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  • #46
    Re: Sharktech Seminar

    Originally posted by ArizonaPlumber View Post
    Rick,
    How can you have traveled around the world, when the earth is flat?
    that's what old school would want you to think.

    new school discovered it was round.

    rick.
    phoebe it is

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Sharktech Seminar

      Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
      I've traveled around the world and have seen it myself. propress is here to stay and so are push fittings. so is csst, pex, and just about every new product since gal pipe, lead pipe and cast iron pipe.
      You forgot polybutylene

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Sharktech Seminar

        I woke up to this?! Personally I love clay pipe. Gets roots in there and every 2 years I come in and make it look like new. As for the sharkbites...I think they're a bad idea as a whole. I think selling them is a numbers game.....get enough sold to cover the defective one. This is the analogy I told Rick yesterday......

        A city boy, Kenny, moved to the country and bought a donkey from an old farmer for $100.00. The farmer agreed to deliver the donkey the next day.

        The next day the farmer drove up and said, "Sorry son, but I have some bad news, the donkey died last night."

        Kenny: "Well then, just give me my money back."

        Farmer: "Can't do that. I went and spent it already."

        Kenny: "OK then, just unload the donkey.."

        Farmer: "What are you going to do with this dead donkey?"

        Kenny: "I'm going to raffle him off."

        Farmer: "You can't raffle off a dead donkey!"

        Kenny: "Sure I can. Watch me. I just won't tell anybody he's dead."

        A month later the farmer met up with Kenny and asked,
        "What happened with that dead donkey?"

        Kenny: "I raffled him off. I sold 500 tickets at two dollars a piece and made a profit of $898.00."

        Farmer: "Didn't anyone complain?"

        Kenny: "Just the guy who won. So I gave him back his two dollars."

        Those sharkbites are the dead donkey.
        Buy cheap, buy twice.

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Sharktech Seminar

          That was priceless Ben.

          Bob: some towns in my area will not allow PVC due to unstable subsoil. I have seen glued joints shear right off.
          I too have camera'd clay lines that are 100+ years old with no roots and not issues. Others are root filled. Seen the same on cast iron and SDR 26/35 push gaskets. A lot has to do with installation. Rip a gasket, oakum not packed well, overview under pour of lead (old school), sloppy mortar joints.... For a while there was clay with push gaskets. I did a repair on a 30 y/o one last month. Repair mostly due to lack of proper bedding of pipe. Every area is different. Not every plumber follows instructions or codes on installation (most don't actually). Any pipe system is only as good as the installation........

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Sharktech Seminar

            Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
            that's what old school would want you to think.

            new school discovered it was round.

            rick.
            Exactly!!!

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Sharktech Seminar

              Bingo!!

              Originally posted by Swade Plumbing View Post

              Bob: some towns in my area will not allow PVC due to unstable subsoil. I have seen glued joints shear right off.
              I too have camera'd clay lines that are 100+ years old with no roots and not issues. Others are root filled. Seen the same on cast iron and SDR 26/35 push gaskets. A lot has to do with installation. Rip a gasket, oakum not packed well, overview under pour of lead (old school), sloppy mortar joints.... For a while there was clay with push gaskets. I did a repair on a 30 y/o one last month. Repair mostly due to lack of proper bedding of pipe. Every area is different. Not every plumber follows instructions or codes on installation (most don't actually). Any pipe system is only as good as the installation........

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Sharktech Seminar

                Originally posted by ArizonaPlumber View Post
                Exactly!!!
                Simple question: Which is old school & new school between clay and PVC drainage?

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Sharktech Seminar

                  Originally posted by Swade Plumbing View Post
                  That was priceless Ben.

                  Bob: some towns in my area will not allow PVC due to unstable subsoil. I have seen glued joints shear right off.
                  I too have camera'd clay lines that are 100+ years old with no roots and not issues. Others are root filled. Seen the same on cast iron and SDR 26/35 push gaskets. A lot has to do with installation. Rip a gasket, oakum not packed well, overview under pour of lead (old school), sloppy mortar joints.... For a while there was clay with push gaskets. I did a repair on a 30 y/o one last month. Repair mostly due to lack of proper bedding of pipe. Every area is different. Not every plumber follows instructions or codes on installation (most don't actually). Any pipe system is only as good as the installation........
                  I completely believe it. There are "old school" idiot towns & enforcement around the world.

                  Unstable subsoil. Interesting. You have areas that are moving all over the place 4" or more all the time shearing PVC glued joints? And because this clay piping is installed it completely resolves this issue? No cracking, bellying, off-setting of joints?

                  I can't say I've seen everything. That would make me some egotistical a-hole. I've seen a good amount of things though.

                  Damaged clay. Root filled clay. CLEAN & CLEAR clay.

                  Damaged CI. Root filled CI. Sludged up CI. Scaled CI. And CLEAN & CLEAR CI.

                  Damage Concrete/Asbestos, Root filled Concrete, Offsets, Cracks, and Breaks. Not much clean and clear. Usually falling apart or always blocked.

                  Damaged Orangeburg. Sludgey OB. Ovaled OB. Bellyed OB. Broken joint OB. CLEAN & CLEAR OB!

                  Damage PVC. Ovaled (Cheap Thin Wall) PVC, Broken/Sheared joint PVC, Bellyed PVC, CLEAN & CLEAR PVC.

                  Damaged ABS, Broken ABS, Broken/Sheared joint ABS, Bellyed ABS, CLEAN & CLEAR ABS.

                  Some Ductile Iron. Not too many problems there in the ones I ran into. But, honestly, it's been so rare for me that I can't have a good opinion.

                  Some other wood log I forgot.

                  With all that mumbo jumbo above, what you are looking for is overall performance & averages. For the majority of residential areas and people PVC is far superior to clay. In comparison, clay is garbage that drain cleaners love 'cause they can make a lot of money over and over by maintaining the old school junk. Some of it is because of things you note. Poor installation. Overall though, it's more inferior product as inferior installation.

                  Just like Gear Junkie said-He loves it. They have to call him every 2 or 3 years to clean it up. Think that would be happening if he lived in an area where every sewer within a 25 mile radius had PVC installed? No way. Not gonna' happen. Because PVC is such a superior product in comparison.

                  There are people on these forums in various parts of the U.S. that only do drains in the majority. No secret why. Older, crumbling infrastructures. Population density. And inferior installation. Both in product and method just as you say. That gives them a good turnover.

                  You can move to mine and other areas though, have a trailer jetter, cart jetter, a few cable machines, cameras, and truck paid for, $10,000.00 in your pocket with zero debt. Then plan to do nothing but drains and I'll watch you go bankrupt in a year.

                  And that 100 year old clay line with no roots or issues. If it were PVC it would have zero issues either. And you probably wouldn't know it because you wouldn't have been there to camera it because there would be no reason too.

                  Clay is old school garbage. Don't get left behind. lol.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Sharktech Seminar

                    Are we talking about servicing existing pvc and clay or installing it new?

                    David

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Sharktech Seminar

                      Originally posted by Dhal22 View Post
                      Are we talking about servicing existing pvc and clay or installing it new?

                      David
                      I don't understand this question.

                      Servicing properly installed existing PVC in residents is less necessary and easier in the majority.

                      New residential installations should not be clay in most cases. Should be PVC.

                      Probably in the majority for commercial as well. (I know about expansion & contraction rates, combustibles, etc. in commercial along with story height coming into play for the DWV. I'm talking about standard sewer without any high heat or chemical reactions.)

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Sharktech Seminar

                        I was not defending or advocating clay for new installs. The town I mentioned that does not allow PVC requires cast with push gaskets or ductile iron. They prefer non-shear couplings for all. My point was that PVC has it's problems too. Rare to see schedule 40 PVC here for building drains. Mostly SDR 26 or 35 (green pipe with gaskets)

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