L Copper, nothing less, and ProPress, if the job really calls for it.

                        Just my opinion
                        sigpic

                        Robert

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                          lol...a month ago I was at HD grabbing some minor stock...stopped to look at the Shark Bite stuff...
                          Some guy walks up and says "Those things are fantastic!"
                          I say "I'll let you put 'em in and be the guinea pig."
                          He says "I do my own plumbing and I'm telling they work great!...I especially like the Shark Bite valves."
                          I say "I've seen 'em leak if any torque is put on them, if you put any twisting movement."
                          He says "You don't know what you're talking about...I been using these for at least a year now."
                          Suddenly occured to me to shut up n' let'm win....future service calls there.
                          Who knows...maybe they turn out to be the best thing since the wheel...but I bet they said that about quest and PB too when they came out.

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                          • #28
                            Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                            My question, although off topic, is are the pro press fittings able to be removed without harming the pipe?
                            How long will the o ring seal last?

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                              Originally posted by ChrisConnor View Post
                              My question, although off topic, is are the pro press fittings able to be removed without harming the pipe?
                              How long will the o ring seal last?

                              chris, a very simple answer. the propress fitting can be removed prior to crimping. once crimped it can be rotated slightly and re crimped, but never removed.

                              propress fittings slide onto the pipe like butter. that's why a marker is needed to mark the insertion depth to make sure it didn't slide back prior to crimping.

                              the o-ring / fitting has a 50 year manufactures warranty.

                              look at the "viega" website.

                              rick.
                              phoebe it is

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: pro press vs sharkbite

                                50 years sounds nice, but there are alot of hollow warranties out there. I don't want a six dollar part to cause an insurance claim and all they do is send me another six dollar part. knowhatimean?

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