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  • Gas press fittings

    Good evening everyone. I admit immediately to being totally lazy because I didnt search for previous threads but I feel a little justified in starting this question all over.
    You guys in the States are lucky as you have had press fittings for what to us seems forever. You have the good fortune of having used it for longer than us. So to my point. Today I had a discussion with a rep about their gas fittings. Seems our Regulator, a public service mob made of TEFLON(nothing sticks to them especially decisons and responsibility) has in their wisdom been knocking back some installations. I havent got the full story but they are questioning the integrity when exposed to heat. One install was a gas line over a metal roof. They say the temperature could be increased with radiance and could compromise the seals. The other was in a commercial kitchen. I believe that to get around this the contractor put insulation around the pipe(which seems a little strange from the hygiene side as well as promoting the retention of heat).
    Now our Regulator has gone back to the suppliers and said that they must give the documentation to support the use of pressfit. So we are several years down the trck learning more and more every day and no one can answer the questions raised because they are all scared of litigation. our license here dictates that we are responsible for our own work including choice of fittings and fixtures etc. can you guys give us some help here with where you use or more to the point are allowed to use the gas fittings. this is more for our benefit and as we generally know as much or even more than our regulators maybe we can be forewarned. Any help appreciated as per usual and thankyou in advance.............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • #2
    Re: Gas press fittings

    Below is a Submittal sheet. Unless the gas inside the Pipe is over 180 degrees F, then you should be OK. HAHAHAHA!. I have talked to the reps and manufacturer about this many times. The roof would have to a 1000 degrees F, before failure happens. They have tested it. We have the same issues up here, and there are plumbers and inspectors everywhere that Kick and Scream at some of this stuff. I understand. Over 23 years in this business and there have and will be more things that I use that FAIL. We are all in one big experiment (LIFE), but I will say this about the Press systems. I trust it any day, over some of the threading issues, we have seen. I don't know who, if anyone is teaching these guys in North texas to Plumb, but They don't know what they are doing. We had a house the other day with 6 gas leaks in the attic. House was only 10 years old. I don't care what the manufacturer of the PIPE Compound companies say, and I don't care what any STATE Board says, and I don't care what any other PLUMBER SAYS. Use TEFLON TAPE and PIPE COMPOUND on the JOINT, and Check your Threads on every JOB. Cut your thread. Hand tighten it, and then take it off, It should come of in your hand in about 3.5 turns. If the thread rips. RE-CUT it. Use Common Sense, If something doesn't feel like it went together right. Do it OVER. I don't care that it passed inspection. PEOPLE ARE DYING!

    Submittal
    Package
    System Data Sheet
    System Description
    Viega MegaPress and MegaPressG are safe, reliable, and economical steel pipe installation systems that use modern cold press connection technology for a wide assortment of more than 200 fittings in dimensions ranging from 1⁄2" to 2".
    Pipe: Schedule 5 to schedule
    40 Black steel pipe from 1⁄2" to 2" for Viega MegaPress. Schedule 40 black pipe for Viega MegaPressG.
    Viega Smart Connect feature: By means of the Smart Connect feature on Viega MegaPress Systems fittings, an unpressed connection can be recognized by escaping water, or by a drop in pressure, when testing the system. Fitting connections without the Smart Connect feature may not leak initially; however, later they can unseat during system operations. When the fitting is pressed, the Smart Connect feature is reformed and a permanent, sealed, non- detachable, mechanical connection is created. Other systems without the Smart Connect feature may not leak initially; however, later they can unseat in future system operations. The Smart Connect feature is designed to protect from the potential risk of unpressed fittings.
    Applications
    All piping must comply with the ASTM A53, A195, A795 and A106 standards. Viega MegaPress and MegaPressG fittings are approved for installations in both above and below ground applications. Per code, local inspector approval must be obtained prior to installation below ground.
    Operating Temperatures:
    Viega MegaPress: 0°F - 250°F Viega MegaPressG: -40F - 180F
    Approved Applications:
    • Hydronic heat
    • Chilled water
    • Compressed Air
    • Non Medical Gases • Fire Sprinkler
    • Low Pressure Steam • Vacuum
    • Natural Gas
    • LP Gas
    • Fuel Oil
    System Benefits
    • Fast and Easy to Use
    • Flameless
    • Permanent Connections
    • Wide Capacity from 1⁄2" to 2" • Large Selection of Fittings
    • Consistent
    Professional Appearance • Less Equipment Required • Environmentally Friendly
    Connection System
    • Versatility of Fittings and Tools
    for Variety of Applications
    Fittings
    Viega MegaPress and MegaPressG fittings are offered in 200+ configurations including: Elbows, Couplings, Reducers, Tees, Reducing Tees, Threaded Adapters and Unions.
    Tools
    RIDGID offers pressing tools for connecting MegaPress fittings. • 330-C Corded Tool (1⁄2" to 2") • 330-B Battery powered Tool
    (1⁄2" to 2") • 320-E
    • CT-400
    • 1⁄2" to 4" fittings are pressed
    in 4-7 sec.
    History
    Press technology has been used in Europe since the late 1980s and in the U.S. since the late 1990s for a variety of applications. Backed by two plumbing leaders with over 175 years of combined excellence.
    Approvals and Certificates CSA LC 4
    TSSA/ASME B31
    Compliant with
    • ICC International Plumbing Code
    • ICC International Mechanical Code • UPC Uniform Plumbing Code
    • UMC Uniform Mechanical Code
    • International Fuel Gas Code
    • NFPA 13,13D, 13R, 31, 54 and 58 • ASME B31
    Contact your local Viega representative for details on local approvals
    For more information on RIDGID products contact:
    Ridge Tool Company
    400 Clark Street, Elyria, Ohio 44036 Demos, Literature: 800-769-7743 Technical inquiries: 800-519-3456 Availability: 888-743-4333
    Web: RIDGID Professional Tools Plumbing Pipe Pressing Locating Hand Woodworking Power Diagnostic Tools
    RIDGID Pressing Tools
    Model
    330C
    330B
    Volts
    120v
    14.4v Battery
    Amps
    5.2A
    27.2A
    Weight (w/out jaw)
    9 lbs.
    10 lbs.
    Viega... The global leader in plumbing, heating and pipe joining systems
    301 N. Main, 9th Floor • Wichita, KS 67202 • Ph: 800-976-9819 • Fax: 316-425-7618 • Viega | Sanitary and heating systems, Drinking water, Design
    "don't put that in your mouth, you don't know where it's been"

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Gas press fittings

      Jay thankyou. I agree that one of the main problems is what we are teaching our "kids'. down here we dont thread joints for gas or water any more. Also we as far as I know we dont have approval down here for pressing steel nor does anyone do it anyway(pipe in Aussies if I am wrong but.........!!!!). Most of what is going on is our regulators are scared to "DO THEIR JOB" because they too have been the result of poor education and "poor trainers". Our knowlege set has depreciated that far it is obscene. I question why we have a regulator at all as they hide behind their email requests to the Manuffacturers so they can "SHIFT BLAME" instead of working to advance the industyr as our forefathers did before us. As professionals here I would suggest that we are all more than happy to apply our knowlege in this trade and stand behind the decisions we make. So why do we need regulators?? Besides keeping an eye on hacks and others they really dont do a lot. We have presented cases to the regulators who then bottle-it and run away and hide.
      Viega recently took offence to a suggestion that their product was inferior to which they were actually reading the quote incorrectly. I think it is a good product but we are lacking the knowlege base here to help with questions and discussions like I have started here. Again you guys are so fortunate because you have many things that we are lacking, essentially knowlege. It is commendable to say the least the way this community comes together and helps. Thankyou

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Gas press fittings

        Your concerns regarding heat and joint integrity are worthy of consideration. Jay's comments are reassuring. As for threaded fittings; I'd say even the most careful installer will eventually have a leak due to either faulty fittings. I've had fittings that make up perfectly and still leak. Taken apart and inspected they looked great, no cracks, no torn or crossed threads on pipe or fitting. Little consolation for the cost of the repair.
        Here's Viega's 10 year warranty
        http://www.viega.net/cps/rde/xbcr/en...s_Warranty.pdf

        Coincidentally, one of my plumbers (with 20 years experience) was our first to try out Mega Press G earlier this week. After one joint, he texted me saying he was sold.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Gas press fittings

          Cleanman, if you're going to have any luck getting new products into your country, you need to get the manufacturers on board to lobby your townships. They have the documnetation and data to show to your board of regulators. It takes time and money to complete the approval. Sometimes lawsuits.

          California can be the first in the country to demand better standards and environmental concerns. But we can also be the last to adopt what the rest of the usa already uses. Fortunately we as a state have tremendous purchasing influence and the manufacturers see this a hurdle that needs to get approval.

          If the plumbers can rally viega to get the ball rolling, its just a matter of time before the regulators are faced with political pressure oor a lawsuit.

          Keep up the pressure. Rally all your plumbers and supply houses. They will get the attention of viega and viega will respond.

          Rick
          phoebe it is

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Gas press fittings

            Rick I hear you loud and clear. problem that we are just running into now is that the Regulators allowed the Viega and similar systems into the marketplace and then all of a sudden got the "spineless" wont make a decision and have taken fright with the system. Now they are not coming out and blanket banning the systems but they have quietly put the scares back on the manufacturers to "re-prove" the system. What gets me in the neck is how gutless our regulators are in that they smell a bit of responsibility and they run away like scared kids. Now I do know that we have a similar system which is Stainless Steel which, if you read Viega they have similar overseas too, and this manufacturer has got approval for use with fire-services. We have another which is introducing approved fittings for solar systems and steam which I am a little nervous about but will wait for the literature) and they are standing behind their products, real old time gutsy effort I say. So I say what about the Regulator. I appears that they are sitting back and letting the manufacturers do all the work which can be dangerous especially when inferior operators(read what you will about this comment) cry foul and use the discimination card to get their cheaper trash into the market just like so many other products have up till now.
            I started this thread hopefully to gain from whoever would contribute some ideas of whether you guys face the same confusion that we are now facing through an ineffective Regulator and system. Sorry to be such a confusing forum member. I think part of me says that if we have similar circumstances overseas then we have a heads up on arguing when teh case surfaces or at least help support the suppliers/manufacturers. I was a sceptic at first with pressing systems but I quietly embrace more and more and enjoy the support shown here. Australia is supposed to be a growing Nation yet we have regulators without spines who are scared of decisions. I wish I could earn that much money without responsibility

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Gas press fittings

              A few years back, we had a similar issue just in california with pex tubing for domestic water use. Not pex for hydronics. The rest of the country had approval of pex for potable water, but california was a holdout. It wasn't until the pex manufacturers filed a lawsuit that pex was allowed back into calif. For potable use. There was a few year period prior that it was allowed, before the ban.

              My understanding was the union rallied the governing board to ban pex as it was too fast of a product and didn't require real skill. Same bs excuse why up until the late 70s we union plumbers couldn't use all thread rod to hang our pipes. We had to cut and thread our rod with no more than an inch of running thread. All in an attempt to create more labor and more expense.

              The same thing happened with csst, but for a much shorter period of time.

              You could always throw all your tea into Sydney harbor worked for us way back

              Or you could move west, I'm sure I have an extra truck with a propress and k60 with your name on it

              Rick.
              phoebe it is

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Gas press fittings

                Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                Or you could move west, I'm sure I have an extra truck with a propress and k60 with your name on it
                Rick.
                Rick
                Moving east would get him here faster.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Gas press fittings

                  I have seen a little bit about your Union School and dont know much more than what I have seen. Rick I agree with the sentiments about reduced level of skill for these products. The Unions here are too busy politically and covering up their corruption(oops did I say the C-word??????). It just gets me in the neck how the Regulator flip-flops around saying yes one minute and then I am not sure need information the next.
                  Down here they have a training centre that was set up to be similar to your Union school but as per usual the pigs got their snouts in the trough and are using it as a cash-cow. Training is reported to be first-rate, didnt say quality. Many of the programs are total BS with massive costs.
                  Now our regulators are directly involved with the training college making money out of it too. Back in the old days I wouldnt need to ask a question like this especially in a forum environment becasue our regulator had laboratories that they used to try and approve, or reject for that matter, products and processes.
                  The only other thing that amazes me is that Viega and others have got their products approved through the "Australian Standards" which is perceived to be the reference point for the Regulators. And you guys thought you had a patent on confusion.............!!!!!!!!!!!!

                  Comment

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